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Kirtaner & Spardot's 420chan Wedding

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Why did America even give a shit by Phineas Fuckingstone - Wed, 20 Apr 2016 00:46:22 EST ID:NN93ashj No.56644 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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Like what was the point of the cold war? Why was someone else following a different economic system... a threat?
>>
Beatrice Gapperson - Wed, 20 Apr 2016 00:55:36 EST ID:S1D+7OBh No.56645 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I never learned about the Cold War in school. Recently I decided I should probably learn about it to gain a better understanding of international relations.

I was recommended a BBC documentary. It's 24 parts, so it's very long, but I had a great time watching it and couldn't wait sometimes to get to the next segment. It covers everything, starting at the end of WW2 when tensions started, and shows both the American and USSR side of things.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22KIQ1QNnhE&list=PL3H6z037pboGWTxs3xGP7HRGrQ5dOQdGc
>>
Wesley Billingson - Wed, 20 Apr 2016 03:44:39 EST ID:iwMP3krx No.56646 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Do you really need to ask? Because the USSR, the PRC and their respective allies were all profoundly opposed to the US, their allies and their goals and influence and vice versa. They were not friends, and the pseudo-communists controlled 1/3 of the world. It's one superpower fighting for influence against another. It's how capitalism and imperialism works. Competition.

Why is the US always throwing a hissy fit against Russian motives today? Why did the British Empire fear and loathe the German Empire? Why did the British and French also constantly fight? etc. For influence, power. So long as capitalism and imperialism exists, there will always be competition for influence, power and resources. Currently the US is the sole superpower but it has many enemies, many of whom are getting more powerful while the US wanes. Just look at the Syrian war for example. That is a textbook example of a proxy war straight from the Cold War.
>>
Emma Buzzdale - Wed, 20 Apr 2016 05:11:56 EST ID:BNRkDka/ No.56647 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>56646
I've seen shit
>>
Simon Smallson - Wed, 20 Apr 2016 18:21:50 EST ID:6PhWCkVP No.56648 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>56646
I'm no fan of capitalism, but it's not a necessary ingredient for geopolitical dickery. Just Saiyan.
>>
Phineas Bennerwater - Wed, 20 Apr 2016 19:39:19 EST ID:yzFkBcu4 No.56650 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>56648
Nobody said it was.
>>
Walter Tillinggold - Thu, 21 Apr 2016 02:01:06 EST ID:IjoVoZis No.56651 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>56648
these days they go hand in hand!

The cold war, as my fav professor put it in a cheesey way, "was anything but cold."

If you take into account things like vietnam, korea, iran, israel / palenstine, any of the smaller proxy conflicts in africa or the CIA / KGB operations across the world, you kind of realize that these superpowers pretty much just shit on everyone else for a half century.

The best way to understand how invested the two superpowers were in controlling the rest of the world is to study the history of pretty much any south american country from WWI onward. Almost all of them had some US shenanigans going on, including coup de taters, assassinations, financial backing for genocide, and a lot of shady deals between the elites and our largest businesses.

If people went commie, so said our government, then our way of life would cease to function. So it went all out attacking anything remotely unlike itself, going even beyond the communist threat to fight against civil rights, anarchists, and third world governments - pretty much anyone not plugged in to the system.

I kind of wish we had all been nuked back then, because this slow suffocation of the world's ecosystem is getting old. Get it over with, I say!

I mean, it's as easy as looking at the development, production and distribution of insurgent weapons. As far as I'm concerned, the cold war isn't over. The nukes are still here, the U.S. is now an oligarchy (we just had to get on russia's level right?), and our next president is inevitably going to invade some poor country in the middle east over some inarguable pretense.
>>
Martin Pickbanks - Thu, 21 Apr 2016 08:17:31 EST ID:slEOrfVs No.56652 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>56651
>As far as I'm concerned, the cold war isn't over. The nukes are still here
The Cold War is over. What's happened is that as opposed to the bi-polar world of that conflict, it's become a multi-polar world more akin to a global version of Europe in the 19th and early 20th century.

You have China who is boxing in India and boxing the USA out of its expanded territorial waters. You have Russia who is now piggybacking on US military campaigns while engaging in shadow wars in their own region. Saudi Arabia is openly manipulating the oil supply to try and benefit themselves. Hell, even Europe itself played a pretty big role in Libya and Iraq.

People think that because the USA was the sole power we had all the power. But no, the USSR just left a vacuum to be filled by many emerging nations and players who are now free agents.
>>
Sophie Bluttingham - Fri, 22 Apr 2016 05:58:35 EST ID:A4qzNKCl No.56654 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>56652

Interesting! I await more of your back and forth.
>>
Fanny Shittingdock - Tue, 26 Apr 2016 23:54:50 EST ID:W38+YVX9 No.56669 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>this many communist stallions ITT
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Phyllis Chinkinson - Sat, 04 Jun 2016 21:43:56 EST ID:1UXL+6lF No.56714 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>56652
>WW1 might be happening all over again.
Lets hope cooler heads prevail.
>>
Wesley Dranderfoot - Sat, 04 Jun 2016 22:08:22 EST ID:slEOrfVs No.56715 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>56714
>>56654
>>56652

Just saw an interesting piece on VICE on HBO about nuclear weapons.

Two things stuck out:
1) USA is innovating in nuclear weapons including delivery systems. This basically forces an arms race with other nuclear armed nations. It's kind of fucked up that the USA roundly does the very ICBM testing that we chastise nations like Iran and North Korea for doing.
2) They said the US has developed a very small scale nuclear weapon that is highly accurate. They say that having a mini nuke like this actually increases the chances it gets used.

Pretty brutal. Though this could be the start of Cold War 2. Especially if one of these is used in the field of battle. Imagine if the USA starts charging admission to watch rented above ground nuclear testing in 15 years.
>>
Phyllis Chinkinson - Sun, 05 Jun 2016 02:39:44 EST ID:1UXL+6lF No.56717 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>56715
I wonder how the MAD policy is going to hold up when everyone has nukes.
>>
Basil Fangerbury - Tue, 31 Oct 2017 15:47:29 EST ID:PmmRJlWL No.57291 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>56714
I pray for it. End this rotten state of humanity in nuclear hellfire so recovery can begin.
>>
Phyllis Goodman - Thu, 30 Nov 2017 09:39:56 EST ID:OQPxt2GZ No.57313 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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Great power politics aren't about ideology, they're about spheres of influence and access to strategic and capital resources. (Any Marxist recognizes this: material conditions determine consciousness, not the other way around. This is why all the early neoconservative intellectuals were ex-Trots.) The Cold War didn't end—pic is the Amerikan media openly celebrating the theft of the Russian presidential election from the Communist Party in 1996. Russia just became that much less of a threat, for a time; enter China and Iran as rising regional powers, and now Russia has the the US foreign policy establishment and the liberals watching from home spooked all over again.

>>56646, all those months ago, said that the Syrian War is "a textbook example of a proxy war straight from the Cold War." No, the Cold War was bipolar: US proxies against Soviet proxies. Syria has been a noisy mess of different nations' proxies, plus ISIS/Daesh. China just announced they're sending special forces there. If you're gonna compare it to a historical circumstance it's more like Serbia prior to WWI—at the crossroads of empires, suspended in a gridlock of alliances and tenuous treaties. They teach you that it was the assassination of the Archduke which kicked it all off, but it's more like it was just getting to be too much trouble not to have a big war.
>>
Betsy Chorringset - Sat, 02 Dec 2017 19:32:39 EST ID:yZRHzLTw No.57316 Ignore Report Quick Reply
it had nothing to do with economic systems and everything to do with strategic global control of third world labor and raw materials such as oil. the west was scared of russia because the slavic hordes were infinite and smashed the german war machine growing stronger all the while. russia rocketed in power, economic and industrial output, etc. during ww2 and the space race just accelerated things. this is also why us nuked japan, explicitly to demonstrate the weapon to russia to intimidate them. after germany/japan/most of europe including britain was smashed by ww2, only us and russia were left as superpowers. they were the only existential threat to one another. woulda played out essentially the same if they were both communist or both capitalist
>>
Phyllis Goodman - Sat, 02 Dec 2017 22:54:15 EST ID:OQPxt2GZ No.57317 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>57316
>woulda played out essentially the same if they were both communist or both capitalist
well, now you're fiddling with the dials past the point of meaningful analysis. The Soviets were still internationalists – Lenin himself had considered the Bolshevik Revolution only a "holding action" until industrialized Germany could be brought into the fold; it was only after the failure of the Spartacist uprising and Lenin's death that the USSR hardened its shell. The century would have played out very differently with socialist blocs on both sides, because the Soviet model of aid (cf. modern China) was very different from the American.
>>
Frederick Worthingfoot - Mon, 04 Dec 2017 07:24:23 EST ID:rbK+gS1r No.57318 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>57317
Lenin had died long before WW2, Stalin was in command now...
...and guess what, Lenin had warned Trosky that Stalin was never allowed to take control of the USSR.
>>
StimLioness !JM2DTgXfqU - Fri, 22 Dec 2017 10:27:01 EST ID:2kVQJUZ4 No.57329 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>Why did the most important capitalist state butt heads with the most important socialist state
Antagonisms OP, antagonisms
>>
StimLioness !JM2DTgXfqU - Fri, 22 Dec 2017 11:29:28 EST ID:2kVQJUZ4 No.57330 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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Also OP the US needs to have an enemy figure to frighten and distract its people with.

After the Nazis it was commies, after the commies now its Islam. Gotta give the people their villain ya know? Also its gotta be because they hate our freedom not because we keep fuckin with their shit.
>>
Phineas Cocklestock - Thu, 08 Feb 2018 00:42:02 EST ID:pYW/9DNs No.57365 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>56717
It won't. And that's one of the reasons that it isn't hypocritical to ask that backwards countries run by dictators and fanatics, populated by people isolated from the rest of the world, and living in unstable regions; should NOT have access to nukes.

Countries where leaders and citizens both are driven by hatred or religious fervor are too dangerously stupid to have access to NBC weaponry; they will always misuse it. Humans can get so goddamned indoctrinated that they'll shoot a toddler if he's part of the wrong family. Or grandma will tell her teenage daughter to hand a grenade to those soldiers. Etc.

Many places on earth place little value on human life. In the middle-east, there is no value on human life, even your own.
>>
Phyllis Fankinkedging - Sat, 10 Feb 2018 15:21:22 EST ID:PmmRJlWL No.57366 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>57313
>IT'LL HAPPEN IN SYRIA

Nice commie doomsaying as per usual. Die.
>>
William Nebbleson - Sat, 10 Feb 2018 17:27:13 EST ID:rbK+gS1r No.57368 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>57366
Who are you quoting? Are you some lost the future immigrant? If so, you need to fuck off.
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Lydia Greencocke - Sat, 10 Feb 2018 17:35:28 EST ID:dUHNnmI0 No.57369 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>57366

think you could take the cocks out of your mouth for a moment and offer a single meaningful statement? if not fuck off
>>
Clara Burringchen - Sat, 10 Feb 2018 21:46:43 EST ID:I7bx5dcu No.57370 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>56644
> Why did the British Empire fear and loathe the German Empire?
They didn't; they were complicit in a fucking theatrical production of a pair of wars which the western colonial powers used as a distraction while they carved up the Ottomans, Africa, and East Asia.
Fun fact: British bombers were specifically instructed to avoid German war factories, and instead bombed nearby civilian centres instead. Factories which continued paying dividends to American stockholders right up until the end of the war.

> Why did the British and French also constantly fight?
Hmm, what could Orwell possibly have meant when he said "'The past was alterable. The past never had been altered. Oceania was at war with Eastasia. Oceania had always been at war with Eastasia" in his satire of the British Ministry of Information?
>>
Thomas Honeyhall - Wed, 14 Feb 2018 00:10:04 EST ID:rbK+gS1r No.57373 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>57370
Are you retarded? They bombed civilian centers because there were no laser-guided bunker buster missiles in 1945. Only dumb bombs that had to be aimed by hand. From the bombing bay. While flying through flak. Flying miles up in the air. Trying to hit factories based off fuzzy maps.
>>
Molly Peblingkot - Thu, 22 Mar 2018 09:34:52 EST ID:IPwOEHqI No.57407 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>57373
Oh okay thanks for the military wisdoms there anon-kun. That clears up everything. Giant manufactory complexes are impossible to hit with thousands of tonnes of munitions, got it.

Why do you think they had bombers if they were useless, exactly?
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Shit Gettingtedge - Sun, 01 Apr 2018 23:49:47 EST ID:YjWyi3hl No.57419 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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Communism and socialism are global movements. The American class system and working class solidarity can not exist, it has to be snuffed out at home and abroad.
>>
Archie Gongerstock - Mon, 02 Apr 2018 04:40:49 EST ID:zPMk1XQv No.57421 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>57407
That shill only thinks what MI5 pays him to think. No honest person could defend the British Empire's actions in any conflict, open or clandestine.
>>
Martha Menkinwell - Mon, 02 Apr 2018 14:42:39 EST ID:8cb/Ihsi No.57422 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>57370

Proof of this, please.
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Sophie Migglechire - Mon, 02 Apr 2018 18:40:52 EST ID:rbK+gS1r No.57423 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>57407
YOU FUCKING MONGOLOID CUNT!

THE AMERICANS BOMBED BY DAY BECAUSE THEY HAD A FUCKHUGE POPULATION AND A HUGE AIRFORCE!

THE BRITISH HAD A MUCH SMALLER POPULATION AND A SMALL AIRFORCE SO THEY CHOSE TO BOMB BY NIGHT!

YOU KNOW WHAT A FACTORY FROM A MILE HIGH LOOKS LIKE AT NIGHT?

THE SAME AS A FUCKING CITY BLOCK!

FUCKING KILL YOURSELF YOU RETARDED AMERICAN CUNT!
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Edwin Cligglededging - Tue, 03 Apr 2018 17:21:20 EST ID:/mZfItc6 No.57427 Ignore Report Quick Reply
friendly reminder that germany never bombed london until the britbongs bombed berlin first
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Samuel Forringwere - Tue, 03 Apr 2018 21:01:13 EST ID:rbK+gS1r No.57428 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>57427
Friendly reminder that the UK never bombed Germany until the huns bombed Poland first.
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Lydia Gommertug - Wed, 18 Apr 2018 14:59:30 EST ID:wty78VYY No.57443 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>57427

Except when they did during WWI.
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William Brirrymot - Fri, 11 May 2018 16:20:33 EST ID:wwH2bg7s No.57454 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Because the US didn't give a fuck after WWI and the world went immediately back to shit so Americans realized they needed to establish a framework that benefitted them primarily, under the guise of altruism to make it more palatable to naysayers at home and abroad.
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Phineas Duffingmodge - Wed, 18 Jul 2018 15:18:31 EST ID:IbKa5NOC No.57486 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>57313
If it wasn't about ideology, why did America oppose socialist regimes that came about democratically (Iran, Chile) or support the Cuban revolution to keep those areas under the sphere of influence? Batista was outliving his usefulness if thee country was already looking revolutionary, why not bump him off and install Castro on the condition that he's sweet with the US and the Russians only sided with Castro after it was obvious he'd win.
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Matilda Fadgehedging - Wed, 25 Jul 2018 23:18:09 EST ID:3e1d6uV9 No.57493 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>56648
existence is a necessary ingredient for geopolitical dickery
>>
Ian Battingshit - Thu, 26 Jul 2018 00:31:19 EST ID:I/ObPRRq No.57494 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>56644
For the same reason the monarchies of Europe allied against and invaded the new French republic; The royals of Europe saw French citizens overthrowing their royals as a threat to their position and livelihood and attempted to snuff it out as quickly as possible unless it spread to their nations. European royals had more in common together than they did with their subjects (and were often of the same family).

Like the royals of 1800s Europe, so too did the western capitalists view the destruction of the bourgeois class in Russia and China as an immediate threat to their power. These fears real and the threats were real. The French Republic attempted to foment revolution in it's neighbors and the USSR attempted to foment revolution around the world.

It's not about economic differences, it's always been about class struggle.


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