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Research Chems by Angus Drublingway - Mon, 06 Nov 2017 02:40:14 EST ID:KcJQeKgs No.587838 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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I was recently introduced to the world of RCs. A couple opiod - like chems that seem to be popular currently are o-desmethyltramadol and MAF (methoxy-acetyl-fentanyl). Anyone have any experience with these? I was once addicted to fentanyl so my tolerance is very high. Was mostly wondering what a good starting dose is for the MAF. Already have some MAF on the way, and while I will be very careful, it would still be nice to have some insight going into it.
I am also quite interested in trying the o-desmethyltramadol (prodrug to tramadol, much lower siezure risk, 80% strength morphine) so was hoping someone might have some experiences to report on that as well.
I will report back with my own experiences with the MAF in a few days hopefully. On that note, any insights or experiences with these chemicals are greatly welcomed.
Esther Farringketch - Mon, 06 Nov 2017 03:50:30 EST ID:URdnzYJV No.587843 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I basically just hear that the RC opiod scene is amazingly lacking. Which is bizarre for me considering the current climate, how many people love OPIs, and the money to be made. Maybe making a good RC is hard for the opiate class for some reason. Maybe stim fiends are that much more productive. Dope heads tend to think their drug is perfect (it is) anyways.

Sorry, now for the helpful part: there is a thread posted here and to /dis/ where the OP talks about his experience with a novel RC that is disso and opi at the same time. I know it sucks for your habit/life, but having a big tolerance right now is probably great for your safety. Still, be really careful redosing, it seems like many of these RCs are really long lasting after the euphoria fades and you can get a 'cumulative overdose' even if your subjective effects aren't going strong.

I would suggest 1 an allergy test first. This helps for allergies, and will let you know if your guy sent the wrong thing. TEST EACH BATCH. There are way too many vendors who are twacked out and send a cannabinoid or 2c-X chemical. People have died from this. Also for this reason, keep enough to taper or keep a fent/H stash or SOMETHING, you don't want to be waiting on the RC to get out of WD and get the wrong thing, that could be disasterous with these uncharted WD waters. I would suggest getting some narcan and not using alone, but I know that isn't always possible.

finally, even if you IV, use volumetric dosing. Hotspots are all to common, and they are only greater in the RC game because of the few steps the drug takes to you. Some people actually mix dry just by shaking, it is insane. Vol Dosing will prevent hotspots killing you.

Lastly, report everything you notice! I am infinitely curious in this sphere; I am sure you have noticed the absolute lack of information anywhere, so help us out! I would imagine there are some amazing ones out there, I mean the chemistry of opiates isn't that complex, surely there is one that sticks hard to receptors and doesn't have horrible dysphoria or something.

Hmmm. I wonder if in a few years we will have some mitragynine based RCs to mess with. Would be wonderful if we had some crazy strong ones without the corresponding strong respiratory depression. Imagine an opiod you could mix safely with alcohol and benzos (yes I know tons of people do it, I mean SAFELY)

Be careful dood
Esther Farringketch - Mon, 06 Nov 2017 03:52:21 EST ID:URdnzYJV No.587844 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Plus maybe in water your drug will convert to something coolio in the water. I don't think any drug that becomes toxic in water would make it out of the research phase, since the air has water and stuf. I'm not sure about this though, so look up some basic chemistry about your DOC and make sure it doesn't turn to megableach in water.
Angus Drublingway - Mon, 06 Nov 2017 05:10:24 EST ID:KcJQeKgs No.587850 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Yes the scene does seem to be lacking but the 2 i mentioned seem to have a lot of potential. MAF being a more euphoric fentanyl but similar in strength. The o-dsmt is also supposed to be more euphoric and stronger than tramadol with much lower siezure risk. There is also U-47931E (MALEATE) which I did not mention that is supposed to be about as strong as morphine and related to the somewhat popular U-47770. The U-47931E sounds like it is more euphoric than other U-series, is not super potent like fentalogues and seems to be a rather promising new rc opioid as well. After MAF i will choose either U-47931E or o-dsmt to try. Hoping for some insight before I decide to help guide me to the better option.
Esther Farringketch - Mon, 06 Nov 2017 07:43:54 EST ID:URdnzYJV No.587852 Ignore Report Quick Reply
U-47770 was straight ass for people, so I'd stay away if its relatives are similar. It was caustic, spiked tolerance like crazy, didn't feel that euphoric, and had NO legs. Like less legs than fent, which is terrible when it is raising your tolerance a similar amount. We do opis to enjoy mundane life more, with short acting poids you end up spending all your time in miserable WD. Then, when you get your DOC you are so tired from WDing you just pass out, then wake up in WD AGAIN because the compound is so short lived. Not even fun. Just sharing what I have seen. Be careful of the drug being really cheap, you skyrocketing your tolerance, then availability/ the vendor / the entire market / your funds / the manufacturer tanks. All of these things can leave you with an astronomical tolerance and no way to do anything to help it at all. Nothing feels worse than a habit that a bun won't touch, and you can get there without realizing since you're fucked up all day.

I would get some ULDN to keep running adjacent to all these experiments. No real downsides to having a lower tolerance, and for subjective reporting it will help if your tolerance isn't rising quickly through the experiment. Sorry I don't have more concrete stuff to add, mostly warnings, but this is uncharted territory so you need to make sure you don't end up in an entirely shitty situation with no one who knows wtf to do. If you don't want to ULDN for some reason, maybe grab some tar, ECP or something to keep using every few days, to kind of reset tolerance and make sure you aren't getting too far off the map.

If all this is moot because you plan to fly off the map... set some phone reminders to get you to post here, because I am crazy curious about this. I've been really disappointed in the RC opiate scene, I would think that there would be RC opiates all over the scene with everyone nodding their face off on 3 dollars, but nope. It can't be lack of a market, and there are TONS of chemists who love opiates... There are some obstacles there we don't usually see with RCs. I don't get it. I hope things change in the next few years. You are the shulgin of the /opi/, take good notes and have a blast
Caroline Capperwell - Mon, 06 Nov 2017 13:05:33 EST ID:1iFCwsJ4 No.587863 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I've done more rc's than most here, I'm usually rambling on alot 4fibf, what do you want to know?
Oliver Hebblegold - Mon, 06 Nov 2017 17:04:25 EST ID:nlS4hic+ No.587869 Ignore Report Quick Reply
where to get it.
I know you cant discuss it here, and some like to keep the info to themselves, which is understandable, because some people are down right fucking retarded, and start running their mouths and ruin it for everyone.
But if you can shoot me an email or something so we can talk about "how nice the weather is" or something that would be cool.
Cornelius Dellysack - Mon, 06 Nov 2017 17:21:56 EST ID:tdPcmn59 No.587870 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Molly Wummerway - Mon, 06 Nov 2017 17:33:55 EST ID:dLpt55Cr No.587873 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I had 10g of MAF. Started with ~5mg then I was IVing ~20mg. THen I ran out and my skin was on fire and my legs spasmed and flailed on their own. Curled up in a ball, rolling side to side and waiting for it to be over.

So you must be careful.
Molly Wummerway - Mon, 06 Nov 2017 17:39:27 EST ID:dLpt55Cr No.587874 Ignore Report Quick Reply
People keep saying MAF is euphoric, I read that over and over on these echo chamber discussion boards, but the alleged MAF I recieved wasn't that euphoric. To me it was mainly a hard hitting body-high.
Lofentanil was slightly more euphoric I think.

But honestly, none of these fents can come close to actual opiates as far as feel-goods-effects.
William Fellerson - Mon, 06 Nov 2017 19:27:26 EST ID:KcJQeKgs No.587876 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Well my first question is how good is 4fibf compared to MAF and what is a safe starting dose of it?
Seond question- if you have done many rcs, it would be nice to hear which ones you recommend for new people to try and which is your favorite. Already have 2 I still want to try but not afraid to add a few more to the list if they sound interesting. Mostly concerned with opioid type rcs obviously. Thanks for any insight you can give.

I am very curious myself which is why I started this excursion. Don't worry I will definitely come back with reports about the MAF. I was once addicted to Fentanyl and was hoping MAF is similar but more euphoric. The other ones o-dsmt and U-47931E might take me a couple weeks to source but I will put a report on those when I can as well.

If this guy says anything intriguing that seems safe after researching, I may put reports of those experiences as well.

Any continued thoughts and experience reports greatly appreciated, keep em coming.
Esther Demmershit - Mon, 06 Nov 2017 19:28:18 EST ID:6JVbhDTW No.587877 Ignore Report Quick Reply
O-DSMT is great stuff if your tolerance is low, but since you're messing with fentalogs, it won't do much at all. Consider getting some as a maintenance/taper opioid, but don't expect to get much recreational use from it. I would recommend it over the U-47931E simply because O-DSMT is much better studied.
Reuben Socklewell - Mon, 06 Nov 2017 19:58:32 EST ID:qCXGUpz/ No.587880 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Though it is a tramalog isn't ODMST about equipotent with morphine? Does it have a ceiling effect?
Hunter S. Nodson - Mon, 06 Nov 2017 20:12:11 EST ID:rn0Uvf4I No.587882 Ignore Report Quick Reply

I'd say it's about half as potent if not less if we're talking oral vs oral. People with no tolerance have reported needing upwards of 100mg to get high, so take that as you will.
Simon Fellymitch - Tue, 07 Nov 2017 12:33:21 EST ID:kFv4xmDF No.587894 Ignore Report Quick Reply
o dsmt is dang solid. ime felt almost better than heroin at lowish tolerance
Nathaniel Hallerville - Tue, 07 Nov 2017 13:38:26 EST ID:FsPvJ5ZR No.587897 Ignore Report Quick Reply
does it sitll have that stim-like feeling like tramadol had? please write something more about it, don't know if I should buy it or just get more oxy now but I'm really interested in trying something new
press !XIxc6BpKnU - Tue, 07 Nov 2017 16:08:29 EST ID:ThEay7Iz No.587908 Ignore Report Quick Reply
isnt o dsmt just the active main metabolite of tramadol?
Jenny Drodgeham - Tue, 07 Nov 2017 23:26:35 EST ID:cbXJ46oj No.587924 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Sophie Follyridge - Tue, 07 Nov 2017 23:43:45 EST ID:T7flwXWl No.587925 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Yeah, it's the major one IIRC, but tramdol is active in and of itself and (far) more potent as an SNRI.
Jenny Drodgeham - Wed, 08 Nov 2017 00:12:43 EST ID:cbXJ46oj No.587927 Ignore Report Quick Reply
my b, hit submit post on accident trying to scroll

o-dsmt is AN active metabolite of tramadol but tramadol has other metabolites as well (in addition to the obvious N-DSMT, which is not active in opiate receptors but is metabolized into O-DSMT, further complicating tramadol's already fucky pharmacokinetics). Tramadol has 5 different metabolites, each of which has its own metabolites, which combined with the kinetics of its metabolization through various P450 enzymes make it different enough from O-DSMT that I'd say calling it "just tramadol's main active metabolite", while technically true, is a little reductive given their differing effect profiles.

O-DSMT is not an SRI (although its - enantiomor (I know I fucked that spelling but you know what I mean) is still a norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor). It is also a much much more potent agonist (something like five hundred times the affinity of tramadol and efficacy equal to morphine. All that, along with the fact that you are not relying on P450 enzymes for metabolization and thus don't have to worry about a "ceiling effect" or any of the other messiness that brings, makes it a somewhat different beast pharmacodynamically. It's obviously similar in effect to tramadol but the lack of SRI effects and the huge increase in strength give it enough of a different flavor in my opinion.
Augustus Chandlepadging - Wed, 08 Nov 2017 05:21:23 EST ID:FsPvJ5ZR No.587938 Ignore Report Quick Reply
now that's kind of reply I've been expecting, thanks man
Archie Gattingtedging - Sat, 25 Nov 2017 04:08:23 EST ID:twP8bVQS No.588640 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Well it may have taken a while but I finally came back to give my report on the MAF. I was once addicted to fentanyl so I will start by saying it is NOT, in my humble opinion, very much like fentanyl in many ways except for potency. They are about equally potent as far as I could tell.
I much prefer the MAF for many reasons. The price of fent has really shot up a lot lately (still insanely good bang for your buck) but the price on MAF is still low and its a better high that is just as potent. It lasts way longer too so you can sleep through the night, unlike fent which had you waking up every few hours to redose. So far I had done about a tenth of a gram (daily use) and am awaiting to start withdrawing to see how bad its going to be. After a while of suffering I will likely bitch out and suboxone taper off completely and clean my habit back to twice a week. I like to use but not withdraw if I have to stop using suddenly, which is difficult when you can make nasal sprayers that last a week of all-the-time use with fentalogues. They really boost your tolerance fast and have a very effective addiction mechanism. I had to ask a friend to hold my supply to make sure I don't let myself go overboard since I was forced to order so much (cheapest I could order was multiple grams.) I guess I will have a supply for months to come. Friends way rather drop me 50 for a bottle than find pills so it is also easy to make money off it. Fentanyl is not as friendly and a lot of people disliked but this have proven to be a winner in my book (and most of my friends who tried it). If you have self control now is a good time to stock up while it is cheap and nobody knows its potential to take over fent as the most popular fentalogue,

I never got to find o-dsmt and U-47931E but I did manage to find a sample g of U-47700 which I am still waiting to see if it actually comes. Can report back on findings of the u477 if anyone is interested. My plug with the MAF just seems to not be able to find a decent source for o-dsmt and U-47931E. The U-47700 hopefully is good though.

My dosing for other researchers out there (mid to high tolerance myself, but always start low) is about 1mg/mL. I usually take more than 1 spray (don't know how much mine sprays per shot) but I definitely go thru over 1mL of liquid per use. Over 1mg seems to be safe if you have a real good tolerance but I take that fractions at a time.
I hope someone might be able to point me toward a legit source for o-dsmt and U-47931E but I guess thats against the rules so nvm. Anyway hope this little MAF review helps and was interesting to anyone reading. Safe adventures out there everyone.
Derluft !oCyNK.1Qtc - Sun, 03 Dec 2017 12:48:58 EST ID:sa9b23g9 No.589064 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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About R-30490 (4-MAF), wikipedia says it has slightly less "potency" (Bomb and I differ on the specifics of potency via either euphoria or concentration) than carfentanil yet has a high μ-opioid receptor affinity; it has decent euphoria on par to at least straight fent, ya? What about legality; is it legal in the U.S.; is it considered a 'legal' RC? - Wasn't their an umbrella'd fentalogue ban in the U.S.? - I'm seeing this shit on the DNM @ 2dg(200kmcg) for $100; also with quick shipping, I know relatively as an opi it's still great but would you say that's an appropriate price? Sorry for all the questions..

Also, is 4-MAF simply acetylated fentanyl? - Almost like: morphine is to diacetylmorphine as fentanyl is to 4-methoxyacetylfentanyl? I'm not sure - Compared to others like Q & Bomb, I'm definitely no chemist and often feel as a dilettante.
Q !57aon8jsJ2 - Mon, 04 Dec 2017 07:25:45 EST ID:B8hqdvN2 No.589088 Ignore Report Quick Reply
4-maf is i think 4-MethoxyAcetylFent.

IMO i bet its fucking great might be similar to like 2-methyl-MAF but id guess better.

also afaik 4-maf would be 100% legal in the us.
StimLioness !JM2DTgXfqU - Mon, 04 Dec 2017 15:18:50 EST ID:8Gks/2Y/ No.589110 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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U-4 killed so many fucking online people when it came out. That shit is hardcore and can make you fall out pretty easy. I can't believe I plugged 26mg or whatever back when I was an opi noob I've never been high off an opiate in my fucking life omg. Thank god I could smoke some meth to stay alive lol.

I want to try 7ohm as it's kratom based and supposedly actually worthwhile.
StimLioness !JM2DTgXfqU - Mon, 04 Dec 2017 15:20:19 EST ID:8Gks/2Y/ No.589111 Ignore Report Quick Reply
*so high
I had been high off opis by then, but just like low dose morphine/vicodin/oxy I hadn't tried h yet till like two months after.n Durrrr high.
Thomas Blackwell - Mon, 04 Dec 2017 20:35:49 EST ID:AWnC/EaM No.589125 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Eh u4 is fine if you show it respect, Id say its a lot less dangerous than a ton of fentalogs. I never had to volumetrically dose it in water unlike some of the more potent fent relatives, and with low tolerance, after getting a good idea of dose from using mg scales, I could easily eyeball doses and never got uncomfortably high. The causticity and short duration was the nastiest aspects for me, even when IVing high doses I never ran into any problems, its all about risk assessment and showing respect. I think people coming to pure, potent RCs from street heroin just find it hard psychologically to shoot up small volumes of powder when with most shitty H people are shooting up several points on a low tolerance.
Priscilla Dundlewot - Tue, 05 Dec 2017 19:32:51 EST ID:5Tx86iXn No.589180 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Currently on some desmethyltramadol after going through a dry spot since July and only having access to small amounts of codeine and kratom. There's a definite opiate buzz to it, feels very sedating but sadly lacking in euphoria? Definitely better than regular tramadol by far. Anyone else try this stuff? Thoughts? Wondering what the best ROA is.
Hunter S. Nodson - Tue, 05 Dec 2017 19:48:03 EST ID:WY9U0KPr No.589181 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Best ROA is prob plugging behind IV. Assuming you have the HCl salt and not the freebase.
Priscilla Dundlewot - Tue, 05 Dec 2017 20:04:39 EST ID:5Tx86iXn No.589182 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Alright thanks, I might give that a try. I'm assuming it's hcl since I've been snorting and it works just fine, not entirely sure of the distinction though. This is my first opioid rc, not well versed in all of the nomenclature yet as I mostly stuck to pharms before.

Seems like there's a lot of people out there right now wondering how this stuff is, I think it's definitely worth a try if you have no access to good pills or h. It knocks kratom and codeine out of the park imo, just sadly lacking in any real euphoria.
Betsy Crirryman - Fri, 15 Dec 2017 00:58:15 EST ID:XD6ci6cH No.589664 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Heard there's been some new U-#### and fentalogues coming out anyone know how they are?
Cornelius Lightfuck - Fri, 15 Dec 2017 01:19:14 EST ID:bSWLyrXk No.589666 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I recently received what was supposed to be 1g of MAF (methoxyacetylfentanyl).

I treated this with extreme caution for the first week, and begin by dosing volumetrically at ~ 50 micrograms.

After titrating up to 2mg i still noticed no effects.

It didn't show up as anything on various reagent tests.

I recently began upping the dose more in search of any effects.

Just a while ago i snorted 5mg, and over the last 15 minutes or so i have got pretty fucked up, but it doesn't feel like an opiate really.

Kind of blurred vision, weird to walk around, red eyes, maybe pinpointing a bit.

I wouldn't say this has any euphoria, but im slightly chiller.

This vendor also offers u4-8800 and u4-9900.

i tried u4-7000 before, and this is nothing like that at all.

Does anyone know if this sounds like u4-8800 or u4-9900 at all?

I was honestly thinking it might have been hexen, because we spoke about that for a while and it tasted similar, but this definitely some type of depressant.

It's a very shiny crystalline powder.

Any tips/similarities would be appreciated. I know it would be by no means conclusive, but i'm at a lost.
Cornelius Lightfuck - Fri, 15 Dec 2017 01:21:51 EST ID:bSWLyrXk No.589667 Ignore Report Quick Reply
It's now hard to read without holding one eye shut, and i feel kinda bad/kinda good?

I don't think i'll continue to fuck with this until i know for sure.
Shit Hubblechore - Fri, 15 Dec 2017 01:32:05 EST ID:twZ28/AP No.589668 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Now I feel nauseous sweaty and pretty bad.

What's odd is i didn't feel anything at 4 mg and ive spaced all my doses out buy 45 minutes or more so I don't think I'm reaching a dangerous level from compounding effects.

I feel like shit but I'm breathing fine and I don't feel like I'm falling asleep
Shit Hubblechore - Fri, 15 Dec 2017 01:44:31 EST ID:twZ28/AP No.589669 Ignore Report Quick Reply

Definite pupilar dilation and feeling kind of itchy now. I would say this is definitely an opioid of some sort.

About 40 minutes in with still pretty strong effects
Shit Hubblechore - Fri, 15 Dec 2017 02:08:36 EST ID:twZ28/AP No.589672 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Now I'm itchy as f***. Plus I walked into the restroom and immediately threw up in the floor.

I didn't even think I was going to throw up I dropped something and as I leaned over to pick it up i throw up everywhere

Don't even have the energy to clean it.

I wish I could take some Benadryl for the itchiness and have a drink or two to help fall asleep but I'd rather not take anything until this wears off
Shit Hubblechore - Fri, 15 Dec 2017 02:14:01 EST ID:twZ28/AP No.589673 Ignore Report Quick Reply

This doesn't feel like U4, Desmetramadol or any fendt I've ever had.

I'm pretty curious as to what it is, and why the sudden increase in effects

I'm going to quit spamming you all about this. My bad. Was slightly worried for a minute.
George Billingfoot - Sat, 16 Dec 2017 02:18:08 EST ID:Z1L2vbMc No.589704 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Still not sure what this is. But after talking to vendor more he sure is me it was just a weaker batch of MAF.

Not sure how exactly as it looks extremely pure.

Around 2 and 1/2 to 3 mg snorted it has me feeling pretty fucking good.

He's sending me 2g more for free of a new batch that he says is supposed to be much better quality and they've had many good reviews about.

It doesn't really make me nod but it gets me close to there while still feeling energized?
Ian Sovingstone - Sat, 16 Dec 2017 05:26:40 EST ID:bSWLyrXk No.589713 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I had some MAF a while back that i didnt seem to notice effects untill ~ the same dosage.

Bit odd considering the highest i would normally go was 2mg.

Loved vaping that shit though.
Simon Pundleshaw - Sat, 16 Dec 2017 06:05:15 EST ID:jrxCJbyJ No.589718 Ignore Report Quick Reply
any idea what I could be? sold as h #4, me and friends snorted this stuff, lines were like 50-70 mg, shit was crazy strong, high lasted like 10-12 fucking hours, looked yellowish, no crystals etc, just powder
can't provide photos, but will post some if/when I buy some more from this guy which may be somewhere over the course of next week
Samuel Pumbleway - Sat, 16 Dec 2017 07:35:40 EST ID:dLpt55Cr No.589723 Ignore Report Quick Reply
From what I've heard the vendors just sell whatever chem was just banned relabeled as whatever the hot new buzz chem is (happened to me and several others with lofentanil).

But yeah I tried 2 batches of what was called "MAF".
The first one was nice. The powder was even consistency, so I could scoop out my doses and not die. Went through 10g of that in like 2-3 weeks... should've planned that better, cause heroin would barely stop the fent w/ds at that point.

Then I got a newer batch of "MAF" from the same vendor. It had a very different texture (more clumpy) to the powder. So I'm eveballing doses, then within that first day of receiving it, I OD'ed/

Last thing I remember is pushing the needle in.... then waking up, dazed and confused, in survival mode, as my diaphragm forces me to convulsively breath: raspy, short, and painful breaths. Because it turns out I had aspirated fluid into my lungs -> they weren't able to do their job as good -> combined with fent's respiratory depression = my O2% was at 30!!!
It's weird what the body does to stay alive. Pulling blood away from my limbs + head and into my core, so my brain wasn't working so good for a while, and when I woke up I actually had no idea when/where/why I was there.

Sorry for the ramble, but I've never woken up so painfully in am EMS before. You'd think that experience + multiple rehabs would be enough to deter me...

OH yeah your questions: I used ~7mg MAF, but after tachyphylaxis, ~20mg per shot. Needed that every 3hrs at least.
And from what I've read, O-DT isn't worth it.

Just always make an accurate volumetric solution with the fent man. I'd be dead if I were living alone at that time.
George Billingfoot - Sat, 16 Dec 2017 08:07:40 EST ID:Z1L2vbMc No.589725 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Scary shit.

I'm always dosing volumetrically.

Still scary reading that, plus all the other things you hear
Fuck Dranderridge - Mon, 18 Dec 2017 06:31:32 EST ID:KcJQeKgs No.589860 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I dont quite understand why they need to keep this process of banning new drugs and constantly keep up with having the hot new buzz chem up. The analog act I thought was supposed to take care of this but it seems like its really not doing a good job. That being said is MAF currently considered legal or illegal? If you are getting them imported, even if the chem is legal currently, and it gets stopped at customs I feel like they would still take it regardless. Anyone have any insight on current legality of MAF or how shipping legal chems work? What about travelling with legal rcs openly like etizolam/metizolam or something and airport security thinks it might be illegal drugs? I realize they would have to drop the charges but I have had cops threaten to take me to jail and if they worked things out that these substances werent illegal my charges would just get dropped but I'd be spending at least 1 night in jail regardless. Crazy how they are allowed to do things like that but US is known for its high imprisonment rates for a reason. Anyway, thanks for any insights in advance hope someone out there knows whats up.
Hunter S. Nodson - Mon, 18 Dec 2017 12:13:58 EST ID:WY9U0KPr No.589880 Ignore Report Quick Reply

Fent is being ostracized by all angles rn so count them out of the game for now. Bromadoline just popped up which has mixes reviews consisting of no effects or some light opi effects. O-DSMT is great with little tolerance just very very expensive. Costs the same as street opis per dose.

Right now is a bad time. But there are some promising new ones that will pop up soon like metopon and methadone analogues. Do not expect to see any morphinians for a long time if not ever as they are too hard to synth. Realistically at this time your only options are tianeptine and o-dsmt or bromadoline if you want to be a lab rat. Ill update this thread when i get my hands on a new opi rc which should be soon i hope.

Just get kratom and call it a day tbh. This day in age are dark times for opis :(
Thomas de Queasy - Mon, 18 Dec 2017 13:18:34 EST ID:LbiEsuzR No.589882 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Metopon and methadone analogues will bring forth a true golden age of opi RCs, similar but better than what happened after the Heroin/Diacetylmorphine ban in the 1920's.
Q !57aon8jsJ2 - Mon, 18 Dec 2017 15:09:30 EST ID:vc9A63KA No.589887 Ignore Report Quick Reply
boyz things arent as dark as it seems. this thread makes it seem bleak but there is a real light. TDQ hit the nail on the head as usual. ive spoken with china and china has said if its got a cas number and is a metopon analog we will synth it and ship to you for dirt cheap. Still angling on the methadone analogs.

My list of inquiries is as follows would love some help getting the priority numbers nailed down.

R-4066 (Spirodone)

R-4066 (Spirodone) is a drug which is an analogue of the opioid analgesic methadone, or more accurately norpipanone, where the metabolically labile dimethylamino group has been replaced by a piperidinospiro group. Developed by Janssen Pharmaceutica,[1] it is around 212x more potent than methadone as an analgesic in animal tests, with an effective oral dosage of 0.07 mg/kg, but is shorter acting, with a duration of action of around 3 hours. If the ketone function is reduced and acetylated, the racemate 106 x methadone and has an analgesic duration of 20.5 hours compared to 8 hours for methadone.[2]

CAS Number
Oxalate: 101564-56-1


Metethoheptazine[1] (WY-535) is an opioid analgesic from the phenazepine family. It was invented in the 1960s.[2]

Metethoheptazine produces similar effects to other opioids, including analgesia, sedation, dizziness and nausea.

Metethoheptazine is not listed as a controlled substance under the Controlled Substances Act 1970 in the United States.[3] The Canadian Controlled Drugs and Substances Act specifically excludes the phenazepine opioids from control.

CAS Number


Dezocine (INN, USAN) (brand name Dalgan) is a marketed opioid analgesic of the benzomorphan group.[1] First synthesized in 1970,[2] it acts as a modulator of mu-, delta-, and kappa-opioid receptors. Dezocine is a mixed agonist/antagonist of opioid receptors. It is related to other benzomorphans such as pentazocine, with a similar profile of effects that include analgesia and euphoria.[3] Unlike many other benzomorphans however, it is a silent antagonist of the κ-opioid receptor, and in accordance, does not produce side effects such as dysphoria or hallucinations at any dose.[4]

CAS Number


Fluorophen, or fluorofen, is a fluorinated analogue of phenazocine, an opioid drug of the benzomorphan group, which was developed as a radioligand for the purpose of labeling opioid receptors during PET scans (with 18F).[1][2] Unlike most other benzomorphan derivatives, fluorophen acts as a full agonist of the opioid receptors with preferential affinity for the μ-opioid receptor (approximately 6x that of morphine), similar but slightly lower affinity for the δ-opioid receptor (equipotent to [D-Ala2, D-Leu5]enkephalin), and very low affinity for the κ-opioid receptor.[1][2]

CAS Number

this now open to votes as to what i should ask about in what order
Thomas de Queasy - Mon, 18 Dec 2017 17:59:00 EST ID:LbiEsuzR No.589892 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Definitely Spirodone, or more precisely what becomes of it with ketone function reduced and acetylated. Though I'm 50/50 on this one, both should have a great rush when you know the methadone family. But 3 hours is too short and it will get fiendy and blow up tolerance more than a 20 hour high from a single fix.
Hunter S. Nodson - Mon, 18 Dec 2017 18:37:31 EST ID:WY9U0KPr No.589897 Ignore Report Quick Reply
This looks neat
Baron Von Feelsgood - Mon, 18 Dec 2017 19:45:05 EST ID:wHAvn2tX No.589900 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Yeah. There are a few stim opis or opi stims. They sound super fucking cool.
David Fuckingford - Mon, 18 Dec 2017 23:56:12 EST ID:bSWLyrXk No.589919 Ignore Report Quick Reply
So i posted about doing MAF and getting sick and throwing up and not being happy with it.

Since that one night i've been able to do it and enjoy it immensely.

The headaches and sweating i posted about have gone awaya as well.

Has me feel amazing and nodding for 1-2h hour per dose if i choose to dose higher.

The guy is supposed to be sending me 2g more for free as well because he said their were some complaints about the quality of the last batch.

So i guess instead of doing 2-5mg it will probably be closer to the 1.5mg you see listed online.

Im really happy with this batch. Getting 2g more is gonna be nice.

Loving MAF
Q !57aon8jsJ2 - Tue, 19 Dec 2017 09:41:11 EST ID:TLUtdcp8 No.589937 Ignore Report Quick Reply
the difficult thing about that one is theyll only synth and send me shit that has a cas#. so if i got spirodone theyd send me 10 gs of that. now of course thats where it gets tricky. since to then get the acetylated analog id have to reduce and acetylate that ketone myself. now of course this process wouldnt be an issue at homebake amounts of even probably up to a gram at at time, sadly beyond that until all my glassware arrives i run into serious scalability issues. so for example lets assume on the long end it takes roughly 2 hours of reflux under high acid conditions just to reduce the ketone to its hydroxyl function. then another hour of reflux under aa to ensure full acetylation of the hydroxyl group. now if im only running a gram at a time thats only a three hour process, but if i need to run 10 grams that becomes a 30 hour process. so until my glassware gets here and i can run the whole thing in 3-6 hours it simply is not an option to do myself and since i can only get a cas for spirodone itself thats an issue.

as for 4-fluoropethidine there a 0% chance that one wouldnt be illegal as all fuck in the US. for something similar and probably better see Fluorophen.
Q !57aon8jsJ2 - Tue, 19 Dec 2017 13:50:33 EST ID:TLUtdcp8 No.589943 Ignore Report Quick Reply
also derp af im getting 14-Cinnamoyloxycodeinone not the metopon analog.

so i am getting 10-20 grams of a morphinan analog 177x-301x stronger than morphine. so yup both legal morphinan analogs and legal metopon analogs are here with mdone analogs close behind.
Isabella Chandlehall - Tue, 19 Dec 2017 18:42:17 EST ID:KcJQeKgs No.589957 Ignore Report Quick Reply
sounds delicious I wish I knew where to get some
Baron Von Feelsgood - Tue, 19 Dec 2017 19:41:34 EST ID:wHAvn2tX No.589966 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>mdone analogs close behind
If they manage to create something anywhere even close to dipipanone I will be absolutely fucked.
Dipipanone+Cyclazine (Diconal; AKA Diccies) tablets produce an IV rush when taken orally. Apparently IV Diconal makes IV Palladone (Hydromorphone) feel like codeine.
Thomas Gallerbidging - Tue, 19 Dec 2017 21:40:56 EST ID:KcJQeKgs No.589974 Ignore Report Quick Reply
are there vendors that sell this sort of thing that are relatively easy to find or do you just happen to have a special connect? Not trying to source here just curious as to how people come to posess these exciting new analogues when they have barely even existed yet. Appreciate any insight
Basil Blytheway - Tue, 19 Dec 2017 22:36:29 EST ID:7ED5KlOk No.589977 Ignore Report Quick Reply
That oxycodeinone part sounds good is it available online?
Theophrastus Werrywag - Tue, 19 Dec 2017 23:10:12 EST ID:dRIqV/zS No.589983 Ignore Report Quick Reply
lol almost for definitely not

anything with a morphinan ring in it would not be touched because the morphinan structure is explicitly banned by the UN convention
nz !!vVWR8L52 - Tue, 19 Dec 2017 23:24:57 EST ID:mVyr6SkG No.589989 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I'd never heard that they produced an IV rush when taken orally, but their IV rush is legendary. Diconal and palfium are two I'd love to cross off my list.

The guy from opiophile (rip) Nick, an old English user who had a script for heroin spoke highly of them. Speaking of the scripted freeze dried heroin ampoules, he said they were taking absolutely no new patients for heroin maintenance and were basically they were just waiting for everyone who was prescribed them to die. Funnily enough he switched his heroin ampoules to morphine because he found pure pharm heroin's rush to be "too clean" feeling. Since it's lab made it's not the usual mix you'd get in street gear.
Theophrastus Werrywag - Tue, 19 Dec 2017 23:30:35 EST ID:dRIqV/zS No.589990 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Yeah that's a common "complaint" about pharm grade heroin. It lacks incomplete acetylation found in traditional homebake light tan colour. That's why a lot of people (oldfags in Canada who are more or less clean now) prefer Afghan tan over China white.

6-MAM is apparently more "rush"y than diamorphine.
Baron Von Feelsgood - Tue, 19 Dec 2017 23:59:05 EST ID:wHAvn2tX No.589998 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>anything with a morphinan ring in it would not be touched because the morphinan structure is explicitly banned by the UN convention

So is bundling people you don't like into camps and selling their organs to the highest bidder, but when the fuck has China ever cared about that.


I think a little morphinan ring will go down just fine.
Theophrastus Werrywag - Wed, 20 Dec 2017 00:27:06 EST ID:dRIqV/zS No.590002 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Hmmmm... The Chinese seem to do quite a lot of shady shit in the USA like supplying Californian gangs anti-aircraft missiles for their riots.

Though, from a legal point of view, why risk shipping 1kg of very hard to synthesize morphinan structure which has the same potential for seizure as fentanyl? You could easily do that with fentanyl or any fent analogue to get 10-1000x the profit margins.

Unless, of course, you are aiming for the research chemical market. In that case, the morphinan structure muddies up any defence you're going to give to the border agent (and DEA) reviewing your product for importation. That then falls under the "analogue" category and that compound is way too similar to oxycodeinone to be let into the states.
nz !!vVWR8L52 - Wed, 20 Dec 2017 00:31:31 EST ID:mVyr6SkG No.590003 Ignore Report Quick Reply
more like when has china ever cared? I don't want to point fingers, but they're flooding my country with methamphetamine and the precursors to make it too. I'm very aware that if not them, it'd be someone else. But right now it IS them and I'll point my finger elsewhere when the time comes. It sounds strange, cos I believe everyone should be able to put what they like in their bodies and such within reason. But for half of these idiots, if it wasn't right in front of their faces, they wouldn't be doing it. They're just too stupid. Like when heroin was massively available here it was a huge epidemic. It's not like they were into heroin. It was just there so they did it. Now you've just got people who specifically WANT heroin and seek it out and go to the lengths we go to to use. It's insane how common meth use is here. Since we are so isolated weed and meth make up most peoples drug intake. That's regular users mind you. Not your "take a pill at a festival" student types. When I was hanging in a dirtier crowd, still trying to make my way into the heroin scene here and make a name for myself, I had to hang on the outskirts. Basically heroin users who use a lot of meth and often aren't in or are unpopular with the stand up types who run the scene. The shit I saw during that time was bizarre. I remember a fat polynesian woman smoking an ice pipe while her 5 year old kid sat on the couch next to her. Meanwhile there's a line leading up to her of people holding cash, laptops, phones etc. All waiting to get served. To think I used to feel awkward busting out my spoon or doing a homebake with the kid in the house since it was two rooms. Bedroom and then kitchen & lounge combo. Like I could be standing at the stove and oven and if I fell backwards I'd probably sit on the kid.

nb, not at all opiate related but I've started now; our previous government was bending over backwards for the Chinese. It was pretty lame. Like you could buy a passport. It was that black and white. They dressed it up as "If you have $xxxx to invest in New Zealand you will be granted citizenship" but it was what it was. As a result we now have people who have never set foot in the country and never will who own our homes. My home is owned by someone in China, who's never even seen it. he/she/it deals through a Chinese intermediary with whom you can barely communivate. His grasp of English rapdily deteriorates when it comes to subjects like a landlords obligations. Broken window? "Oh the glass is smashed, sure, but it's still hanging in the frame. No need to replace that"
Q !57aon8jsJ2 - Wed, 20 Dec 2017 00:36:38 EST ID:DyCz7y9R No.590005 Ignore Report Quick Reply
nailed it. china told me if its got a cas # and doesnt fall under sched 1 of the US or UN drug policies they will ship it to me. this shit is coming from an online vendor from china. they have a clearnet website but without some serious hinting bordering on sourcing i couldnt tell you how to find them. for peeps whove been following my posts this is the same chinese place that sent me 3-me-fuf, 3-ho-pcp, and a few other things.

also for the chemfags

ime and in most others experience -inone>-one>-ine

so like with oxymorphone for example you have oxymorphinone>oxymorphone>oxymorphine

thats ultra simplified but ye.

pretty much china has said we dont give a fuck.

oxycodeinone for example would almost for sure fall under the UN banned list and probs the US banned list too so they would not ship me that
Theophrastus Werrywag - Wed, 20 Dec 2017 01:00:01 EST ID:dRIqV/zS No.590006 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Now THAT is incredibly interesting. 1 because I've actually never ordered anything directly from China (our border agency is much more strict than the states for some weird reason) and 2. because 14-cinnamoyloxycodeinone is 1 reaction (shake with NaOH) away from oxycodeinone. Oxycodeinone itself I have tried with very nice results. It's essentially a weaker, weirder version of oxycodone. Still stronger than codeine but more stimulating.

20g of 14-cinnamoyloxycodeinone seems to be way too good to be true but I also wouldn't risk charges for that kind of importation. Maybe it's easier in the states? Especially in 1994 to get some of those sweet, sweet Shahab-2 missiles.
Theophrastus Werrywag - Wed, 20 Dec 2017 01:06:22 EST ID:dRIqV/zS No.590007 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Man that is still one of the saddest things about the drug scene. I wonder why it's always obese people and stimulants, though. I remember a similar type of structure as you described copping coke from this 300lb native's house in Upper Canada. He poured out what must've been half a g of coke or meth or speed, railed it with a kid in one hand, handed my friend the kid (since she was a girl or whatever), and left for an hour. We kinda just chilled for what felt like a week and he returned with equally sized bags of coke for us and we gave him the kid back. Drugs are weird.

In any case, we have a similar landlord situation in British Colombia and they're finally cracking down on foreign investors. I guess the issue is that New Zealand is too one-nation so if two people get corrupted, there goes your whole government. Whereas over here, China would have to bribe the BC law-makers AND the Alberta+prariries / Maritimes / Ontario/ Frenchie lawmakers in order to fully stop their ability to invest in BC real estate. Something the obviously couldn't pull off so now the rich, Monopoly chinks don't have that much power anymore.

They still control the fent and fent-anaolgue scene here though. Sometimes when I see a 20 year old drive around in the big city with a lambo or ferrari, I wonder if that vehicle was bought with the lives of Vancouver opioid addicts.
Alice Billinghall - Wed, 20 Dec 2017 01:46:56 EST ID:bSWLyrXk No.590009 Ignore Report Quick Reply
1513752416489.jpg -(177714B / 173.55KB, 1200x882) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
Bumping 3mg more MAF, tolerance already rising a bit.

Loving it though.
Alice Billinghall - Wed, 20 Dec 2017 01:47:43 EST ID:bSWLyrXk No.590010 Ignore Report Quick Reply
i loved u4.
Q !57aon8jsJ2 - Wed, 20 Dec 2017 02:39:51 EST ID:DyCz7y9R No.590015 Ignore Report Quick Reply
missed a step there bud. ya know the one where u add the 14-cinnamoyl ester to the then freed 14-hydroxyl functional ala adding aa to morphine to saturate the open 3,6 hydroxyls with acetyls. but yah basically they synth isnt anything stupid hard from oxycodeinone.

inb4 hurdur just because a morphinan has an open hydroxyl doesnt make AA magic bbq sauce that will add an acetyl at that open hydroxyl. No not always as it depends on conformation, rotation, the other functional groups present and some other complicated shit.

but guess what.

add any ACYL ACID like ACETIC ANYHYDRIDE to a morphinan with open hydroxy groups and guess what? like a magic BBQ sauce it DOES add an ACYL group to that hydroxy. creating the X-hydroxy-ACYL-ester-morphinan u wanted. take morphine to heroin

Adding ACETIC ANHYDRIDE to morphine creates the 3,6-diacetyl-morphine ester of morphine. So adding Cinnamoyl Anhydride to morphine would make what? protip the 3,6-DiCinnamoyl-morphine ester.

in this case they are probably using cinnamoyl anhydride to add the 14-cinnamoyl to the open 14-hydroxy.
Theophrastus Werrywag - Wed, 20 Dec 2017 05:47:16 EST ID:dRIqV/zS No.590022 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Wait what. I'm saying it's one basification from that molecule to 14-oxycodeinone (a controlled substance). Then you might make a little tasty sodium cinnamaldehyde salt, too.

Morphinan with open hydroxyl is still morphinan. And you can still acetylate it to that stupid molecule that I really wanna try one day: di-acetyl-oxymorphone enol acetate.

Anyway, yes. Any anhydride does that OH thing. Like nicotinic anhydride. Or mesylic anhydride. di-mesylic morphine would probably be stronger than di-acetyl morphine, too since it's more lipid soluble and a better leaving group. Or maybe not... Who knows.
Q !57aon8jsJ2 - Wed, 20 Dec 2017 10:56:14 EST ID:DyCz7y9R No.590030 Ignore Report Quick Reply
oh i see what you are saying i think. your talking about removing the cinnamoyl group via naoh while im talking about already having the 14-hydroxy open for adding the cinnamoyl group. the 3,6 esters for morphine arent only tricky and complicated just because of being a better leaving group or not but also because of how the ester fits into the actual mu receptor. thats why n-phenethyl tails tend to make most opis stronger than a simple methyl but the receptor is very picky about the size shape and rotation of those tails. hence why changing the n-methyl to an n-allyl changes most morphinans into the corresponding antagonist (like with naloxone), same thing with changing the n-methyl to n-methyl-cyclopropylmethyl, in that case instead of an antag you get a mixed partial agonist like buprenorphine.
Bombastus Werrywag - Wed, 20 Dec 2017 16:41:10 EST ID:4QjF3vEe No.590052 Ignore Report Quick Reply
That was what I found most surprising tbh. The fact that you can just get 14-oxycodeinone (a pretty potent semi-synthetic opiate in its own respect) with a simple NaOH shake from this "research chemical".

In terms of binding affinity, I'll yield to you on that one. That's when I stopped paying attention in pharmacology...
Thomas de Queasy - Wed, 20 Dec 2017 21:32:15 EST ID:LJnKjWVA No.590074 Ignore Report Quick Reply
To be honest I'm not fond of IV H myself. Of course I've only shot it when it was worthwhile, which is pretty damn rare here, but it had even less of a rush than oxy does ime. I had to wait till morning withdrawals to feel good from it. Felt like morphine IV'ed after taking an antihistaminic, not pins and needles, no warmth, no itching, not my thing. Oddly I'm rather very fond of IV oxy, because of the sweet ass head rush it carries with the doses I do (160-280mg).
Cyril Honeywell - Sat, 30 Dec 2017 22:59:17 EST ID:eD0EfubV No.590444 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Where do you live?
Do you source off the darknetmarkets or some Chinese vendor
Jenny Becklefuck - Tue, 02 Jan 2018 00:06:48 EST ID:NVDL4q8W No.590540 Ignore Report Quick Reply
yeah, but it won't last

Any RC drug that's even remotely good is bound to be b& by the feds

>tfw no more methoxetamine

when that shit went dry it hit /dis/ hard mang.
Rebecca Smallwell - Fri, 12 Jan 2018 21:44:43 EST ID:KQ+AJR/E No.590989 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Derluft !oCyNK.1Qtc - Sat, 13 Jan 2018 05:50:03 EST ID:u1VUIVNa No.590997 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>TFW MAF is 'legal' in Canada & the U.K. but not in the U.S., yet 4-MAF is 'legal' in the U.S. but not Canada & the U.K.
Barnaby Pigglelock - Mon, 15 Jan 2018 13:29:56 EST ID:7txR8LCW No.591064 Ignore Report Quick Reply
MAF is illegal in the UK under the The Psychoactive Substances Act 2016
Molly Sallyshaw - Mon, 15 Jan 2018 14:04:44 EST ID:KjeGFb8a No.591065 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Do these rc's show up on drug tests?
Derluft !oCyNK.1Qtc - Mon, 15 Jan 2018 15:42:41 EST ID:u1VUIVNa No.591069 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Thank you for correcting me; I really do appreciate it.
Maybe it was a different country I was thinking of?.. But, still, the RC game it FUCKING crazy as far as legality goes.


Well, if a test is fir fent and you have a fent RC in your system; what do you think? - After all, for the 'legal' ones to be sold legally they have to say: "Not for human consumption."

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