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Lab equipment value by Priscilla Chebbersork - Mon, 18 Apr 2016 18:03:17 EST ID:5P3qbCIv No.77852 Ignore Report Reply Quick Reply
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How much would be a reasonable price to ask for a set of reagents and chemistry equipment listed below:
>Round bottom flasks: (one neck) 1000ml, (three neck) 250ml, (two neck) 100ml, (one neck) 50ml
>Flat bottom flasks: (one neck) 1000ml, 250ml, 100ml, 50ml
>Handheld vaccuum/pressure pump
>120mm Buchner funnel with fine glass frit
>Plastic volumetric flasks: 250ml (x10), 100ml (x10), 50ml (x10)
>Hotplate with magnetic stirring, in new condition
>Glass gas washing bottle
>200mm Vigreux condenser colum
>200mm Liebig condenser
>60mm glass petri dishes
>100mm plastic petri dishes (x10)
>2ml glass vials (x20)
>120mm glass mortar and pestle
>150mm glass funnel
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press !QUHukXEvkY - Tue, 19 Apr 2016 12:18:26 EST ID:xFG0CGS+ No.77853 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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what country do you live in?

if you live in germany or austria id recommend selling the glassware on ebay. that normally gets you an okay price, though you might have to bundle up the smaller stuff. you could compose "destillation sets", and sell the bigger flasks seperately.
depending on the brand you could get a hundred quids upwards for the hotplate

as you said, selling the reagents would be too much of a hassle
but if youre in europe id like to know who sold you the Pd/C.
id give you ten bucks for the Pd/C unless its still factory sealed.
Cornelius Pedgewell - Tue, 19 Apr 2016 13:50:28 EST ID:De32qNxz No.77854 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Just look up comparable stuff on ebay, but your most valuable piece is propably the 1l flasks because of hipster appeal and the stirrer.
All the other stuff i have seen for under 50eur
Selling reagents is not worth the trouble, no matter where you are, if its really legal theres no way to make a profit.

Id keep it tho, put it in storage and wait until you can use it again. Anyone who owns such a collection wont give up on the work forever, not for a woman.

Pure Oxycodone Synthesis - My Tek by Bombastus !!HToBa9dh - Sun, 10 May 2015 19:27:27 EST ID:4ppVjZXo No.76494 Ignore Report Reply Quick Reply
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This was my old one. I'll post it up here in case anyone is interested/ can make corrections on it.
If you want clarification on anything, let me know. The hydrogenation (i think) will be the hardest part for any home chemist, let alone kitchen chemist.

The benefit of this synthesis is that it has no toxic chemicals, doesn't use chromate intermediates, and is made from relatively easy to acquire chemicals.
The downsides are that it requires a lot of chemical knowledge, knowledge on desiccant formations, and is much slower than the sodium dichromate method I have seen used (two refluxes that take up 24hours each are used)
Cod - Codeine
Codo - Codeinone
Oxo - Oxycodone

Workup of Aluminium Isopropoxide
In 250two neck RBF, set one neck up for reflux and one neck up for desiccation. Prepare a drying tube with CaCl2 and link it up to the vacuum adapter in the desiccation neck. Heat all the glassware to an ambient temperature of 80deg C upwards towards the allihn condenser. Proceed to blow air through the drying tube into the flask. Seal off the allihn condenser with a small amount of aluminium foil.
Desiccated aluminium dust (27.98g, 1.00mol) is ground to remove oxide layer and HgCl2 (0.01g) was added. The metal semi-amalgam is added to the bottom of the flask and desiccated isopropanol (250ml, 3.30mol) is injected carefully into the vacuum adapter septum. The vessel is left to reflux for 4 hours.
While still on reflux, the allihn condenser is removed and a 3-way adapter with a thermometer adapter is quickly added. The vacuum is attached to the receiver joint of the 3-way with a one neck 250 RBF while stoppering the side arm of the two neck flask tightly. A distillation is run until only solid aluminium dust remains in the still flask.
A yield of 80% of 1mol aluminium isopropoxide (163.4g) should be achieved.
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Archie Habberway - Sun, 03 Apr 2016 13:50:55 EST ID:gY/8T8H5 No.77795 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Didn't understand what you meant with using the concentrated HCl though. I prefer sulphuric acid as it is easiest to get reagent grade.
Archie Habberway - Sun, 03 Apr 2016 13:54:25 EST ID:gY/8T8H5 No.77796 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Fuck me. Obviously you meant codeine not concentrated. Sorry cannot delete posts I am flooding the thread fuckk.
Ru-lover - Thu, 14 Apr 2016 15:48:37 EST ID:1yz9Gpwk No.77834 Ignore Report Quick Reply

New isomerization was tried ! With my favorite element Ruthenium black !

***Codeine extraction***

28x60mg of codeine pills with only lactose as excipient are crushed up and dissolved into 20ml dH2O. After a few hours, the suspension is filtered, the filtrate is stirred with 50ml CH2Cl2 and the aqueous phase is made strongly basic with conc NaOH. The aquesous phase immediatly turned to milky white. The two phase system is stirred for 2h. The organic phases is separated and the aqueous one is extracted with 2x50ml CH2Cl2. The org phases are combined, dried over Na2SO4 and rotavapored. After vaccum the oily residue crystallised to for white crystals. Yield 1.25g of codeine freebase from 1.68 g codeine phosphate.


The residue (1.25g codeine freebase) is added into a solution of 2.5 ml H2SO4 2M and 5ml dH2O (H2SO4 0.75 M). The crystals dissolves up on heating to 60-70 °C. 30 mg Ruthenium black is added and the black suspension is refluxed overnight under argon athmosphere. Next day, the ruthenium is filtered on the frit, washed with water and recovered for future use. The slightly yellow filtrate is basified with conc NaOH. The light brown precipitate that immediatly appears is filtered on the frit, washed with dH2O and air dried. The combined filtrate are extracted with 3x50 ml CH2Cl2. After drying and rotavaporing the tan powder are combined and weighed around 1.1g of hydrocodone.

1) Argon athmosphere doesn't seem to be necessairy here, it matters to try without tough.
2) Reaction Time could probably be shorter, TLC is required to determinate the end of the reaction
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Bombastus !RZEwn1AX62!!xXxJO70U - Thu, 14 Apr 2016 21:23:54 EST ID:V1Ngvki3 No.77838 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Were your filtrates needles or flakes? Also, why were you fixated on ruthenium once more? i have found that palladium works equally and is easier to locate
sorry if you've already answered. uh

Patents never have precise concentrations. They dont' need to. The papers I've found have used codeine HCl with 0.48M sulfuric acid
In my computer projections, because of the catalytic amount needed, I've used down to 0.5M of sulphuric acid with the same yield. it actually got so fucking stupid that I would weigh out a 5ml graduated cylinder, pour sulphuric acid into it, pour it out, then measure the weight of the residual sulfuric acid. then add 5ml of water and calculate the W/V molar mass of the subsequent liquid.
It's silly.

The only issue is that you have to calculate the codeine <-> sulfuric acid acid:base reaction if you're using freebase.

Why are you using deuterated water again?

When it comes to times, my computer projections have never had a TLC monitoring program because it literally happens incredibly quickly. I've gotten the number down to 90 minutes of refluxing and took it off with two separations (one being caffeine, one being co).
Ru-lover - Fri, 15 Apr 2016 18:31:31 EST ID:1yz9Gpwk No.77843 Ignore Report Quick Reply

In the method its some kind of amorphous crystals or rather more flake-like than needles.

Method with palladium was done a long time ago but did not work out well : dark brown color and several unknown spots. I thought the method was not working well (in fact it was probably too concentrated H2SO4 and long reaction time that destroy the compound in that old method) and I was reading plenty of patent about ruthenium catalyst. You already tried successfully with Pd, so I decided to post the method of ruthenium ;)

In the method dH2O means distilled water, not deuterated.

Ruthenium seems here to be more active than Pd, you need less Ru per g of cod. Did you try other computer projections with a smaller Pd/cod ratio ?

Do you have the solvent infos and TLC rf of cod and HC ?

Do you think the reaction work by skipping the pill extraction, just by dissolving the pills with excipients in H2SO4 and refluxing with Pd or Ru ?

By the way, as you post a method about oppenhauer oxidation of cod I'd like to point out I was reading a patent and I found an interesting oppenhauer oxidation of DHC to cod at ambian temperature with tBuOK/benzophenone in cyclohexane here :
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Coefficient of drag of runners and cyclists by Polly Gippernere - Thu, 14 Apr 2016 12:27:35 EST ID:DtZ5lIsF No.77833 Ignore Report Reply Quick Reply
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At what speed (MPH or KPH) does aerodynamic drag become a factor for various items?

I know that for automobiles drag becomes a factor when you're in the 30-40mph ballpark, but what about bicyclists or runners? It's easier to determine the coefficient of drag of, say, an airplane or a car because they're (more or less) static objects, but a cyclist moves their legs and a runner moves their legs and arms.

I'm wondering about this because when I'm on a stationary bike, I'm able to pedal faster with more power when I'm in the typical forward fold versus when I'm pedaling upright-- aerodynamic forces are pretty well negated in this case. The same thing goes for running-- if I'm jogging upright on a treadmill versus leaning forward, I produce more power and speed when I'm leaning forward because my center of gravity has shifted-- but does leaning forward provide any specific aerodynamic benefit for anyone who isn't running as fast as Usain Bolt?
Nell Hagglestat - Sun, 17 Apr 2016 15:28:41 EST ID:6SGTYI6Z No.77850 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Sounds like a difficult question to answer, but if you're running on a treadmill then do aerodynamics even matter? It seems like they wouldn't compared to normal running.

The Manhatton project is why the Pryamids are really real by Hugh Penningforth - Sat, 06 Feb 2016 22:12:47 EST ID:NPo+K9eR No.77626 Ignore Report Reply Quick Reply
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If the whole society of America came together to create the A-Bomb and that was an endeavor of a whole society , what evidence of the same thing could be used to disprove that aliens built the Pyramids?
2 posts omitted. Click Reply to view.
Betsy Dodgepeck - Mon, 08 Feb 2016 21:45:59 EST ID:YhREOUdy No.77638 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>if they had to place blocks in a serial fashion, just one at a time

Well good thing they had enough manpower (thousands upon thousands of slaves) to place a bunch of blocks at a time, then!
press !QUHukXEvkY - Tue, 09 Feb 2016 12:42:23 EST ID:MD/oThse No.77643 Ignore Report Quick Reply
youre not much of a teamplayer, are you?
Sidney Fanworth - Fri, 12 Feb 2016 03:54:29 EST ID:X6HIP3d/ No.77651 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Mathematically you can only place one block of a pyramid at a time
Nigger Mucklepune - Sat, 13 Feb 2016 06:21:15 EST ID:+DZfgoAX No.77655 Ignore Report Quick Reply
There's a load of blocks on each layer so you'd be able to work from several different angles bring blocks in. You wouldn't even need to be placing adjacent blocks if you planned it right/on the higher levels. Of course as you go up and it gets narrower this slows down. But most of the blocks will be on the lower levels. You might be placing several remote blocks and joining them up for example. What am I missing?
Isabella Drundletetch - Mon, 11 Apr 2016 23:32:55 EST ID:VJYm4aCY No.77824 Ignore Report Quick Reply
YOU speak on many levels.

Hydrogenation without a pressured hydrogenator by Clara Chunderwun - Sun, 06 Mar 2016 19:24:22 EST ID:5P3qbCIv No.77713 Ignore Report Reply Quick Reply
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Can this be legit?
Refluxing codeine in an acidic medium with finely grounded Palladium without a hydrogen gas supply to Yield 85-95% of dihydrocodeinone?
Sounds too easy as anyone has an access to a simple refluxing setup, palladium metal, codeine and an acid. Also to my understanding dihydrocodeinone is a fuckload more potent than codeine...
15 posts and 4 images omitted. Click Reply to view.
James Sunkindale - Sun, 13 Mar 2016 18:28:07 EST ID:jIgmEPvp No.77744 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I have to correct myself straight away. I forgot that the volume of the balloon increases as it is filled so there hardly is any pressure in the system (I mean it is almost equal to the pressure outside the system).
But still: hydrogen gas present!
Bombastus !RZEwn1AX62!!xXxJO70U - Sat, 19 Mar 2016 10:05:14 EST ID:4ppVjZXo No.77756 Ignore Report Quick Reply
dihydrocodeinone is also called:

You never need a pressured hydrogenator. For the amateur, you can either use in-situ hydrazine or in-situ ammonia formate.
Actually, the hydrogen is generated in-situ. sue me.
Bombastus !RZEwn1AX62!!xXxJO70U - Sun, 20 Mar 2016 14:48:35 EST ID:vbS8CtHn No.77758 Ignore Report Quick Reply
The only way to separate codeine from hydrocodone is either to react all the codeine to hydrocodone.
Or alternatively, you could run a column on them.
press !QUHukXEvkY - Tue, 22 Mar 2016 15:35:02 EST ID:pAeUlupM No.77765 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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im paaaaaretty sure that crystallization would be sufficient -eventhough they have very similar- solubility as long as theres more product than educt. but then again a short glass tube and some alumina wouldnt cost the world. id have to guess that alumina would be better for the seperation since the codeine is a tad more polar and since sillica tends to fuck with amines. im also guessing it easier to buy and cheaper at a reasonable mesh.

id try and prove my point had i been smart enough to get some Pd/C and if codeine werent sceduled in this shithole.
Ru-lover - Mon, 11 Apr 2016 15:50:28 EST ID:XzFsS2/x No.77823 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Try extraction of the HCodo with bisufite solution. Then crystallise out the HCodo with NaOH.

What have I got here? by Priscilla Duggleson - Sun, 03 Apr 2016 20:58:07 EST ID:SVefPavO No.77797 Ignore Report Reply Quick Reply
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I stumbled upon this bunch of labware from this old dude I've been working for. I'm not sure what all the components are. Aside from basic college chemistry and a couple DMT extractions, I'm pretty much a layman in the chemistry field. But I hope to do something with it, or at least know what its all used for. Any of you science types able to help me identify these?
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Eugene Heblingford - Tue, 05 Apr 2016 02:52:06 EST ID:5P3qbCIv No.77806 Ignore Report Quick Reply
By the way, how much pressure do you think those cheap ebay china round bottom flasks can hold without exploding? I assume that there is a quality difference because of the low price but how much different?
Obviously not asking the specific value but just thinking about vaccuum distillations and maybe (semi)low pressure hydrogenations etc. Do you guys think a joint will pop off before the glass goes boom?
Talking about the stuff you can find from ebay when searching for "chemistry kit" and which is shipped from china or hongkong. Are they just shit? At least they claim its high quality borosilicate glass but...
press !QUHukXEvkY - Tue, 05 Apr 2016 10:55:57 EST ID:YuS+YrwH No.77807 Ignore Report Quick Reply
my old uni scripts from vienna stated the maximum pressure at 1,5 bar.
i have no idea how reliable specific chinese vendors are. there are some that do solid work and then there are a lot of fuckers that just want to let the capitalists bleed. ill try to find a shematic

youll have to use good clamps. and i recommend using a security net or an improvised blast shield, combined with a tub to catch any spills.

depending on much pressure youll want to use, you could also construct a pressure regulator akin to a pneumatic trough, but thats for itty bitty pressures- these fuckers are better for estimating hydrogen uptake anyways if all one can get is a ghetto pressure meter
Archie Finningtot - Wed, 06 Apr 2016 07:38:18 EST ID:SVefPavO No.77811 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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Thanks for the input guys. It looks like i've got a decent setup for clandestine chemistry, its a shame that I probably wont be able to put it to full use. Would some of this be easy/lucrative to sell on CL or something? I have a second separatory funnel and a stand as well that I didn't picture.

I got all this stuff for free, it was just sitting in this guys attic collecting dust and rat shit. If i don't sell it, I'll likely incorporate it into a mixed media art piece, or maybe make molds of some parts and cast copies in ceramic.
press !QUHukXEvkY - Wed, 06 Apr 2016 12:09:50 EST ID:YuS+YrwH No.77812 Ignore Report Quick Reply
isnt lab glassware considered drug paraphenilia or something like that in some parts of the us? i cant recall, maybe im just paranoid

check CL and ebay for an idea of how much you can charge.
i guess you could easily get a hundred bucks, maybe more if you play your cards right and arent in a rush. i have no idea how negiotiating on CL works though
Ian Claydock - Sun, 10 Apr 2016 14:59:36 EST ID:roMD3xgx No.77820 Ignore Report Quick Reply

Chemists are witches out to stir up trouble in the public with their evil craft.

I want to see what the poop sees by Whitey Sungerford - Wed, 24 Feb 2016 15:48:51 EST ID:ANui6f84 No.77694 Ignore Report Reply Quick Reply
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How can I turn shit into enegergy I was thinking like a 3 meter dome, shiphon the shit from the sewer before those basteds that fired me from the sewage plant can get there dirty hands all over it, the pretty much lite the gas on fire and covert a diesel generator to take gas, how would one do that?
Henry Niggerway - Fri, 26 Feb 2016 17:18:42 EST ID:erzI3/TD No.77697 Ignore Report Quick Reply
You're probably joking, but this is actually somewhat feasible. Decomposing shit releases methane which is flammable. If you can capture it you can burn it for energy. However, methane isn't particularly well behaved, so it may not be all that feasible to get a internal combustion engine running well on it. You can probably get one running, but you're going to have leakage and damage to the seals because they were meant for a liquid not a very volitile gas.

I'd recommend burning the methane to produce heat, and boiling water with that heat, then forcing the steam from the boilers to go through a turbine.
press !QUHukXEvkY - Fri, 26 Feb 2016 18:36:42 EST ID:ax6SYN1K No.77698 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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that idea seems very familiar. almost as if its been out into practise for decades.
its a great way to put waste to use

Doris Shittingshaw - Tue, 15 Mar 2016 01:54:34 EST ID:6Uohuwu9 No.77747 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I cleaned my cleaner and now it's gone!
John Gebberwater - Fri, 08 Apr 2016 02:32:24 EST ID:sIdNWEOq No.77817 Ignore Report Quick Reply
That's like one time I splid spot remover on my dog and now he's gone... Lol

substitute by Nigel Tillingstock - Sat, 02 Apr 2016 19:43:27 EST ID:CVyPUaOx No.77791 Ignore Report Reply Quick Reply
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ok guys what could I use instead of palladium (II) chloride for catalisys?

this chemical is FUCKING expensive
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press !QUHukXEvkY - Mon, 04 Apr 2016 14:25:50 EST ID:YuS+YrwH No.77802 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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what are you trying to reduce?
i mean besides the costs.
Oliver Drinningway - Mon, 04 Apr 2016 17:49:10 EST ID:CVyPUaOx No.77804 Ignore Report Quick Reply
wacker oxidation for safrole (ot sure if black palladium could do the trick)
Bombastus !RZEwn1AX62!!xXxJO70U - Tue, 05 Apr 2016 02:21:59 EST ID:Ym/MkWsP No.77805 Ignore Report Quick Reply
nope. palladium black will not do the trick because it requires an oxidation cycle like the regular inert metal coupling reactions.

looks like you're stuck with palladium chloride or find another method.
Archie Hommlewater - Tue, 05 Apr 2016 20:55:49 EST ID:CVyPUaOx No.77810 Ignore Report Quick Reply
thanks for the response...will do
Ru-lover - Thu, 07 Apr 2016 13:52:58 EST ID:XzFsS2/x No.77813 Ignore Report Quick Reply
try to look on alibaba or other B2B, PdCl2 is 5-10x less expensive there than Sigma or other companies. PdCl2 is a well known product and purity is always good even it comes from china.

Reactions with Tosylates by Walter Miffingchure - Fri, 25 Mar 2016 04:51:42 EST ID:YfH8FcVI No.77768 Ignore Report Reply Quick Reply
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Out of curiosity, would it be possible to react a primary amine with a sulfonyl group (tosylate specifically) and then subsequently use a base followed by a nucleophilic substitution with, say, iodomethane to produce a secondary amine?
Walter Miffingchure - Fri, 25 Mar 2016 12:09:26 EST ID:YfH8FcVI No.77769 Ignore Report Quick Reply
OP here, never mind I solved the not-synthesis problem with the help of the internet and way too much goddamn adderall
Ru-lover - Wed, 30 Mar 2016 19:15:51 EST ID:1yz9Gpwk No.77778 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Yes you can. The sulfonyl group makes the H more acidic and thus easier to deprotonate. It also locks the nitrogen lone pair avoiding overalkylation.
yes - Tue, 05 Apr 2016 18:19:46 EST ID:AhXs56nn No.77808 Ignore Report Quick Reply
good anon - Tue, 05 Apr 2016 18:20:58 EST ID:AhXs56nn No.77809 Ignore Report Quick Reply

Help an unmotivated loser out by Polly Winnertid - Fri, 01 Apr 2016 15:00:53 EST ID:hqftNCGp No.77783 Ignore Report Reply Quick Reply
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I realise that this board is mostly used for instructions on how to make drugs in your fucking garage, but since this is also a science board I thought that I would ask you brilliant minds for help.
I have a upcoming project, spanning a year or so, that will entail/connect almost every course I am taking. I am supposed to pick something to create, experiment, etc. and present the result to my professor(s) and peers.
I have seen dudes investigate pharmacuticals, tried to treat salmonella by destroying its flagella with enzymes, etc.
What the hell am I supposed to do?
I might be given access to chemicals, but I do not want to make drugs, even though that would be sweet.
Alice Bicklechot - Fri, 01 Apr 2016 15:32:24 EST ID:NPdGYjgm No.77786 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Is there anything else than sweet sweet drugs that you are even slightly interested in? Preferably something to do with making the world a better place. Great grades coming easily if you do some shit to help african children or make an anti hangover pill.
Start with something not so specific that interests you, do some investigation and then get closer and closer to your ideea until you are drinking champange from a nobel prize while popping anti hangover pills that help african children.

Naltrexone -> Oxymorphone? by Hamilton Beggleshit - Thu, 17 Mar 2016 18:16:02 EST ID:GksK9UMc No.77752 Ignore Report Reply Quick Reply
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Dear /chem/,

wikipedia cites that "Naltrexone can be described as a substituted oxymorphone – here the tertiary amine methyl-substituent is replaced with methylcyclopropane. Naltrexone is the N-cyclopropylmethyl derivative of oxymorphone."

Is it possible to revert naltrexone back to oxymorphone? If so, how?

My very limited understanding of organic chemistry leads me to believe that naltrexone could, in proper solution and (probably) with the addition of heat, be broken into oxymorphone and cyclopropylmethylbromide. (pic related)

Any input regarding said (hypothetical) reaction will be greatly appreciated!
2 posts omitted. Click Reply to view.
Bombastus !RZEwn1AX62!!xXxJO70U - Sun, 27 Mar 2016 13:18:03 EST ID:4ppVjZXo No.77773 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Didn't you start your comment by saying that "you cannot remove the cyclopropylmethyl group of the amine" and then go on and say how to remove that group? Correct me if I misunderstand, please.

If I understand correctly, I don't see why it would. The less sterically-hindered ethylene-amino bridge be cleaved vs the cyclo-propyl (more hindered) group?

However, I guess using a sterically selective agent like dodecanethiol would help. You're right that the alkyl group would fall apart but which one? Isee the ethylene bridge snapping apart before the methylcyclopropyl group is even touched with an equilibrium of 1:1000 or greater
Vehk !7HYGxe5v5c - Mon, 28 Mar 2016 10:59:30 EST ID:mqpMZrCV No.77774 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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OP was talking about naltrexone, which contains the methylcyclopropane substituent, the guy above you is talking about naloxone, which shares the same structure as naltrexone except with an allyl group instead of a methylcyclopropane group forming the substituent.

See picture for reference.
Fanny Munkinspear - Wed, 30 Mar 2016 11:18:57 EST ID:8U0GcjC9 No.77775 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>in real world amine chemistry:
I read this is "in real anime world chemistry"
Ru-lover - Wed, 30 Mar 2016 19:13:14 EST ID:1yz9Gpwk No.77777 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Thanks for clearing this up. Its exactly what I am talking about. Allyl group is 1000x easier to remove than cyclopropylmethyl. You can also use wilkinson catalyst, there are some papers about that.
Cornelius Bushwen - Sun, 10 Apr 2016 22:52:26 EST ID:ljoFE2/4 No.77821 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Quints don't happen here but once in a great while.

A. muscaria - complete decarboxylation of ibotenic acid to muscimol by Faggy Sorringdedge - Thu, 17 Mar 2016 12:28:40 EST ID:ge3zUrSE No.77751 Ignore Report Reply Quick Reply
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I have a chemistry related question for you.

I've read in two separate sources that it is possible to decompose all the ibotenic acid in the muscarias to muscimol by boiling it in a very low pH solution (2.7). One source seems to have used HCl to achieve this. I was wondering if this would be possible to achieve using household vinegar or citric acid.

5% household vinegar seems to have a pH of 2.4, but acetic acid has a low vapour pressure, so boiling vinegar would vapourize acetic acid with water. apart from making your house smell, vapourising acetic acid would drive the pH of the solution higher, so you might need to add more vinegar to the pot regularly.

However, attempting the same with citric acid seems to be more straightforward since citric acid doesn't vapourise as readily. You can just add water to the boiling solution to cover for evaporation losses and be fine. Lemon juice is said to have a pH around 2, and you can calculate the pH of a solution from the amount of citric acid you add so it should work.

After 2.30 - 3 hours of boiling, you can just add some sodium carbonate to neutralize the pH in order to make it more palatable, and filter to remove leftover carbonate/mushroom pieces, and drink. I'm pretty certain this step wouldn't alter the structure of muscimol.

The conversion from ibotenic acid to muscimol seems to be dependent on pH, so I think it should be possible, but I don't have enough chemistry knowledge to say or certain. What do you think?

If this works, this could be used as a very easy homemade tek for preparing Amanitas.

Pic related, ibotenic acid converts to muscimol after boiling at low pH.
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