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Coaches and Starting Strength by Nell Worthingman - Tue, 16 Jan 2018 09:59:24 EST ID:E/CSqr54 No.94622 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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tl;dr: My gym coach/instructor won't help me with the form of Starting Strength exercises. I'll be in this gym only for one month, will I be losing time for doing only what he thinks is the best for me?

He's really into machine exercises mostly, some dumbells for arms and shoulders. I want to commit to SS as I'm skinny af and need a proper introduction into the world of using-your-body-in-a-proper-manner.

If I follow whatever he says to me, even if for only 1 or 1 + 1/2 month, will that hurt my progress if only after this I start SS? I'll change gym because I'll go back to the city where I work and there continue this journey. When talking to the coach of the next gym, I'll try to convice him using better methods.
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Ebenezer Chankingold - Tue, 16 Jan 2018 12:53:40 EST ID:sphKrH3y No.94624 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>94622
If you know best why get a coach?

But seriously, learn how to use the machines, get pointers on form then go your own way if you don't like what they're doing.

There are a couple of things which challenge more muscles with dumbells as it's harder to stabilise two weights at once than a bar but if you don't like what your instructor is teaching you won't stick with it and won't engage. Do bear in mind you are not an expert even though you've seen this routine and bought into it entirely. It's got a good rep mind you, but the question is does his routine engage a wide range of muscles and motions? It won't be a complete waste of time unless he's got some utter bullshit routine that's a test of endurance.

Also eat properly. If you're really skinny you need to also ensure you have the food to ensure growth or that exercise will just burn muscle to fuel it. You don't need a massive surplus but enough to cover the exercise and then a bit more for growth. If you're not losing weight or getting fat then it's likely whatever he chucks at you will help. It won't hurt your progress you will not get weaker or gain anti strength, you'll just be progressing slower than you want or perhaps developing strength or certain abilities you're not bothered by and not gaining as much in others. And that assumes his routine actually sucks.
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Cedric Blackcocke - Tue, 16 Jan 2018 19:13:19 EST ID:E/CSqr54 No.94625 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>94624

Nice reply. Thanks anon! I'll follow what he is saying, as he studied whatever it was to be there. I'm doing the best I can with the form, trying to do it slowly and if I can't last to the that one last rep, almost failing, I know it's good thing.

Thanks
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Alice Drengerlock - Sun, 28 Jan 2018 07:58:48 EST ID:uDZHW1X/ No.94653 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Your coach is a faggot, if he would show you all the SS exercises, then you will never use his coaching again. Therefore, he lets you do a shitload of unnecessary machine work that you don't need and that does not stimulate all the small muscles that you need to build a foundation of strength. Look up videos of Alan Thrall on youtube for form tutorials on the big lifts and please get rid of your coach and start Starting Strength.
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Swings Daily - Mon, 12 Feb 2018 00:36:21 EST ID:CeAkAoD7 No.94663 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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TL;DR
Machines are useless, unless you are rehabilitating and need assistance with stabilizing a load. Use Barbells, Dumbells, Kettlebells,Clubs and Maces. Even Calisthenics. Just not machines. Your Instructor sounds like he doesn't know what he is doing NOR like he is meeting your specific needs. Ill list a few good sources at the very bottom of post.

Rant:
Machine exercises are virtually useless. There are 3 axis of movement. X, Y and Z. This is going to get a little rambly, and simplified at times, but please bear with me.

X is the direction you wish to work to move a load or exert force. Y and Z are the forces you have to fight to stabilize the load you wish to move. In every real world application of strength, you are resisting Y and/or Z with your stabilizers, when you are both moving and static, along the X plane.

Machines hold you responsible for X work only. They completely eliminate Y and Z stabilization and also distort the load you are bearing through:

1) Pulley Systems
2) Neglecting Stabilizers

This means, that 100lb load will feel more like an 80lb-90lb load and will not prepare you to deal with a real 100lb load as you will not build stabilizer strength.

Barbells let you work against X and Z axis, but since you are anchored at 2 points along the Y axis, it is negated and you get some, but not all stabilization work. This is still good real-world work, since you will sometimes have 2 anchor points when utilizing strength outside of your conditioning.

Lastly, single anchor weights (sometimes can be used as dual anchor weights, as in 2 handed Mace or Kettle work) will give you the best bang for your buck. They not only allow you to work freely along the X,Y and Z planes, but can also be used for rotational work and uneven load work.

eg. when you arm curl a barbell your obliques don't have to work to keep your posture. When you arm curl a single dumbell (no dual wield) your obliques and other core stabilizers have to work to keep your spine aligned while you curl, since your shoulders will be pulled towards whichever side you are holding the bell, as well as the bell pulling the same side's shoulder forward, which you will resist with your rotational stabilizers. A barbell will pull both shoulders forward, but you miss out on fighting rotation and lean.

If you want real strength avoid machines at all costs.

Calisthenics (bodyweight) are good. Engage your WHOLE body when doing them.

Barbells also good. only having 1 direction to stabilize can let you lift heavier
weights while still getting in some stabilization good work.

Ketllebells, Dumbells, Clubs and Maces are best. They may not feel as rewarding because the weights are much lower, but the quality of work that you get done is superb. Especially useful if your strength goals are partially motivated by self-defense training.

If you want an example of how asymmetrical loads behave compared to symmetrical loads:

I have a 24kg (53lb) Kettlebell.
Even though it is only half of 106lbs, it is the same work stress as benchpressing a 125lb barbell.
My 32kg(71lb) kettlebell being pressed, provides the same stress as benchpressing roughly 165lbs barbell, rather than a 142lb barbell.
All while working a wider range of muscles than similar movements with symmetrical loads. plus they are much more convenient in my home gym for space and ease of moving.

Good Sources for using-your-body-in-a-proper-manner:

Pavel Tsatsouline; His book "the Naked Warrior" is a good beginners guide to Calisthenics and Using your body properly. It can be found with a simple google search of: "Naked Warrior PDF". His book Simple&Sinister is a good introduction to kettlebells and is a simple routine developed specifically for fighters. This one is a bit harder to find. Might have to Torrent if you don't want to buy it. I usually email it to friends/coworkers but I won't email it to you, nothing personal.

As for Mace/club work, check out the Onnit Academy's videos on their website and YouTube.

Good luck in your journey OP.
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Charles Harrybanks - Tue, 13 Feb 2018 17:48:27 EST ID:izuuHGLP No.94666 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>94663

i agree with everything you said except for recommending kettlebells and maces to a beginner. i think one should at least have a moderate foundation with barbells and dumbbells before progressing to the more awkward shapes to reduce chance of injury
>>
Cornelius Fuckingham - Wed, 14 Feb 2018 23:47:54 EST ID:4+458rlZ No.94667 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Machines are useless, do SS and fire your coach.

I also do online coaching ;)


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