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How Obama Will Get Imprisoned by Hedda Bunman - Wed, 08 Mar 2017 16:18:41 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.388993 Ignore Report Quick Reply
File: 1489007921270.jpg -(1727026B / 1.65MB, 4096x2731) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. 1727026
Been looking at the news regarding Trump's claim that Obama wiretapped Trump Tower, and noticed something disturbing.

The GOP....all of them apparently, are willing to investigate this matter. Yet, they have repeatedly shown little to no interest in regards to Russian meddling in the election and Jeff Sessions' blatant perjury.

Theory - The GOP will use the claims of wiretapping to create a "Super-Benghazi" style investigation. The goal will be to simply distract from the shit show that is the GOP right now. The investigation will reach "Ken Starr," levels of investigation. Meaning they will just keep the investigation going and switch focus in an attempt to come up with SOME dirt on Obama that they can make an issue out of. At some point, they will be forced to charge Obama with what will most certainly be either a false-charge, or something unrelated to the actual issue (like Clinton got caught on.) With the majority being the judge and jury in this case, Obama will most likely go to prison. You can also replace HRC with Obama, although they seem to have cooled on her for now.

tl;dr - Trump will lock Obama up over nothing so his shenanigans go unnoticed.
>>
Martha Hommledock - Wed, 08 Mar 2017 18:09:32 EST ID:8I3ViJfk No.389002 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>388993
Even if Obama did something worth locking him up for, which I doubt he did, it would never come to that. That just doesn't happen these days. Or ever as far as I know.

Trump's handlers will definitely be doing some misdirection, finger pointing and smoke screen stuff though, since that's just the way politics work in the US.
>>
Oliver Blunnerhood - Wed, 08 Mar 2017 18:34:45 EST ID:6POwg5Ik No.389003 Ignore Report Quick Reply
They are just distracting people with this bullshit so people can forgot about all the fuck ups, our current fucks trump is going through at the moment.
>>
Phoebe Mublingwell - Wed, 08 Mar 2017 19:01:22 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389004 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389003
True. My point is that the need for more and more cover will eventually drive them to have to create a perpetual crisis. Obama seems a likely patsy for this. Or HRC.
>>
Reuben Cizzletack - Wed, 08 Mar 2017 19:03:01 EST ID:PjpzCQWM No.389005 Ignore Report Quick Reply
This belongs in /tinfoil/
>>
Phoebe Mublingwell - Wed, 08 Mar 2017 20:19:06 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389011 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389005
OK...OK...I'll pull back a bit. I just want this to be a speculation thread.

What I am wondering is this -

So far, Trump has managed to basically create a weekly crisis. And he then blames someone else. Be it HRC or Obama or whomever. The logical conclusion, if this continues unabated, is Obama or someone being charged on Trumped Up (LOL! HIS NAME IS A PUN! GET IT!?!) charges. Charges that Trump must pursue if he follows his current trajectory.

I mean, this guy, at this point, is literally looking at being the defendant in the most slam-dunk slander case ever presented. There is no way Trump could win against him being sued by Obama. And, apparently, Obama's people have met with Trump people as of today. I am 100% sure they are saying, "Fuck your guy if he doesn't apologize right now. Trump used his authority as president to claim Obama committed a felony. Trump is so fucked in court if it goes that way. And I doubt Obama is going to back down. Trump has been fucking with him for years.
>>
Basil Doblingsug - Wed, 08 Mar 2017 21:00:00 EST ID:lKQJmFVW No.389012 Ignore Report Quick Reply
1489024800632.png -(138075B / 134.84KB, 500x672) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>389011
What's that Lassie? Liberals want to open up the libel laws now? This is N-dimension Yu-gi-oh, you can't still be activating trap cards anymore.
>>
Phoebe Mublingwell - Wed, 08 Mar 2017 23:14:48 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389018 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389012
No...
I just pointed out that Trump actually managed to get to our very high standard, and commit libel or slander or whatever a Tweet counts as...

Trump wants to loosen the standards, because people say shit that he doesn't like, but are either true or protected opinions/commentary.

When the ACTUAL FUCKING PRESIDENT says THIS GUY COMMITTED THIS VERY SPECIFIC FELONY, and leave it at that....

Yeah, you are kind of gonna get fucked by our laws. Why? Because you are literally the person whom would be privy to that info now. And you spoke from a position of authority that would (and I am sure has in some parts,) make people believe that Obama tapped Trump's phones.

That is like the town sheriff saying, "Basil Doblingsug went to prison for 5 years for kiddie rape." If he makes that statement, and it is false, and he either knows it or should be reasonably assumed to know this information by others, then holy shit, that is exactly what our laws are meant to stop. If he had said, "I kind of think Basil looks like a kiddy diddler," then it falls into opinion. Which is straight free speech.
>>
Oliver Henningwudging - Wed, 08 Mar 2017 23:39:03 EST ID:WQQ+NOb5 No.389021 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>388993
you get worked up very easily. obama is not going to jail, just like clinton didn't go to jail either. maybe you should provide evidence to support your claim of "The GOP....all of them apparently, are willing to investigate this matter." Or did you run into a bunch of quotes that don't really support it?

http://www.cnn.com/2017/03/05/politics/white-house-spicer-congress-2016/
>Sen. Susan Collins said Sunday morning that she has "seen no evidence" to back up Trump's wiretapping allegation and called on the White House to turn over any evidence to the committee. "What we need to deal with is evidence, not statements."

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/03/congress-trump-wiretaps-obama-russia/518730/
>Both House Speaker Paul Ryan and Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell were silent on the president’s accusation

>Richard Burr of North Carolina, was even more noncommittal. The committee, he said, “will follow the evidence where it leads, and we will continue to be guided by the intelligence and facts as we compile our findings.”

If you're worried about people getting fooled by Trump's tweet, well, welcome to america. Mouth breathing knuckle draggers got the guy elected, so they are willing to fall for anything. Nothing you can do about that, except maybe raise the standard of educatio--- never mind.

You're getting distracted from the fact that Republicans aren't taking the investigation of Russian interference seriously enough. That's what you should be outraged about.
>>
Caroline Fanfield - Thu, 09 Mar 2017 03:28:05 EST ID:1/zhancf No.389025 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>388993
>the GOP....all of them apparently, are willing to investigate this matter.

Obama is not touchable because he ran the presidency with ethics,
as will allow.

Remember recent trump/fox news, oh " i heard it on fox."

Fox is still fucked. It should have or did not make 'it' make an exclamation.
Which claim(s?) I just heard it on fox,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, I think

If so, FOX OWNS TRUMP, RIGHT? Insanity, that they will or would not
just say things just aren't working out well.

I barfed off fox before when it went to the 'crying' for out country, gave it even a bit of time after.
No difference to today.

Ohh wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, trump said we are weak, helpless, hated in the literally entire world. HELPLESSS, VULNERABLE,

It has spoke little of obama, why , no reason to , or possibility. Again, wiretap, was 'before'
elections, now it comes up; suddenly now.

Has no even relevant possibilities that it could have happened.
-------------

For not-much laughs, but, it is different. As per it's non-ever-happened.
So 'it' is taxing out justice system. He asked, i guess, to hide FBI stuffs. Right?
----
No president was really ever asked to hide FBI stuff, as well though, the CIA,
there are conflicts, the CIA is an international device, which as well as the FBI.
Noted obvious issues with these come up from time to time.

As we know, issues with Russia, (putin) is a disaster t best. I stated waaay back the this trump, that Putin has motives we do not really understand completely.

As well putin has been silent,
>>
Edwin Pabblekore - Thu, 09 Mar 2017 06:56:56 EST ID:3kbOm9ef No.389028 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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Seems like the corporate media is backing Obama & calling Trump "paranoid"

OP is wrong again
>>
James Worthingwell - Thu, 09 Mar 2017 08:13:46 EST ID:RT2A1jif No.389030 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389025
>For not-much laughs, but, it is different. As per it's non-ever-happened.

You should really get a publisher, I could see you single-handedly bringing back modernism.
>>
Phoebe Mublingwell - Thu, 09 Mar 2017 16:59:40 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389042 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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So, yeah, ummm....this happened.

http://www.salon.com/2017/03/09/jeff-sessions-may-order-independent-investigation-of-barack-obamas-department-of-justice/

So, Sessions is calling for an investigation of Obama's DOJ. With an independent prosecutor. Which is how Clinton got fucked.

Meanwhile, Sessions seems to be balls deep in his own perjury scandal which the GOP is ignoring.

I mean, the GOP won't investigate Trump. We have seen this. At least not seriously, since this happened - https://www.washingtonpost.com/powerpost/house-intelligence-chairman-denies-evidence-of-trump-teams-ties-to-russia/2017/02/27/66495ce8-fcfd-11e6-99b4-9e613afeb09f_story.html?utm_term=.607b324f335e

The old "Nothing to see here, folks!" line. Kind of funny how they somehow managed to come to a conclusion at the START of the investigation.

And they are STILL going after Hillary...
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/01/20/jason-chaffetz-investigation-continues.html

How does this end then? It either ends in arrests, or....what????
>>
Polly Ceblingson - Thu, 09 Mar 2017 18:06:24 EST ID:MBZ+rwoO No.389050 Ignore Report Quick Reply
No, I think you have it back the front.

President can be impeached for absurd conduct, and publicly accusing the last guy of serious crimes with absolutely no evidence can fall under that depending on how congress is feeling.

Now, there are plenty of senators (Some of whom were never on the "Trump Train" for real) who want to look into it to find evidence of his claim...or lack thereof.

They know there's no evidence. They want to have a public investigation to show as much. Then they can go from there.

Also, there are investigations into the Russia situation in congress.
>>
Nicholas Dridgedale - Thu, 09 Mar 2017 20:59:26 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389064 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389050
The House is solidly Trump Train. So, he is unimpeachable.

I mean, seriously, with all the shit he has pulled, the GOP is too far in to back out now. They are in this to the bitter end. Shit, make jailing HRC and Obama a campaign promise for the midterms, and they will probably sweep the elections.
>>
Wesley Feblingpane - Sun, 12 Mar 2017 15:42:23 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389200 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Well, this is happening...
http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/house-intelligence-panel-wants-wiretapping-evidence-monday-n732451

If he can't produce it, what will they do?
>>
Augustus Grimshit - Sun, 12 Mar 2017 22:11:33 EST ID:+aDLuXvG No.389201 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>389042
>And they are STILL going after Hillary...
Omg why are they still bothering that career criminal and serial liar???
Fucking racist Republicans!
>>
Augustus Grimshit - Sun, 12 Mar 2017 22:13:45 EST ID:+aDLuXvG No.389202 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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DICKS EVERYWHERE
>>
Augustus Grimshit - Sun, 12 Mar 2017 22:15:54 EST ID:+aDLuXvG No.389203 Ignore Report Quick Reply
1489371354028.png -(993281B / 970.00KB, 1246x1248) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
DICKS EVERYWHERE
>>
Nigel Waddlenire - Mon, 13 Mar 2017 09:11:41 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389215 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389203
So, you want HRC in prison? How about Obama?
>>
Phineas Gommerhood - Mon, 13 Mar 2017 10:09:24 EST ID:QK8mfsjv No.389219 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389215

Throw in his entire administration, and the Bush administration, and the Clinton administration, and we have a deal
>>
Nell Blatherridge - Mon, 13 Mar 2017 12:14:35 EST ID:sMjBd+5i No.389227 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389201
My god...a politician getting something from Russia, and then rewarding them with lucrative government contracts??? Who would do such a thing??
https://www.desmogblog.com/2017/02/28/trump-american-steel-russia-putin-fracking

>>389202
My god...a politician accepting money, but keeping the identities of the donors...a SECRET?? Who would do such a thing???
http://charlotteobserver.relaymedia.com/amp/news/politics-government/article126518069.html

>>389203
My god...a government official hung around with someone who ABUSED CHILDREN??? WHO WOULD DO-
http://www.dailywire.com/news/5556/7-things-you-need-know-about-trump-and-sex-slave-amanda-prestigiacomo
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/02/alexander-acosta-trump-jeffrey-epstein-plea-235096
http://nypost.com/2016/10/09/the-sex-slave-scandal-that-exposed-pedophile-billionaire-jeffrey-epstein/
>>
Martin Denderstock - Mon, 13 Mar 2017 19:50:14 EST ID:lKQJmFVW No.389245 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389227
They're going to bring up Acosta's involvement with Epstien's sweetheart deal in Congress Wednesday. To this day, he has not given a satisfactory answer, dis gon be gud. This is going to break mainstream.
>>
Rebecca Brisslestit - Tue, 14 Mar 2017 13:46:23 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389276 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389245
Well, the DOJ wants "more time," to "prove" that Obama tapped Trump.

Is this where stuff will end up being manufactured?
>>
Matilda Blivingdidge - Wed, 15 Mar 2017 01:29:46 EST ID:0dJZtcm2 No.389312 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389276
anything the keeps the DoJ busy investigating stuff unrelated to throwing weed growers and dab makers in jail is fine by me. obama failed to legalize it when he had the chance even though he knew it was the right thing to do, so he can take one for the team this time.
>>
Reuben Facklewit - Wed, 15 Mar 2017 04:50:30 EST ID:OsjB8IHC No.389317 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389021
>>Both House Speaker Paul Ryan and Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell
>>were silent on the president’s accusation

They are part of this as much as those who wan't to openly pursue it.
It is 100% BS. If it was a concern then it would have been brought up
a long ass time ago. What he has no security at the whatever towers?

If 'it' got tapped why not bring it up at the time. As well the what
millions fradualant votes. The fake news list. Total scumbag.

Wealthy, but pretty dumb, all around dumb.
>>
Wesley Funnerridge - Wed, 15 Mar 2017 14:36:25 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389336 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389317
Well, looks like Trump will get his way on this. They will waste time on this, and then just let him get a pass for slandering Obama.

Expect more lies and lies on top of lies to get ignored by the GOP.
>>
Samuel Fanway - Fri, 17 Mar 2017 18:30:01 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389448 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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OK, this shit is getting WEIRD.

Like, WTF, WEIRD.... And I have taken a heroic amount of psychedelics in my life, so I know weird. This is fucking Robert Anton Wilson and Philip K Dick levels of weird...

Now, all of a sudden, the Brits were working for Obama.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/17/world/europe/trump-britain-obama-wiretap-gchq.html?_r=0

Then we apologized....
NOT!

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/17/world/europe/trump-britain-obama-wiretap-gchq.html?_r=0

WTF is going on here?
>>
Cyril Channerbeck - Fri, 17 Mar 2017 18:38:38 EST ID:MBZ+rwoO No.389449 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389018

Yep. Trump basically opened himself up for a libel suit if Obama decided to go for it.
>>
Cyril Channerbeck - Fri, 17 Mar 2017 18:40:16 EST ID:MBZ+rwoO No.389450 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389448

Trump needs to find a scenario that involves Obama ordering spying on him which cannot be disproved, or else his actions in accusing Obama when he knew there was no evidence could potentially fall under presidential misconduct, which he could be impeached for.
>>
Jack Grandwill - Fri, 17 Mar 2017 19:11:46 EST ID:jZaiCIh4 No.389454 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>389450

Ding! Ding! Ding! This hit me on the shitter this morning. He/his team is obfuscating like a motherfucker. This whole thing is a smokescreen for his gigantic fuck up and: he knows it, i know it, and i think anyone who's ever played zerg in starcraft knows it.
>>
Nigel Dazzleham - Sat, 18 Mar 2017 00:14:53 EST ID:b2+Yo/sQ No.389469 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389450
>>389454
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/gop-rep-trump-owes-obama-apology-for-reckless-wiretap-claim/ar-BByhvMy?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartanntp
"The president has already been very clear that he didn't mean specifically wiretapping. He had it in quotes."

Wow, he could have fooled me. He certainly fooled all of you. He even fooled republicans; they really thought he was being serious.
>>
Clara Blazzlestone - Sat, 18 Mar 2017 00:50:26 EST ID:ocfgTAf6 No.389470 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389469
He has been using quotes in his recent twitter posts. Its a lame attempt at reconcilation.
>>
William Boddleway - Sat, 18 Mar 2017 12:39:06 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389488 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389469
He is saying it was in quotes, but that some kind of illegal thing happened surveillance-wise.

Now he claims the Brits spied on him for Obama.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/17/world/europe/trump-britain-obama-wiretap-gchq.html

The really SERIOUS issue here is that 50% of the nation seems to BELIEVE this shit!
>>
Clara Blazzlestone - Sat, 18 Mar 2017 13:51:22 EST ID:ocfgTAf6 No.389491 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389488
It's the emperor with no clothes. People pretending that quotes exist in his twitter post when there aren't any. He knows he fucked up. Everyone knew he'd bumble it up once he got in. Even if it was quoted, that doesn't change what he said.
>>
Emma Crammerhetch - Sat, 18 Mar 2017 14:42:02 EST ID:Ja8lL575 No.389492 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389491
Well, it's doing enough to distract the other 50% from some serious bullshit, so...
>>
William Boddleway - Sat, 18 Mar 2017 15:54:31 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389498 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389492
Thing is, in 4 years, I could see 70-80 percent of the people thinking Obama surveiled him.
>>
Sophie Fusslestirk - Sat, 18 Mar 2017 16:01:40 EST ID:NY3ouz89 No.389499 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389488
50% of the nation believes whatever its leadership says because they "fall in line." The right isn't exactly known for its free thinkers, which is one reason the left is so fragmented as well (because it is less authoritarian).

How do you wake these people up, and convince them to shed those millions of tons of pride they have preventing them from redacting an opinion or - God forbid - disagreeing with their leader?
>>
Priscilla Fuckingwell - Sat, 18 Mar 2017 16:55:02 EST ID:SV4eH2hC No.389502 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389488

Gosh, really? People find it plausible that a president who expanded the surveillance-state might have used those powers to monitor political opponents... using the same legal workarounds that were exposed by whistle blowers?

That's amazing. I can't believe it. I never thought mass surveillance would have negative effects.
>>
Clara Blazzlestone - Sat, 18 Mar 2017 17:03:50 EST ID:ocfgTAf6 No.389505 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389502
Reminder: Trump can use a single phone call to prove his statement. Instead of receiving a possible presidential misconduct, he could prove a crime against Obama.
>>
William Boddleway - Sat, 18 Mar 2017 17:24:19 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389506 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389502
You think the microwave is taking your picture, don't you?
>>
Priscilla Fuckingwell - Sat, 18 Mar 2017 17:35:53 EST ID:SV4eH2hC No.389507 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389505

Well obviously Trump's a liar and is just deflecting from his own bad press.

But you know, there's a moral authority issue here. I'm saying I don't find it surprising that people believe a story that matches pretty well with what we've found out. I'm not a Trump fan, I just don't find it offensive that people are worrying about surveillance's effect on the political process, and I don't find it hard to believe that folks would buy into a story like Trump's.

>>389506

Not really, no reason to. But IOT security is legitimately terrible, and I won't be surprised when we find out that activists are being monitored through IOT devices in the next decade.
>>
Clara Blazzlestone - Sat, 18 Mar 2017 17:45:41 EST ID:ocfgTAf6 No.389508 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389507
I get what you mean. Surveillance happens in our government. It's part of the natural order of things now. But believing that Obama did something, while anything is possible, is silly based on Trump not vindicating himself with proof.

It's entirely baseless and Trumps behaviors just adds to the ridiculousness of the entire claim.
>>
Priscilla Fuckingwell - Sat, 18 Mar 2017 17:52:40 EST ID:SV4eH2hC No.389509 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389508

It's also ridiculous when democrats are like "well that's against the law. People in charge would never break the law! It could never happen!" when everyone knows damn well that there are multiple legal workarounds.
>>
Clara Blazzlestone - Sat, 18 Mar 2017 18:16:19 EST ID:ocfgTAf6 No.389510 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389509
Well, he's the man in charge, so he could now get the information that he wants. For him not to prove it means he randomly stated something as fact without using any sources. He most likely pulled this from Breitbart. We have a president that receives his news, not from briefings, but from FOX.

This isn't a democrat thing. Even McCain is calling him out on this shit.

I know very few dems that didn't understand that Obama pulled some shit. He was a mixed bag and we knew it. But to pull an allegation like this from his buttox is an entirely separate situation than what you are bringing up.
>>
David Devingston - Sun, 19 Mar 2017 00:03:46 EST ID:QK8mfsjv No.389517 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389510

Don't forget that he watches hours of television a day including the garbage on CNN and etc
>>
Graham Cackleham - Sun, 19 Mar 2017 00:40:02 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389520 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389517
So, wait...
Is Trump in some sort of weird feedback loop?
Revving higher and higher until it is just a piercing scream nobody can bear?
>>
David Devingston - Sun, 19 Mar 2017 09:25:05 EST ID:QK8mfsjv No.389532 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389520

He's basically a black hole of narcissism
>>
Beatrice Nickleson - Tue, 21 Mar 2017 14:08:05 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389630 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Well, it is now written fact that Trump falsely accused Obama of violating his civil rights.

The GOP continues to allow this continue though for some reason. Trump refuses to apologize, and has even brought the UK into this mess.

Seriously, he could get caught anally pounding Ivanka on the White House lawn, and nobody would say a word...
>>
Eugene Drishlatch - Tue, 21 Mar 2017 14:22:11 EST ID:PFgT42i1 No.389631 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I thought it was hilariously childish how he tried to use it as an awkward bonding token with fucking angela merkel after all the shit he's talked about her lol. "hey we both were wire tapped hue hue hue" then ignores her when she asks for a handshake. what a big baby
>>
Caroline Billinghall - Tue, 21 Mar 2017 16:08:22 EST ID:RT2A1jif No.389635 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389631
Trump may be the reason I'll be forced to vote for Merkel in November. I disagree with most of what she stands for, especially w/r/t economic policy, but I just can't see someone without experience deal with the international relations nightmare Europe is going through rn.
>>
Ernest Bepperstock - Tue, 21 Mar 2017 16:32:29 EST ID:wCbmVqz0 No.389640 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389635
Are you actually a registered voter in Germany? I'm curious who your first pick would have been?
>>
Caroline Billinghall - Tue, 21 Mar 2017 17:36:30 EST ID:RT2A1jif No.389642 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389640
You don't need to register as a voter in Germany, as long as youre a citizen you get a letter with the date and place to vote and that's that.

I'm pro-union (both of the European and the Labor variety), pro-trade and very sceptical of the German austerity policies in the wake of the Great Recession, but the German fear of nuclear power and GMOs seems excessive to me, so I'm probably most at home with the Social Democrats (who I'm probably going to join next year when I know where I'll live after getting my degree). The thing is, their only chance to get into power is a broad left-wing coalition with the Green party and the heirs of the East German state party, both of which have some good ideas but are also weirdly regressive and populist in a bunch of ways. I'm worried they'll use their influence to drag the country into some unfortunate directions regarding trade and relations with Russia, as well as encouraging sticking with all those dumb agricultural subsidies on the European level.

On the other hand, it's really obvious that European austerity measures, which are in large part shaped by Germany, don't work, and the current government is a big obstacle on the path towards modernizing the Union - that's not going to change if Merkel remains chancellor unless Schäuble, our minister of finance, kicks the bucket within the next year. So on that front it'd be really nice to get someone who recognizes that the Union isn't working for everyone and takes steps to amend that and helps build up countries like Italy and Greece to the point where we don't need to worry about them falling apart every couple of years.

To wrap up this unnecessarily elaborate post, Merkel has dealt with Putin, Erdogan, Orban, Kaczynski, even Berlusconi for years - her presence is invaluable in navigating the situation in Europe. So right now I'm willing to take four years of nothing happening over an administration that isn't able to properly implement progressive policies because it keeps getting sidetracked by international distractions.
>>
Basil Bunhood - Tue, 21 Mar 2017 21:26:27 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389645 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389642
So, in other words, you have some nuanced decisions to make here? In part, because there are many viable parties to choose from.

Jesus, fuck America needs some of that....
>>
Esther Brundlebot - Tue, 21 Mar 2017 22:18:29 EST ID:RT2A1jif No.389651 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389645
It basically boils down to FPTP being cancer. I've never seen a single argument in favour of it from someone who didn't benefit from the system.
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Matilda Dennergold - Tue, 21 Mar 2017 23:27:16 EST ID:sUBj56yv No.389652 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389651
Yep, basically.
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Augustus Dinningdale - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 19:04:05 EST ID:uYcRvKjb No.389674 Ignore Report Quick Reply
So everyone who thought Trump's story was implausible, has your view changed after today now that Nunes says he's seen it, and Kucinich has said a tap of his own line was leaked after "incidental collection"?
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Nicholas Snodbanks - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 19:44:08 EST ID:ocfgTAf6 No.389678 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389674
Source? And seen what, exactly?

I don't understand why Trump doesn't just make a couple phone calls and prove it. It makes no sense.
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Soviet Psychonaut - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 19:44:34 EST ID:2TfYxlWB No.389679 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389674

But agreeing with Trump is implausible, CNN told me so.
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Simon Crorrystone - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 19:49:28 EST ID:WQQ+NOb5 No.389680 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389674
no. Nunes himself said there wasn't a tap: "I've always said there wasn't a physical a tap of trump tower. I still have no evidence to show that, at all."
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Simon Crorrystone - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 19:51:21 EST ID:WQQ+NOb5 No.389681 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389678
http://www.cnn.com/2017/03/22/politics/devin-nunes-trump-communications/

dude probably found some sensational headline on a fake news site and didn't bother reading the rest of the story. nunes explicitly states this doesn't back up trump's claim.
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Eliza Dugglemire - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 19:51:45 EST ID:NY3ouz89 No.389682 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389680
EVERYBODY in the USA is subject to "incidental collection." The whole god damned country is monitored clandestinely, Nunes' bullshit means nothing.
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Fanny Guvingbury - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 20:00:07 EST ID:uYcRvKjb No.389684 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389678

The Nunes story is literally everywhere, I'll let you pick your own source. The Kucinich story is here http://thehill.com/media/323846-dennis-kucinich-on-trumps-wiretap-charge-it-happened-to-me

>>389682

Oh well, we're all being monitored. No big deal then. I can't see how that would be toxic to the political process.

I love how the left has become ok with the security state in all this. Wtf is even happening? It's all authoritarian right and authoritarian center left now I guess.
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Soviet Psychonaut - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 20:23:06 EST ID:2TfYxlWB No.389688 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>389682
The whole narrative so far was trump team may have been side watched unintentionally due to russia. Nunes is saying that this particular information was collected had nothing to do with Russia, so why was it collected through FISA in the first place? Did hillary recieve the same sort of scrutiny?

We're witnessing the republic transition into an empire. Strap yourselves in.
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Esther Sengerpad - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 20:34:29 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389690 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389684
Dude, STFU.

Nobody is going "SECURITY STATE YAY!"

First off, the incidental collection was from shit like Trump associates calling the god damn fucking Russian Ambassador. Now, why is he tapped? Because, he is also a known spy. So, stuff like that...the very particular monitoring of known foreign agents who are hostile...and also whom are monitoring us...is the stuff that all but the most patchouli soaked liberal will allow. It is demand lest we be destroyed.

That is far different from a "surveillance state." The handful of legit targets for this kind of thing are very particular. You pretty much have to be a shady fuck from Shadyfuckistan who is working for King Shady Fucker IV. If this was about Trump calling his MD to get boner pill refills, then I'd have some questions about why we know this shit. But, when a Shady Fuck calls another Shady Fuck and then things simultaneously get all fucky....naw dude. I'm kind of surprised they didn't have a constant tap on Trump and his accountant. You know he cheats like mad on his taxes....
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Esther Sengerpad - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 20:41:20 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389691 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389688
Nunes isn't exactly credible. In the same conference he said that this vindicated Trump's claims of being surveilled and also did NOT vindicate them. Like, two minutes apart.

He also ran straight to Trump with this info before telling the Dems on the committee. That fucks up any investigation as to why Trump folks were talking to Shady McShaderson and his buddy Slim.
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Fanny Guvingbury - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 20:41:28 EST ID:uYcRvKjb No.389692 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389690

> Nobody is going "SECURITY STATE YAY!"
> we should have a constant tap on the political opposition
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Soviet Psychonaut - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 20:49:59 EST ID:2TfYxlWB No.389694 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>389690

Also, the important thing is the "unmasking". The NSA collects a shitload of conversations in bulk in case it's evidence of something, in that way it's incidental. Then agencies can ask to access those collections based on one of the participants (i.e. using a warrant/order). If the guy you're investigating has a conversation with someone you don't know and you consider them of interest you can ask for that persons identity to be unmasked and then search for all conversations that person has had with others, conversations that were just collected incidentally.

The incidental word they're trying to use as a diversion, the really important word is unmask. If they did that to collect information about Trump or his team they're fucked. They did it this way because it gives plausible deniability if they can dream up a reason why they are a person of interest.
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Soviet Psychonaut - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 20:51:09 EST ID:2TfYxlWB No.389695 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389691
You're right, but perhaps it can also indicate that the committee is compromised? That's the only rationale I can see from the other side.
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Simon Dragglebork - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 20:53:17 EST ID:ZL/M6cbo No.389696 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389692
classic trumpeter
cant tell if your being intentionally deceitful or you really are that stupid and illiterate
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William Sennerdock - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 22:09:55 EST ID:0RBOKMWd No.389704 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I don't know it they bugged his phone, but if they did they were right to monitor him.

He's a known criminal, he's a threat to law and order, and it's pretty obvious he has sympathies toward the Russians and their allies. This is exactly what we have this surveillance authority for... to protect this country and it's citizens. Martin Luther King Jr. must be stopped.
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Esther Sengerpad - Wed, 22 Mar 2017 22:29:42 EST ID:1qezcbq/ No.389707 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>389692
How is Russia, or Iran, or any of those fuckers "political opposition?"

Da fuck?


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