Leave these fields empty (spam trap):
Name
You can leave this blank to post anonymously, or you can create a Tripcode by using the format Name#Password
Comment
[i]Italic Text[/i]
[b]Bold Text[/b]
[spoiler]Spoiler Text[/spoiler]
>Highlight/Quote Text
[pre]Preformatted & Monospace Text[/pre]
[super]Superset Text[/super]
[sub]Subset Text[/sub]
1. Numbered lists become ordered lists
* Bulleted lists become unordered lists
File

Sandwich


420chan is Getting Overhauled - Changelog/Bug Report/Request Thread (Updated July 26)

Now Playing on /1701/tube -

Happy Arbour Day.

Reply
- Sun, 22 Jul 2018 00:15:44 EST e2Juqy0R No.65279
File: 1532232944039.jpg -(112466B / 109.83KB, 1920x1080) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. Happy Arbour Day.
Epic first thread stopped bumping so...

The Comic-con trailer for season 2 is up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lavy7qZ1aoo

>The Orville season 2 kicks off with a two hour season premiere on December 30 at 8pm EDT on Fox.

This post was edited by C_Higgy on 22-07-2018 16:49:24
>>
David Marcus - Sun, 22 Jul 2018 11:48:05 EST G20BPQrf No.65281 Reply
Holy shit I'm hyped. The first contact with a new star system should be interesting, plus I'm curious on what they'll do with the Krill this season.
>>
M'ret - Sun, 22 Jul 2018 14:16:21 EST bsMTOC3z No.65284 Reply
1532283381670.gif -(947930B / 925.71KB, 448x336) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>65279
I watched this and then Discovery season 2 trailer. I couldn't finish the trailer for Discovery, it still has Burnham so I am completely uninterested.
At least we get one good Trek this year
>>
C-Higgy !lfsExjBfzE - Sun, 22 Jul 2018 16:48:37 EST dfep+Fqt No.65285 Reply
Added the info for season 2 so this can be the season 2 thread now. Looking forward to it.
>>
Lt. Talas - Sun, 22 Jul 2018 20:34:29 EST l5TvN503 No.65287 Reply
Looks awesome. Really stoked to see how they handle the first contact scenario.
>>
Guinan - Sun, 22 Jul 2018 22:40:35 EST D65nZOLV No.65288 Reply
>>65284
Discovery seems threatened by Orville, as the preview in question shows a bunch of really cringey attempts at jokes
>>
G'Quan - Sun, 22 Jul 2018 23:35:46 EST PKki+GTG No.65289 Reply
1532316946609.jpg -(284948B / 278.27KB, 857x1202) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>65279
Damn, I wish it was a little sooner. Surprised it took them a year and a half to get the second season ready to air. Looking forward to it though.
>>
Lt. Talas - Mon, 23 Jul 2018 01:25:48 EST l5TvN503 No.65291 Reply
>>65288
As they should be considering that there is no thread here for the Discovery preview, lol.

I hope they're airing concurrently. It can really make some trekkies appreciate The Orville so much more.
>>
Ranjen Solbor - Mon, 23 Jul 2018 01:53:18 EST wgvpSeCN No.65292 Reply
>>65288
Why steal the alien elevator gag though? That was one of the things Orville didn't steal.

Why is this fucking trailer using Fly by Lenny Kravitz? In what world was this appropriate. Star Trek isn't a CW superhero show.
>>
Noah Lessing - Mon, 23 Jul 2018 05:47:15 EST jmSOtBOw No.65293 Reply
>>65288
I think this is a correct assessment. The Star Trek subcirclejerk showed some real hostility towards The Orville when both aired. They didn't even want people talking about it. I get that the "real Trek" argument can get tiresome, but that's no excuse when you do it right back. And it takes some real wilful ignorance to deny that The Orville is Trek related.
>>
Noah Lessing - Mon, 23 Jul 2018 06:05:10 EST jmSOtBOw No.65294 Reply
>>65293
And if you'll excuse the double post, I've watched the Discovery trailer. Yeah, it isn't very impressive. Literally half the trailer was taken from one episode, with them flying around in those bubble ships. The other half is explosions and people running through them. And of course dragging Spock into it all again for an audience who doesn't care who he is.

That stuff makes me the most cynical. Everyone who has seen TOS and actually gives two fucks about Spock knows the character is more than a name and a set of traits. And everyone who hasn't, and doesn't, has no reason to care. So my view is immediately that the show tries to legitimize itself by rolling in a big name. Just as they did with the Mirror Universe. But Discovery had as many Mirror Universe episodes as the rest of Trek combined. And that's mostly down to DS9 actually making a point about the original episode, and Sisko basically having to clean up Kirk's mess. In short, it used the subject matter to make a point.

But that's the thing with Discovery. It aggressively avoids making any sort of point, and even its trailer hints at nothing truly exciting. Oh, there are these "red bursts", but what does that mean? Are the Reapers coming? All we know is that it requires Burnham to get into an impractical spaceship and fly past a bunch of asteroids. Oh, and she must help Spork. There's no hook in this trailer. Nothing that makes me think "that's an exciting concept".

Also, I fucking hate the way Discovery is trying to make me care about its characters. I'll just come out and say it. I don't like any character on Discovery, and it all feels so superficial. Saru is OK, but he's barely even in the trailer. Come on, you have Doug Jones do the make-up thing on your show, and you give all these dead fish precedence over him? And you're still not developing cute cyborg girl? No, just what I needed, more Tilly being annoying at the camera. God, I fucking hate Tilly. I don't understand how anyone can look at that character and not immediately see through the paper thin characterization and see the writing committee sitting behind her. At least Burnham is so numb that you can imagine her to actually be a real person.

Rant out. I hate that this is being done under a name I love. I hate that there are people who don't give two shits about the entire series telling me I have to like this because of that name,
>>
Donik - Mon, 23 Jul 2018 12:57:31 EST hFH53wxi No.65295 Reply
>>65293
Like what I've seen of the Orville so far I don't dig the humour very much but having flawed comedy characters does make it more relatable ironically, fuck ups making the "better humanity" thing work by sheer effort and persistance and just trying to be better rather than "humanity has evolved" but it feels like a genuine attempt to do what Trek should be doing by people who actually love Trek. Not the notion of Trek, not actually Star Wars but this will do, not the idea of being in a big name show, but they love exploring humanity with the twist being that it's humanity as it could be compared to as it is (with the later ironically not normally being human, or being outsiders) all through the medium of sci fi, a very different world. And this trailer looks like they might have iterated and improved on it the bits I actually liked.

Discovery may also yet settle, most trek takes a while to find its feet. But it looks like it has to work that much harder. Until it can surpass a comedy show made on a moderate budget it doesn't deserve more than indifference. The best scenario we can hope for is that Orville continues to improve and continues to cast shade on Discovery and forces them to get good.
>>
Subcommander Almak - Mon, 23 Jul 2018 14:25:53 EST SfiMcBo4 No.65297 Reply
>>65295
Kirk made it abundantly clear that's exactly how humanity is "better", like that speech about "I won't kill. Today."
>>
Therm0ptic !cyBOrG7t12 - Mon, 23 Jul 2018 18:34:48 EST 7hZAtms2 No.65303 Reply
>>65295
Yesssss, S E R I O U S L Y.
My biggest problem is that I don't give the slightest FUCK about any of the characters. At least with VOY there were characters that I could hate, but the STD crew just has me totally blank on emotions.
>>
Subcommander Velal - Mon, 23 Jul 2018 20:18:41 EST l5TvN503 No.65309 Reply
>>65295
Yeah pretty much all the shows took a little while to settle but no series made me hate so many characters so much. There was tons of bad writing in Voy but I never just despised the writing committees this much. And the whole concept of totally ignoring the bridge crew really grinds my gears. Not to mention that pretty much all of the character development that didn't involve Burnham was done only for one specific plot device later on. Like the doctors short development with Stametz; it was all just so that when he died it would elicit a response. It felt extremely cheap and kinda insulting. Well it would have felt insulting if I had gotten into the character at all. But pretty much all the development that happened was really cheap and superficial. Like Tilly as well, it seemed like it was all for the gimmick of seeing her mirror universe self.
>>
Subcommander Velal - Mon, 23 Jul 2018 20:21:30 EST l5TvN503 No.65310 Reply
I know someone else said this recently in some other thread, but it is nice that people here are mostly on the same page and not in a circlejerk kinda way.
It seems that in all the other trek outlets that I have found, you are accosted and flamed for having the opinions that I have. There are brainless shills everywhere. I had no clue that so many trekkies are straight up brand whores and husks. It's saddening. But not here.
>>
Tuvok - Mon, 23 Jul 2018 22:28:53 EST jmSOtBOw No.65312 Reply
>>65295
I don't think we can assume Discovery will follow Trek rules. The thing is, pretty much every series takes time to find its feet, because the team is still learning to work together, relationships between cast members are developing, etc. This will also count for The Orville. And in the realm of Trek, the only Trek show that had a really significant development that pulled it back from the brink, was TNG. TNG went through a serious change of vision, and the right people were fired from the project. TOS never went through it, DS9 followed its vision from the start, VOY lost a few habits but nothing really noteworthy until they added a new character. ENT did go through a big change and became a lot better than it had been, but was then cancelled. And the people responsible for that change are working on The Orville, not DSC.

I expect DSC to get better, but I don't expect it to change its vision. The trailer for the second season was obnoxious, seemingly intent on adding more of the shit I absolutely loathed about the second season. The annoying characters, the complete lack of any decent science fiction themes, the focus on explosions and shit, pointlessly inserting callbacks to TOS for no other reason than that they have the rights to it.

I think this is why so many people legit consider The Orville to be Star Trek. It's trying, there's no doubt about that. But when I look at the show that's carrying the Trek title, I can't see Star Trek in it. That's why I put little stock in the notion of it somehow becoming something I'd watch to get my Trek fix. Your dog may lose its habit of trying to bite people's noses, but it's never going to become a cat.

>>65310
Tin foil hat alert: I genuinely wonder how many of those people are actually into Trek. I hung out on the Trek subcirclejerk a bit, and when DSC (and The Orville) dropped, the board was suddenly flooded by people who loved it. And then they disappeared again a while later. For a few weeks, DSC fanboyism was the majority opinion, and now it's 50/50, if that. And a lot of DSC fans like going for the standby argument that previous Trek shows were secretly kind of bad. That's something I just find off. I mean, if you thought it was bad, then how did you get into it in the first place?

I met one person IRL who liked it. And he likes it exactly why you'd think he'd like it. It's more action-packed, faster paced, and not about people talking to each other in beige rooms. He had neither seen nor cared to see previous Trek shows.
>>
Subcommander Velal - Mon, 23 Jul 2018 22:43:41 EST l5TvN503 No.65313 Reply
>>65312
>And a lot of DSC fans like going for the standby argument that previous Trek shows were secretly kind of bad.

I noticed a lot of that as well. My theory is that it's just a lot of "wannabe nerds" bandwagoning that never were huge into trek to begin with. They're probably the kinds that were absolutely thrilled when the dude at CBS said they're gonna draw a lot of inspiration from Game of Thrones and likely aren't aware that making Trek derivative of current trendy shit will just totally devalue it in the long run. They don't realize that Trek has always been about breaking new ground not retreading something that broke new ground 8 years ago and is long since stale by now, not to mention it has been emulated into oblivion long before CBS got this terrible idea in their skulls.
They can't appreciate all of the amazing quotes in Trek. What deep shit has Burnham said that is timeless? The show isn't even fucking quotable for Christ's sake!
>>
Pax - Tue, 24 Jul 2018 19:08:22 EST HeFO2p/X No.65319 Reply
1532473702132.gif -(972720B / 949.92KB, 300x330) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>65313
>>The show isn't even fucking quotable for Christ's sake!
What do you mean? Discovery has some of the most poignant, thought-provoking dialogue of the franchise...
>>
Subcommander Almak - Tue, 24 Jul 2018 20:08:36 EST jmSOtBOw No.65320 Reply
>>65313
>>65319
The show is just replete with bad writing. I don't understand how they ended up with such shitty writers as they did. Speaking of the "fuck" moment, everyone seems to forget DS9 dropped "jolly african-americans". And that's because that line felt natural in the episode, in the context it was given in. While DSC just did "fuck" so they could go all "not your daddy's Trek" and preen with their first swearword in Trek. Except it isn't. Because DS9 dropped one of the most offensive words in the English language, it did it 20 years ago, and nobody batted an eyelid. Then again, the DS9 crew didn't slap their own dick all over the media. All in all it had this air of a Woodstock hippy telling his beach-storming dad that he doesn't know what it's like to be part of a historical event.
>>
Legate Turrel - Tue, 24 Jul 2018 20:28:51 EST rKny2vPg No.65322 Reply
>>65320
>everyone seems to forget DS9 dropped "jolly african-americans"

Anybody who's seen and forgotten that episode should not be here.
>>
Subcommander Almak - Tue, 24 Jul 2018 22:29:57 EST jmSOtBOw No.65323 Reply
>>65322
No. That's why they're all on Plebbit, in the media, or on the DSC writing staff.
>>
Admiral Hayes - Wed, 25 Jul 2018 02:15:48 EST +4UFuvKN No.65324 Reply
>>65320
Do you want a fucking medal of honor for wasting your life watching a silly scifi show, you massive crybaby?
>>
Morn - Wed, 25 Jul 2018 10:10:40 EST 1GGvWnSD No.65327 Reply
>>65320
>The show is just replete with bad writing. I don't understand how they ended up with such shitty writers as they did

That's not what happened. They tried to pivot a project halfway through development. There are various ways to do this, but the worst by far is to just throw everything out and start over with no fucking time. That's how you get Hobbit movies.

Discovery is better than the Hobbit movies. They didn't fail utterly. Studios have deadlines and they got it done. The result is probably not as good as the original plan or if the original were scrapped and completely re-developed from scratch.
But if that were the case, Discovery would have made no money until about now.

Also as a serialized narrative they really didn't have much room to correct until the first season was over. So we can expect the tone and everything to change finally.
My prediction is still that it doesn't really become good until Season 3. That's just how Trek spinoffs work. Unless it's Voyager, which is always a crapshoot every season. All the great episodes are just mixed in with the terrible ones throughout.
Discovery doesn't need much more organic character development to pull ahead of Voyager in that regard. (TOM PARIS LIKES TRUCKS BECAUSE IT'S RELEVANT IN THIS PLOT OF THE WEEK) (CHAKOTAY LIKES BOXING BECAUSE WE GOT THE ROCK AS A GUEST STAR AND WE FOIGHTIN) (HARRY KIM LIKES NOTHING EVER BECAUSE WE DON'T CARE ENOUGH ABOUT HIM TO WRITE HIM INTO A PLOT CONTRIVANCE) (JANEWAY LIKES HOLO ROMANCE NOVELS BECAUSE we're actually just gonna lean on Kate Mulgrew's acting background the same way we did Patrick Stewart's) Okay that one gets a pass.
Anyway you can be pretty terrible and still not be far off from surpassing Voyager. Enterprise is better than Voyager IMO because the shit episodes are concentrated in seasons you can just ignore. Enterprise just doesn't have the same contempt for your time that Voyager does.
>>
The Doctor - Sat, 28 Jul 2018 08:40:47 EST e2Juqy0R No.65353 Reply
1532781647673.jpg -(119335B / 116.54KB, 777x437) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
Hopefully she isn't driving the ship.

https://trekmovie.com/2018/07/27/marina-sirtis-to-guest-star-in-the-orville-in-episode-directed-by-star-trek-tngs-jonathan-frakes/
>Yesterday his TNG co-star Marina Sirtis tweeted a picture of herself on set with Frakes and The Orville creator Seth MacFarlane. Frakes followed this up with the message “Cat’s out of the bag now.”

>It was reported earlier this week by IMDB News that Star Trek: Enterprise star John Billingsley had a guest role in the first episode of The Orville’s second season, filmed earlier this year. TrekMovie has also independently verified it.

>And Russ’s Voyager co-star Robert Picardo did a guest spot in March, which was tweeted by executive producer/director John Cassar, pictured below with Picardo and MacFarlane. This is actually Picardo’s second time on the series, as he is reprising his role as the Xelayan father of Halston Sage’s Alara Kitan.

It also looks like The Orville may have poached a TNG vet from Discovery.
>The second season of The Orville also has more Trek vets behind the camera. Acclaimed Star Trek: The Next Generation, Deep Space Nine, Voyager and Discovery writer Joe Menosky has joined the series as an executive producer and member of the writers’ room. At San Diego Comic-Con, former Star Trek: Enterprise writer/executive producer and current The Orville writer/executive producer Brannon Braga told TrekMovie that he wanted Menosky for the first season, but he wasn’t available as he’d already signed on to Discovery.
>>
Rionoj - Sat, 28 Jul 2018 09:41:53 EST hFH53wxi No.65354 Reply
>>65353
Frakes and Sirtis really love working together. I guess Riker and Troi's complicated but very close friendship probably isn't far off the reality with the stars.

I googled Joe Menosky. None of his work is bad and some of it absolute top trek like Darmok, Year of Hell, The Chase in TNG and Year of Hell and Living Witness for Voyager. I guess they really are doubling down on the Trek.
>>
C-Higgy !lfsExjBfzE - Sat, 28 Jul 2018 23:57:33 EST ZrugFMJZ No.65361 Reply
>>65353
Well I'm not surprised. The Orville is more faithful to Star Trek than Discovery is to Star Trek.
>>
Dr. Reyga - Sun, 29 Jul 2018 00:52:19 EST M7BsLhFB No.65363 Reply
>>65355
I still think there's hope for Discovery turning out decent after two awkward as fuck seasons.

It's only exactly how Enterprise, DS9 and TNG worked out. The difference is the non-serialized episodes getting a chance to stand out on their own, self-contained. The good episodes of Discovery just don't get to stand out as much when they're forced to serve the season's plot.

I think the Mirror Universe and Klingon homeworld stuff was fun AF. Always brought down by something or another (ship with giant vulnerable exposed core, actually letting the asshole with her finger on the trigger of a planetary self destruct rule the Klingons, fucking what?) but still.
If they develop Discovery around its strongest elements it could really become something respectable.

But given the very real possibility that they keep fucking it up, at least we have the Orville.
>>
Lt. Cmdr. Dexter Remmick - Sun, 29 Jul 2018 03:00:39 EST 5uU+DoWU No.65364 Reply
>>65363
>But given the very real possibility that they keep fucking it up, at least we have the Orville.
I doubt it. The problem is the people who the execs gave the franchise to really want to do their own thing instead of trek. So much so that they actively avoid common trek tropes.
To blame is the hollywood snafu where execs hire people who "have made a name in X" instead of consulting with the fanbase.
>>
Subcommander T'Rul - Sun, 29 Jul 2018 15:11:38 EST lyzhC1TF No.65368 Reply
>>65363
>Discovery

RIP Star Trek. Long live The Orville.
>>
Lorian - Sun, 29 Jul 2018 20:49:38 EST uVB+tMG3 No.65369 Reply
1532911778460.jpg -(53685B / 52.43KB, 708x480) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>65368
There's no way the franchise won't survive. Unless of course, the nine new shows fall victim to nine separate misfortunes and are shitty. But that will never happen. Three misfortunes, that's possible. Seven misfortunes, there's an outside chance; but nine misfortunes-- I'd like to see that!
>>
Penk - Mon, 30 Jul 2018 07:34:54 EST jmSOtBOw No.65372 Reply
>>65363
Discovery isn't beholden to the same rules as old Trek, though. It's got different people working on it, with different goals, in a different tradition. Pretty much any show is bound to get better as time passes because the people working on it get more experience. But Discovery has this very obvious sense of trying to please target groups. Take that The Orville-esque joke in the trailer. That just screams the fact that someone saw that The Orville is popular, so they wanted to move more closely in its direction.

I don't see a possibility where I'll start liking Discovery. I'm constantly seeing shows that do Trek-like things better than Discovery because they are character-driven and treat moral issues with their characters. Even something like Killjoys does what Discovery is doing, but I'm enjoying it far more.
>>
Penk - Mon, 30 Jul 2018 13:40:23 EST jmSOtBOw No.65375 Reply
>>65374
It's canon, because the people in charge want it to be. But it's also a trashy modern sci-fi show that doesn't really have anything to do with Star Trek other than that dusty, dry fact that someone owns a piece of paper that says they have the right to make something called "Star Trek".

But everyone can decide for themselves what they consider part of the universe. It's a seperate show, with its own look, cast, etc. and it's never been referenced in any of the other Treks for obvious reasons. Someone saying "it's canon" has relatively little impact. Relatively, because I do dislike seeing JJTrek and DSC crap in that Trek mod for Stellaris, and wish I could turn it off.
>>
Leskit - Mon, 30 Jul 2018 17:30:24 EST SfiMcBo4 No.65376 Reply
>>65375
>Someone saying "it's canon" has relatively little impact.
it does wonders in robot cartoon circles for starting shit
>>
Ulani Belor - Mon, 30 Jul 2018 17:31:45 EST cVeP57wQ No.65377 Reply
>>65372
The thing is Discovery does need to have its own identity and a find a new take on Star Trek.
The problem is it's too wannabe Game of Thrones at this point and vastly over-influenced by the Trek movies which have been hot garbage for decades.
It sort of has the right idea with season-long arcs and such. I think the problem might be that they didn't commit enough to that style.
It's also in a weird spot where it's not nearly as thoroughly planned out as something like GoT, Breaking Bad, Babylon 5 or whatever else they're trying to be like.

I still think a lot of the hate follows the same pattern as DS9 hate. DS9 wasn't that well planned out either. They really just had the concept of Star Trek at an outpost, and developed from there.
They definitely have the right idea going with more of a mystery arc if the trailer is any indication but it can't be as stupid as the whole spore drive thing and the Klingon war.
I kind of love the Discovery Klingons, but that's mostly because they got MORE CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT THAN THE MAIN CHARACTERS. L'rell is more interesting than the whole goddamn Discovery crew. I can't expect the bridge crew to be highly developed characters but as it is they just feel like props, we get absolutely nothing from them in Discovery season 1.

It would be fine that Burnham sucks and is a big blank slate if we just got that character stuff somewhere else. I had literally no hope for Discovery until we got some scenes of Mudd and Lorca talking shit in prison. The show desperately needs more of that. So much of the best stuff in Star Trek is just characters talking about ideas and shit. Just think of all the O'Brien Bashir scenes or Bashir and Garak, Data and anybody, Worf and anybody, TNG poker scenes. That's the good shit that builds up value in character development over time. Discovery completely neglects that aspect of things and because of that, it even fails as a BSG Game of Thrones wannabe.

It made the same mistake as Voyager, only ever developing characters in direct service of the plot. I also think it's what makes Enterprise weak. If they can turn that around, then whatever the fuck Discovery wants to be will probably turn out a lot better.
There is a little bit of seriously good Trek development in Discovery. Saru evaluating his command performance is a good example.
>>
Ulani Belor - Mon, 30 Jul 2018 17:34:46 EST cVeP57wQ No.65378 Reply
>>65377
The number 1 thing they need to realize is that despite them being relatively successful mass market action films, Trek fans kind of hate the movies. Stop following in their footsteps.

Jettison Kurtzman into the sun.
>>
Admiral Chekote - Tue, 31 Jul 2018 07:46:17 EST jmSOtBOw No.65386 Reply
>>65377
Well, that's what I said. Discovery isn't character-driven, while the core of Trek is that it's a character-driven show. L'rell works because she's a character who has consistent interaction with other characters and bases her actions off that. We don't get that with Burnham, who just does what the plot demands she does. Despite the new Klingon edgelordery, I do kind of like L'rell. I think she's pretty compelling. She also showed her ridged boobies, so that's a plus.

But I got no such feeling from Lorca and Mudd in prison. I thought that shit was horrible. In fact, I thought that entire episode was horrible. It's emblematic of Discovery's problem: It's so fucking edgy. It just doesn't let up. So everything is super important all the time, all the characters are constantly either growling at the camera or having their designated Tilly moments where they can act faux giddy. They just don't seem like real people. When you look at the other crews, you can imagine yourself interacting with them, even if it is just as the local yokel on the planet of the week. But with Discovery, I'd shut myself in the holo.... sorry, training simulator, and just run the Klingon Interrogation Program 24/7.

And that's why I have no hope for it. The series started out deliberately doing the opposite of core Trek values. I've always hated that type of "renewal". Doing the exact opposite of something isn't smart. It doesn't take any creativity. And they'd have to do a complete 180 for it to even have a chance of becoming a good show.

Also, the lack of an ensemble cast makes it difficult for people to latch onto. Burnham just exists in a vacuum, and I fucking loathe her. There's no reason for me to watch the show, because it's all about her. I also don't like most of VOY's cast, or most of ENT's cast, but for those few characters I DO like, it's worth to keep watching it.
>>
Maihar'du - Tue, 31 Jul 2018 09:25:24 EST cVeP57wQ No.65388 Reply
>>65386
Yeah it's not that good, but it's literally the first time the show took a minute and sat the fuck down. After 3 episodes where I thought there was no hope at all.

The episode titles are offensively pretentious and stupid too.

Burnham is just tofu, she's just nothing. That might be fine if we weren't fixated on this nothingburger character at the expense of the more interesting ones.
And I don't care what feminists say, Burnham is a quintessential Mary Sue. So much time talking up her abilities instead of showing and she's barely a character. She's at least as much of a Mary Sue as Wesley was.

>I also don't like most of VOY's cast, or most of ENT's cast
Voyager also slaved its character development into the needs of the plot. A lot more than even Enterprise did. I don't think Enterprise really has the same problem but its characters are really lame. And once again the Doctor steals the show.
>>
Admiral Chekote - Tue, 31 Jul 2018 09:57:54 EST jmSOtBOw No.65389 Reply
>>65388
Yeah, Burnham is one of those hypercompetent characters with writer fiat behind her. I thought it was annoying with Janeway, but she was at least still a character in her own right. I'm hard-pressed to describe Burnham's personality in terms that don't explain her skills or what she does.
>>
Penk - Tue, 31 Jul 2018 19:18:41 EST JEAoMO6F No.65393 Reply
>>65389
I don't think Janeway is the prime example from Voyager. It's Tom Paris, who is framed as a big fuck-up because he made one mistake and then went on to do everything perfectly forever (with a little help from his girl Torres)
>>
Species 8472 - Wed, 01 Aug 2018 03:48:37 EST 4WVh8sFm No.65395 Reply
>>65388
pretty much this, the docs were the only really good characters from both those crews
>>
Greer - Thu, 02 Aug 2018 17:42:49 EST sBlKNQlx No.65414 Reply
1533246169740.jpg -(197481B / 192.85KB, 1920x1080) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
So my thoughts were wandering while I was making breakfast and I thought... since Trek built some of itself by chewing on contemporary issues and Discotrash can only hump imagined culture wars, what distinctly 2010 issues might they take up in season 2? They took a swipe at social media mob mentality in the first season. What would it be interesting to see in Orville season 2?

I would love to see something about civil forfeiture. I'm not in the US and don't know anyone who's been hit by it but every time I see it in the news and how it fucks over innocent people and funnels money into police coffers I'm amazed there isn't a civil war down there spawned just by outrage over it.

Net neutrality seems like an easy one but I'll thrown it in.

Regulatory capture. Not a uniquely American problem but they seem to have it the worst.

Backlash against nuclear power generation in the wake of Fukushima.

What would you like to see?
>>
Krax - Thu, 02 Aug 2018 20:47:42 EST yUxLOWTW No.65415 Reply
>>65389
Yeah all of that but they added the tragic plot driving backstory. It would be redeeming if it wasn't so stupid.
>>
Weyoun 8 - Fri, 03 Aug 2018 13:58:01 EST HeFO2p/X No.65419 Reply
>>65414
>>what distinctly 2010 issues might they take up in season 2
I mean why ignore the elephant in the room? Do the loss of jobs and middle class to automation and big tech, and how that feeds into social collapse and authoritarian and antinomian revival, and do it big and loud and with the tools to address it that only a Trek/Trek-clone has. Trek was literally engineered to respond to this question, which is to me why it's so baffling that it's the one thing that seems too hot a potato for Trek or even Orville to go after.
>>
Prinadora - Sun, 05 Aug 2018 16:44:01 EST Mm/mlHEe No.65441 Reply
>>65414
All of those issues are substantial. I see more shit about Russia. The first season was about wahabism, nationalism and (supporting) imperialism. I see some cold war esque fear mongering in season 2. It's cbs though so they won't make the enemy straight up communists, they will have to be more subtle somehow.
>>
Leck - Sun, 05 Aug 2018 16:50:28 EST sBlKNQlx No.65443 Reply
1533502228016.jpg -(101875B / 99.49KB, 1916x1076) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>65441
>It's cbs though so they won't make the enemy straight up communists

It's Fox... I can see New Cold War shit being a season-long arc, which might explain at least some of the Krill pewpew in the new trailer.
>>
Christopher Brynner - Fri, 21 Sep 2018 21:39:16 EST URhcRB2x No.65811 Reply
1537580356957.jpg -(151004B / 147.46KB, 1125x1872) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
IT'S HAPPENING
>>
Tavek - Sat, 22 Sep 2018 02:25:43 EST bsMTOC3z No.65813 Reply
1537597543696.gif -(113484B / 110.82KB, 190x194) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>65811
What the DVD? How is that even close to interesting? The fuck?!
>>
Christopher Brynner - Sat, 22 Sep 2018 12:32:20 EST URhcRB2x No.65821 Reply
1537633940957.jpg -(9214B / 9.00KB, 416x339) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>65813
Are you okay?
It's finally getting a home media release. There should be a blu-ray alongside it. It was home video that launched Family Guy (love it or hate it) after a middling first season. Strong home media sales for The Orville will make it easier for Fox to decide to keep making it beyond their current commitment.
>>
C-Higgy !lfsExjBfzE - Sat, 22 Sep 2018 16:30:26 EST ZrugFMJZ No.65823 Reply
>>65821
It was DVD sales of its original seasons and solid rerun ratings on Adult Swim after it got canceled that got Family Guy back on the air. I don’t think home media sales mean as much now as much as Live+7 and streaming ratings do.
>>
Dr. Telek R'Mor - Sun, 23 Sep 2018 20:58:55 EST b2kjICL7 No.65837 Reply
Aren't DVD's worse than HD? Order online the DVD?
>>
T'Pol - Sun, 23 Sep 2018 23:35:00 EST HeFO2p/X No.65839 Reply
Look Brynner clearly just forgot what decade it was. Cut him some slack.
>>
Minister Kuvak - Wed, 26 Sep 2018 04:34:26 EST Qo4yytmf No.65864 Reply
>>65834
>>65831
>>65828
DVDs are still purchased by those over the age of ~35 who don't know any better. That's actually a pretty key demographic for TNG/DS9 nostalgia.
>>
Nanpart Malor - Thu, 04 Oct 2018 18:11:13 EST 51jDRXZx No.65925 Reply
1538691073302.jpg -(354343B / 346.04KB, 3300x5100) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
DICKS EVERYWHERE
>>
DaiMon Torrot - Fri, 05 Oct 2018 01:12:13 EST RUqIb+hP No.65935 Reply
1538716333493.jpg -(2640187B / 2.52MB, 2576x1932) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>65876

ugh that was horrendous. the lyrics need such a massive tune up. music was fine, voice was fine, but the rhyming then not rhyming and syllables not being in sync with each verse.. sorry it was just hell to my ears.

here is a picture of my dog's turd. she ate a ribbon out of the garbage and she shat it out on the tip of this turd so it was like a nice little present
>>
Thy'lek Shran - Mon, 08 Oct 2018 19:02:37 EST Qo4yytmf No.65963 Reply
Also I finally got around to watching this. Series is great but Episode 3 is fucking dumb. Unless it was intended to be an outright parody of Trek's courtroom episodes the utter retardism of all of the arguments presented alone sinks what was a good concept.
>>
G'Quan - Fri, 12 Oct 2018 21:30:31 EST PKki+GTG No.65989 Reply
>>65986
>Discovery makes its epic return to CBS All Access on January 17, 2019!
>January 17, 2019

Man, they're doing it again. They should have learned from the first season not to run STD at the same time as STRV because it makes STD look even worse.
>>
Belongo - Sat, 13 Oct 2018 03:16:15 EST 4WVh8sFm No.65992 Reply
>>65935
yeah it was bad but I'd say it's still better than the ENT theme song (which is till somehow better than the show)
>>
Commander Morag - Sat, 13 Oct 2018 05:30:33 EST bsMTOC3z No.65993 Reply
1539423033247.gif -(2796674B / 2.67MB, 198x168) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>65992
>it's still better than the ENT theme song
>>
Bird Keeper Dane - Sat, 13 Oct 2018 13:44:18 EST KGL1tgWI No.65994 Reply
>>65992
It's been a long time since I heard anyone hate that song you filthy bajoran REMOVE HASPERAT
>>
Nevala - Mon, 15 Oct 2018 17:41:08 EST DQPN6n13 No.66001 Reply
1539639668668.jpg -(47064B / 45.96KB, 597x598) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
They had their season 2 wrap party on the weekend.

Captain Ed sings: https://www.instagram.com/p/Bo669Nnh0kJ/
And then sings more: https://www.instagram.com/p/Bo6HYalgmDR/

Pics or it didn't happen:
https://www.instagram.com/p/Bo6xtZzFyKk/?taken-by=onlyobi
https://twitter.com/Toni_sweetheart/status/1051638986068779008/photo/1
https://mobile.twitter.com/Toni_sweetheart/status/1051639042863853568/photo/1
https://mobile.twitter.com/stjerome610/status/1051522104024342529/photo/1
>>
Admiral Nechayev - Tue, 16 Oct 2018 19:28:44 EST HeFO2p/X No.66007 Reply
1539732524323.jpg -(125672B / 122.73KB, 1920x1080) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>65994
I think if you don't like the ENT theme song that should be considered scientific proof that you are dead inside and have no soul.
>>
Therm0ptic !cyBOrG7t12 - Tue, 16 Oct 2018 21:07:02 EST 7hZAtms2 No.66009 Reply
>>66007
The ENT theme song is a bannable offense.
That's an order.
>>
Amanda Grayson - Tue, 16 Oct 2018 22:40:34 EST KGL1tgWI No.66011 Reply
>>66009
You can't stop love Therm0ptic!

>It's been a long road. Gettin from there to here. It's been a long time, but my time is finally here. And I will see my dreams come alive at night. I will touch the sky, and they're not gonna hold me down no more, No they're not gonna change my mind. 'CAUSE I'VE GOT FAITH OF THE HEART. I'M GOING WHERE MY HEART WILL TAKE ME I'VE GOT FAITH TO BELIEVE, I CAN DO ANYTHING. I'VE GOT STRENGTH OF THE SOUL. NO ONE'S GONNA BEND NOR BREAK ME I CAN REACH, ANY STAR. I'VE GOT FAITH. I'VE GOT FAITH... FAITH OF THE HEAAART
>>
Dr. T'Pan - Tue, 16 Oct 2018 23:36:22 EST HeFO2p/X No.66012 Reply
>>66009
I don't get it Therms, first you're all about how ENT is so much greater than VOY, but the things people actually like about the show are bad? What gives?
>>
Therm0ptic !cyBOrG7t12 - Wed, 17 Oct 2018 01:55:00 EST 7hZAtms2 No.66013 Reply
>>66012
Back in my day it was universally accepted that the ENT theme is garbage.
Sometimes I feel like I don't even know you guys anymore.
>>
T'Pau - Wed, 17 Oct 2018 05:05:31 EST 4WVh8sFm No.66014 Reply
>>66013
dude seriously!

I stayed away from DIS after like episode 4 but was the rest really so bad that you guys somehow started unrionically liking everything about ENT just because it isn't discotrash?

man trek just keeps getting worse and worse
>>
Dr. T'Pan - Wed, 17 Oct 2018 17:11:13 EST HeFO2p/X No.66015 Reply
1539810673193.jpg -(65123B / 63.60KB, 800x600) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>66013
Back when the show first came out I had a knee jerk reaction to it like everyone else...'oh, it's not the same kind of symphonic score the other ones had, so it must be garbage.'

Then I grew up and learned to stop evaluating things based on my preconceived notions, and realized that a.) they were trying to do something new and b.) it's just a genuinely heartfelt piece of feel-good in an otherwise bleary sea of grimdark. It captures the essence of Trek in a way that, sure, if you've been a trekkie for decades is like 'yeah, space exploration is cool, we're already on board my dude' but if you took someone who knew nothing about Trek and wanted to convey the feeling of what Trek is about to them in 30 seconds, what better way is there to do it?

Anyway, I'm just getting my jabs in cause of all the VOY bashing earlier, but really, you do realize you're saying 'like ENT, it's good, but only the parts I like. otherwise, ban.' I think you just need Faith of the Heart my man. No one's gonna bend or break you.
>>
T'Pau - Wed, 17 Oct 2018 18:02:26 EST 4WVh8sFm No.66016 Reply
>>66015
the enterprise theme song is fucking garbage and not just because it's not symphonic

it's a shitty fucking song like the ones you'd hear on early 00's pop country radio stations
>>
Seven of Nine - Wed, 17 Oct 2018 18:16:04 EST PKki+GTG No.66017 Reply
>>66015
At first I thought you were talking about the STD theme and didn't understand your post but, yeah, I kind of agree that it isn't as horrible as its made out to be. Plus you can just skip through it and its no where near as bad as the STD theme.

I've talked about this a little bit in the past. This is pre-UFP, we're just getting out there. We're still in our infancy. I think it makes sense to have a less classical and well composed feeling song in that context. We're kids listening to shitty music. As we age and mature as a species we start getting into a more classical score.

>but if you took someone who knew nothing about Trek and wanted to convey the feeling of what Trek is about to them in 30 seconds, what better way is there to do it?

I do disagree that a theme song is the best 30s to get someone into Trek. I can't really think of any 30s that really embodies Trek and would get people on board. Possibly The Sisko's monologue at the end of In the Pale Moonlight.
>>
Therm0ptic !cyBOrG7t12 - Wed, 17 Oct 2018 18:33:06 EST 7hZAtms2 No.66018 Reply
>>66015
I think... you and I are destined to do this forever.
But no it tortures me, man, because the lyrics fit the show so well. But it's a fucking garbage song to use as the theme for Trek. I'm torn. It doesn't have to be symphonic, it just should not be shit. it should be more atmospheric imo and feel less like "we need an opening theme cuz it's the formula."
>>
Hadley - Wed, 17 Oct 2018 22:19:16 EST SfiMcBo4 No.66020 Reply
Faith In The Heart is a dumb song, but it grew on me
also that Space Bat video with it helped me grow to like it too
>>
Going Where My Heart Will Take Me - Thu, 18 Oct 2018 09:24:35 EST KGL1tgWI No.66021 Reply
It's a shitty song for a shitty show, and in that way it's the perfect meme.
>>
Hadley - Thu, 18 Oct 2018 09:51:20 EST SfiMcBo4 No.66024 Reply
>>66021
that's like how I argue in favor of the Voyager series finale.
It's an ugly stupid mess of time travel and asspulls and Janeway doing everything, but in the end wasn't that what Voyage was all about?
>>
Benny Russell - Thu, 18 Oct 2018 20:28:59 EST HeFO2p/X No.66025 Reply
>>66017
>>near as bad as the STD theme
I want to die when I see the STD theme. It can't even be called a 'theme' in the musical sense, it has absolutely no structure and basically sounds like nothing.

>>As we age and mature as a species we start getting into a more classical score.
>>Awesome headcanon, was better than my headcanon, using your headcanon now

>>66018
>>I think... you and I are destined to do this forever.
Sorry friend. If it makes you feel better, I'm the person who always backs you up on /wc/. We can keep arguing about VOY and ENT when we're post-human intelligences ;)

>> "we need an opening theme cuz it's the formula."
To be fair, having a cheesy theme song was requisite in early-00s TV. They weren't really breaking the trek formula so much as bending to a larger trend.
>>
Chakotay - Fri, 19 Oct 2018 22:07:13 EST DQPN6n13 No.66044 Reply
1540001233847.jpg -(49612B / 48.45KB, 600x326) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>66025
>To be fair, having a cheesy theme song was requisite in early-00s TV. They weren't really breaking the trek formula so much as bending to a larger trend.

I think it's more the case that they wanted to distinguish themselves from the other series by not having a orchestral main title and they also wanted something that reflected the ambition and pride of the American flight and space programs of the 1940s thru 1960s.
>>
Chakotay - Sat, 20 Oct 2018 04:44:52 EST 4WVh8sFm No.66045 Reply
>>66044
I'm pretty sure it was a last second decision to jump on the patriotic american country music bandwagon that everybody was riding after good ol ninerleven
>>
Kirayoshi O'Brien - Sat, 20 Oct 2018 10:14:38 EST LCfgD/e0 No.66046 Reply
>>66044
The sad thing is that music aside it's a good title sequence.
>>
Grand Nagus Smeet - Sat, 20 Oct 2018 11:43:39 EST b2kjICL7 No.66047 Reply
1540050219191.jpg -(118389B / 115.61KB, 1416x709) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>66045
Now they have Michael Angelo gestures of men touching themselves with classical music with a solute to Gene.
>>
Greskrendtregk - Sat, 20 Oct 2018 18:17:43 EST aTOANb1E No.66048 Reply
>>66046
Oh yeah. The music is muddled and confused as fuck.

With a little trimming it'd be a lot better. Its got a lot of good elements in there but it doesn't know when to stop. I really like the first minute of it. I think that part is perfect.

It could end at a minute 15 and be perfect. But then it goes and plays the whole classic TOS thing followed by the deep horns.
My solution for this is just cut the da-ding from the end and replace it with the horns. Those last notes are there to punctuate the conclusion in the original theme, and Discovery's theme just does it twice and I fucking hate that. It's unnecessary.
>>
Commander Donatra - Sat, 20 Oct 2018 20:56:38 EST Qo4yytmf No.66049 Reply
>>66046
I'd disagree: too much in the way of American achievements and too little of anyone else.
>>
Kiri-kin-tha - Sat, 20 Oct 2018 22:48:29 EST PKki+GTG No.66050 Reply
>>66049
It was an American Show with an American captain and was created for the American audience.
>>
Homn - Sun, 21 Oct 2018 05:07:38 EST 4WVh8sFm No.66051 Reply
>>66050
no other star trek is so straight up American though

ENT was a cash grab riding the wave of maniacal patriotism that followed 9/11

that's the biggest reason it sucked so hard, the show itself is basically a Toby Keith song in space
>>
Rebi - Sun, 21 Oct 2018 10:07:35 EST UgmK2ffD No.66053 Reply
1540130855241.jpg -(276678B / 270.19KB, 1436x1080) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>66051
>straight up American though

E plan eesta wants your attention.
>>
Etana Jol - Sun, 21 Oct 2018 13:58:10 EST 2UPhFisy No.66054 Reply
1540144690876.jpg -(5149B / 5.03KB, 260x194) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>66053
Making Abe Lincoln on par with the savior of a planet was also a bit much, but I'd give TOS the "for its time..." defense. International affairs and social tensions being what they were, it was a beacon of cooperation, progress, inclusion, etc. Enterprise, in premise and execution, felt like a step back. It was more of a product of its times than a dream of better times ahead.
>>
Kiri-kin-tha - Sun, 21 Oct 2018 17:24:53 EST PKki+GTG No.66056 Reply
>>66051
I really hate it for all of you that let something as stupid as a theme song ruin 98 episodes of Trek.
>>
Lt. Cmdr. Jack Crusher - Sun, 21 Oct 2018 17:56:48 EST b2kjICL7 No.66057 Reply
1540159008954.jpg -(9740B / 9.51KB, 500x355) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>66051 More crew were from America. The engineer talking Huckleberry Fin with a straw in the mouth. Struggle for technological understanding in relation to America 1950-1960's.
>>
Vash - Mon, 22 Oct 2018 00:08:57 EST 4WVh8sFm No.66058 Reply
>>66054
> It was more of a product of its times than a dream of better times ahead.

that is what I have been trying to say but put much more eloquently than I had put it

same with DIS, that's why I put them in the same camp
>>
Gregory Quinn - Mon, 22 Oct 2018 00:39:05 EST HeFO2p/X No.66059 Reply
>>66048
The guy you were responding to was talking about the ENT theme, not the STD one, which has happened like three times since we started talking about it. Specify your themes crewmen!

>>66046
Sorry, but Trek really is an American show, ENT is the most international of them all and its still not very. Also, what aerospace exploration accomplishments of other nations (besides the ISS) could they show without it just being Russians and Americans? I agree they should have thrown in frames of Sputnik and Gagarin, a Soyuz or two, but that's about it.
>>
Vash - Mon, 22 Oct 2018 00:58:39 EST 4WVh8sFm No.66060 Reply
>>66059
>ENT is the most international of them all

absolutely not true
>>
Liquidator Brunt - Mon, 22 Oct 2018 09:46:06 EST Qo4yytmf No.66065 Reply
>>66050
TNG and TOS were also American shows designed for American audiences but they actively tried to be as international as possible. They undeniably come out as American products but the effort is clear and that's what matters. ENT's intro takes a giant shit all over that throwing a few off-hand references to the achievements of other nations and then going full American as if nobody else has achieved anything since the age of sail. For god's sake it doesn't have a single image of the Soviet space achievements. Not even Gagarin which is the bare minimum you'd expect.

If anything I find the this more offensive than the music. Even if you watch the introduction with Archer's Theme as was originally planned this sinks it.
>>
Liquidator Brunt - Mon, 22 Oct 2018 11:39:18 EST Qo4yytmf No.66067 Reply
>>66056
Hatred for the introduction aside I've actually come to rather like early ENT. S1 and the first few episodes of S2 have a higher good:bad ratio than any part of VOY and a lot of early TNG. Obviously the later bits of S2 and '9/11 but in space' S3 are shite but it evens out again at S4.

The autists at Memory Alpha have got a list of every image used in the opening title for ENT here http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Star_Trek:_Enterprise_opening_title_sequences and I find it hard to believe one of those images couldn't be cut to stick Sputnik or whatever in or even have it included as a superimposed blueprint over something else. Why it bothers me is not that they only chose American achievements but that they clearly didn't even notice they were doing it which gives away that they never really understood Roddenberry's outlook. While I'm on the subject even as early as mid-TNG trek also started losing its classic naval/submarine feeling turning instead into an ensemble cast that happen to be in a spaceship, to be fair Stewart was never a good fit for gruff captain but the attempt to go for a classic First Officer - Captain arrangement wasn't bad.

>>66059
>Sorry, but Trek really is an American show, ENT is the most international of them all and its still not very.
Trek is an American produced-show that has always tried to avoid being blatantly American-only and has instead at its heart an ideal which is not internationalist as much as humanist. Culturally it's deeply American from its production to its acting style etc but its 'message' or 'theme' is not. It's maybe best described as an American take on the universal message of humanity being the best it can be etc, maybe there's an alternative universe where Trek was made in the UK and only came out in three x 6 episode series with slapstick comedy or it was French and full of adultery but the message of both of those would be the same even if the rest was different. Think of it like how The Orville is still fundamentally Trek at its core and how other American SF that should be Trek (DIS, Andromeda) is not and would not be even if the visual and acting styles were duplicated.

There's the core Trek ideal that can come apart from a show that explores it with that exploration being the bit rooted in the culture of whoever made the show.

>Also, what aerospace exploration accomplishments of other nations (besides the ISS) could they show without it just being Russians and Americans? I agree they should have thrown in frames of Sputnik and Gagarin, a Soyuz or two, but that's about it.
Plenty if you're willing to step outside of the handful of obvious examples ENT picked, off the top of my head:
Sir George Cayley would be obvious for all but founding the concept of aviation as a science.
Alcock and Brown had the first non-stop transatlantic flight in 1919, fully 8 years before Lindbergh, though granted it was a two-man flight and the distance somewhat shorter. They're broadly forgotten now for whatever reason.
Santos-Dumont would also be a good call since that gives you a South American involved with a lot of shit, the fact he offed himself in depression about aircraft being used for warfare rather than human advancement works too.
Perhaps another one of the French lads with their balloons or gliders though Dumont covers that more neatly and I wouldn't want to push it.

For a non-aerospace example what about some of the Arctic explorers? Amundsen was first to successfully explore the Northwest Passage (and not die in the attempt) and to reach the South Pole (also without dying, man was a fucking pro at that). On the subject of Scandinavians wouldn't the Norse were great explorers and reached North America long before anyone else did, roughly 1,000 years ago.

If you stick only to the last century of advances it is a bit of an issue since a great many of the European developments in terms of aircraft and rocketry took place during the World Wars or for military reasons and that doesn't fit so much with the themes of either Trek or what ENT's intro is trying to do in sticking to exploration. I don't think you can really put launching a V2 in there for example even if the German influence on rocketry was obviously rather important. Even if it was only Russians and Americans after 1920 that'd be a major improvement over American only though I'd probably also advocate for a bit more pre-20th Century (i.e. non-aerospace) achievements as well. Some of the less goofy early Greek maps wouldn't hurt, something from the Middle East/Mesopotamia (Babylonians and their astronomers at least). It seems very strange to have only five images for the 1000s of years of exploration and groundwork by every nation before 1900 and 26 all from one nation (many of which are essentially repeats of each other) for the ~250 years after it.



I am angry.
ANGRY ABOUT OPENING SEQUENCES
>>
Liquidator Brunt - Mon, 22 Oct 2018 11:59:39 EST Qo4yytmf No.66068 Reply
>>66067
>On the subject of Scandinavians wouldn't the Norse
Ignore the word wouldn't, don't know how that got in there.

>I don't think you can really put launching a V2 in there for example even if the German influence on rocketry was obviously rather important.
Wernher von Braun or someone else with potentially a little bit less of a NSDAP link would work here actually. Goddard got in so having another scientist wouldn't hurt at all. Also I know it's another Russian but Tsiolkovsky would make sense along these lines. It's not as flashy as people flying around in planes but we aren't Klingons so a few scientists wouldn't hurt.


Another thing that bothers me is that focussing so much on recent history to the exclusion of everything before it comes with the implicit assumption that it matters more or is better and that's pretty arrogant when the 20th and 21st centuries are considered just as backwards and savage as what came before in Trek's universe (perhaps moreso since we should have known better). Everyone always thinks their day, their generation and their civilisation/nation is the most advanced and knows so much better than the backwards savages who came before which is something ENT's intro reinforces and something that TOS and particularly TNG go to great pains to argue against.

At least I got a Ferengi name. I also have complaints about how S7 of DS9 handled them as a species but one rant at a time.
>>
Miles O'Brien - Mon, 22 Oct 2018 14:13:41 EST SfiMcBo4 No.66069 Reply
>>66067
>Roddenberry's outlook
only outlook he had was what would snow Lucy and Desi and score him blowjobs while he sold effects shot footage he stole from the studio to nerds
>>
Gregory Quinn - Mon, 22 Oct 2018 15:58:05 EST HeFO2p/X No.66070 Reply
1540238285837.jpg -(16242B / 15.86KB, 480x360) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>66060
Ok, it's the one with the most ACTUAL internationality, in that it is the only one to even acknowledge the existence of other nations besides the US and talk about their frustration with the American-ness of Starfleet.
The only other contender is TOS, but you have to remember that Doohan, Koenig and Nichols are all actually American, despite having characters that aren't (before you say I left out Takei, Sulu was born in San Francisco.)

>>66067
>> Culturally it's deeply American from its production to its acting style etc but its 'message' or 'theme' is not.
I know, and I mean, I'm mostly ok with it because it serves the end goal of boosting interest in space in general, however, if we were making these shows again today, we wouldn't be able to get away with it. Consider how Quark goes off talking about how root beer is so emblematic of the Federation. I didn't think anything about that until years later I learned that Americans are the only people in the world who like root beer. So this kinda implies that American culture goes on to become human culture, which is kinda fucked up, don't you think?

>>Plenty if you're willing to step outside of the handful of obvious examples ENT picked
I know dude, I know why you're reaching so hard. I really wish that there were more big tent examples of major aerospace accomplishments we could hand out, but there simply aren't. If it makes you feel better, the fact that all those milestones were reached by (Russians, then Americans) has nothing to do with Americans being superior at anything, but about them just happening to be the biggest bullies in the sandbox at the time that aerospace technology reached maturity.

>>For a non-aerospace example what about some of the Arctic explorers?
They gave us the HMS Enterprise which is about all we could ask for. I love the arctic expeditions and they are really important for the history of real-world exploration, but to put them in the intro is getting pretty far afield of the whole 'space' thing, right?

>> I don't think you can really put launching a V2
On that note, can we all at least agree that the Mirror ENT intro (which does feature the V2) is fucking badass?

>>Everyone always thinks their day, their generation and their civilisation/nation is the most advanced
Yes, Trek is a fallible show made by flawed humans subject to the artistic failings that all human art has been subject to everywhere. Surprised?
>>
Emperor Sompek - Tue, 23 Oct 2018 06:45:20 EST VNvwTtGl No.66075 Reply
>>66067
It tried to not be about America but it wasn't successful at all. The Federation has always just been a symbol of what America thinks it is. Especially in Tos.
>>
Lonzo - Tue, 23 Oct 2018 13:01:53 EST LCfgD/e0 No.66077 Reply
>>66067
>alternative universe where Trek was made in the UK and only came out in three x 6 episode series with slapstick comedy
Quite a few trek episodes happened on Red Dwarf first. Not too much slapstick though. There's a lot of elements which you'd think were based on trek characters and ideas except they were in the UK on a space ship where you could see the "40 Watt" on the lightbulb when the camera panned around the engine.
>>
Groundskeeper Boothby - Tue, 23 Oct 2018 14:49:15 EST QLb0aPr0 No.66078 Reply
>>66077
I recently thought to myself "Hey, Red Dwarf is a better TOS than TOS, they even shoot vacuum cleaners instead of TV remotes because they probably couldn't afford TVs after Holly". nb
>>
Wesley Crusher - Tue, 23 Oct 2018 20:29:14 EST lkTTz5pz No.66082 Reply
>>66070
>but you have to remember that Doohan, Koenig and Nichols are all actually American, despite having characters that aren't
Oh dear.
>>
Gaila - Tue, 23 Oct 2018 21:46:34 EST 4WVh8sFm No.66084 Reply
>>66070
I'm not talking about the actors or the characters backgrounds even

we are talking about the theme and feel of the show itself

ENT plays out as if it is just a bunch of "yee-ha, truck driving, good ol' boys" going to space to "show them smarty pants foreigners how we do it out in the country and get them terrists cuz they killed muh sister! GOD BLESS FEDERATION"

every moment of the show just wreaks of the obsessive uber-patriotism that existed in America post 9/11 and if you are somehow missing that then you probably didn't live through post 9/11 America
>>
Emperor Reclaw - Tue, 23 Oct 2018 21:48:25 EST SfiMcBo4 No.66085 Reply
lol Doohan is Canadian ya goofball
>>
Eliminator Leck - Thu, 25 Oct 2018 06:56:19 EST Qo4yytmf No.66103 Reply
>>66070
>Ok, it's the one with the most ACTUAL internationality, in that it is the only one to even acknowledge the existence of other nations besides the US and talk about their frustration with the American-ness of Starfleet.
The other shows do not talk about other nations because nations no longer exist. Picard does bring up France and Frenchness as a cultural concept in early TNG though. Internationalist is the wrong word for Trek because it is proposing a removal of nations entirely.
>The only other contender is TOS, but you have to remember that Doohan, Koenig and Nichols are all actually American, despite having characters that aren't (before you say I left out Takei, Sulu was born in San Francisco.)
The fact that you lack basic knowledge about TOS and just assume you're correct is telling. Doohan was Canadian (with Irish, most likely Ulster Scots, parents), not just 'born in Canada and moved to America' Canadian-by-technicality either.

>know, and I mean, I'm mostly ok with it because it serves the end goal of boosting interest in space in general, however, if we were making these shows again today, we wouldn't be able to get away with it. Consider how Quark goes off talking about how root beer is so emblematic of the Federation. I didn't think anything about that until years later I learned that Americans are the only people in the world who like root beer. So this kinda implies that American culture goes on to become human culture, which is kinda fucked up, don't you think?
Good point, though I can't think of another non-obscure drink that would match up with the analogy. Two points on that though:
  1. It was in DS9, a show that arguably goes out of its way to attack the Roddenberry-style Federation as impractical (I still like the show mind, it's just very different in its fundamentals)
  2. Quark was using it as an analogy and giving his opinion that it was symbolic of the federation, sensible enough for a bartender to use since it's a drink
DS9 also shows both O'Brien and Bashir taking part in excessively British activities and maintaining a distinct culture entirely so it's not like American culture has crushed everyone else. It's also the case that DS9 shows some parts of contemporary American culture dying out: specifically baseball (actually TNG set that precedent of baseball having died out but still).

>I know dude, I know why you're reaching so hard. I really wish that there were more big tent examples of major aerospace accomplishments we could hand out, but there simply aren't.
None of those are reaching from the point of view of actually representing the subject matter, the fact that ENT's creators decided to go for the lowest common denominator with their intro is very much my complaint. TOS and TNG were not content with merely pandering to expectations in any area, they had a message to sell. ENT's intro makes it clear they're not trying to break any new ground and that's a lot of why it bothers me.
>If it makes you feel better, the fact that all those milestones were reached by (Russians, then Americans) has nothing to do with Americans being superior at anything, but about them just happening to be the biggest bullies in the sandbox at the time that aerospace technology reached maturity.
You are misrepresenting my complaints. I do not care who, exactly, shows up in the intro at all just that it fails to represent anything other than 'we want to be a generic TV show'.

>They gave us the HMS Enterprise which is about all we could ask for.
The Enterprise is a pretty terrible example for Arctic exploration though. I mean it had to be included for the name sure but it didn't do much exploration (or they did not, there were many ships with the name).
>I love the arctic expeditions and they are really important for the history of real-world exploration, but to put them in the intro is getting pretty far afield of the whole 'space' thing, right?
The introduction attempts to be more about exploration as a whole that just space travel. Look at the inclusion of underwater exploration for example. It's just that they failed to consider other examples or more likely were not self-aware enough to understand how slanted it was.

>On that note, can we all at least agree that the Mirror ENT intro (which does feature the V2) is fucking badass?
Certainly, though it does not feature the V2 at all.

>Yes, Trek is a fallible show made by flawed humans subject to the artistic failings that all human art has been subject to everywhere. Surprised?
But TNG and ENT did not have this failing. They in fact went out of their way to avoid it, constantly showing that not only was humanity in the 20th and 21st centuries deeply flawed but also that there's plenty of growing left to do. Look at episodes like Home Soil where, after fucking up and assuming life should be similar to them, the Federation/Humanity is told to fuck off for a hundred years and grow up a bit before contact can be made or any of the TNG episodes about superior beings. ENT on the other hand repeatedly goes out of its way to show how humans are always in the right as the plucky underdogs, hell all of Vulcan society was apparently corrupt just to justify humanity's frustration and impatience.

I'll try an explain again why the intro bothers me so much. Look at TOS and TNG: their introductions literally spell out that they're going to go out where others have not before and to seek out new ways of thinking about things and doing things. ENT's introduction on the other hand can be summed up as "to boldly not question our initial assumptions" by picking what any random person on the street would if they were asked.
>>
Eliminator Leck - Thu, 25 Oct 2018 07:03:53 EST Qo4yytmf No.66104 Reply
>>66075
Kirk is also unarguably American (I mean that in a good way) in his approach of sheriff-in-space morality, but that doesn't change the fact that the underlying ideal is universal.

>>66077
I know. Red Dwarf also has at least one explicit reference to TNG, Lister tells Kryten, who is asking about emotions, that he's hungover and it's too early for any of that Star Trek crap.
>>
Guinan - Tue, 30 Oct 2018 20:48:07 EST jmSOtBOw No.66174 Reply
>>66067
The ENT intro really seemed set on powering through to space flight, with every image coming before that being little more than a pre-amble. Of course, there they also dropped the ball by leaving out the Russians. But with a broader theme of science and exploration, they could have included a fair share of the world.

Also, stuff like the Harrier, Concorde, or that giant Airbus seem to fit right in with the theme.
>>
Q - Sun, 04 Nov 2018 20:59:34 EST 0KyxXOfA No.66201 Reply
>>66104
>I know. Red Dwarf also has at least one explicit reference to TNG, Lister tells Kryten, who is asking about emotions, that he's hungover and it's too early for any of that Star Trek crap.

I remember that, fellow Red Dwarf fan. I believe Kryton said something like "is the human quality you call friendship?".
>>
Jaresh-Inyo - Wed, 14 Nov 2018 07:29:11 EST Qo4yytmf No.66255 Reply
>>66174
I'd be opposed to the Harrier due to its military nature but Concorde is one I'd completely forgotten about.
>>66201
That sounds right to me.
>>
Guinan - Wed, 14 Nov 2018 22:19:11 EST D65nZOLV No.66260 Reply
1542251951500.png -(893568B / 872.62KB, 666x584) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>66259
The Concorde wasn't really unreliable. It was new, it was expensive. But all new technologies are. And it was killed in the cradle.

I genuinely believe future historians will look at the Concorde as the high water mark of civilization unless we turn things around.. and soon. The end of the Space Shuttle, unreliable though it was, the potential loss of the ISS (since the Soyuz failed we might have to abandon it if things dont work out by late January), we are just seeing a slow tumble backwards technoligically. I mean what have the post-2000s really brought us other than streamlining existing technology? Computers and phones get faster and smaller, but other than reliable touchscreen technology, (which by the way Star Trek basically envisioned), we ain't got shit. The internet, or rather normies being allowed on the internet, has stalled human progress and put us in a place where we are all but teetering on the edge of a new dark age. I mean, for fucks sake flat earthers are spreading like wildfire..

But like I said killing the Concorde because one of them hit some birds is.. terrible. Imagine if we abandoned jet engines with the first failure. Or the airplane. Or the steam powered boat. I'm pretty sad the Concorde died. And I'd like to make the case that we should all be.
>>
Admiral Hayes - Wed, 14 Nov 2018 23:21:01 EST 4WVh8sFm No.66261 Reply
>>66260
>And I'd like to make the case that we should all be
You got me man
>>
Kevin Mulkahey - Thu, 15 Nov 2018 13:54:26 EST HeFO2p/X No.66263 Reply
1542308066526.png -(4802B / 4.69KB, 561x420) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>66260
But all of this was foreseen. We knew a dark age was coming. Trek even tells us that to reach utopia we must pass through apocalypse. In fact, almost all science fiction has some version of that meme, and its not just because everyone is copying the 'Sci-Fi Cosmology.' It's a reasonable observation of the way the future always looks relative to the past and the present buried in the subconscious.

Think about it this way. We know that history moves like a pendulum, oscillating between different extremes (regardless of which extreme you call 'good' or 'bad'.) But we also know that history is a feedback loop, magnifying everything about itself with each pass -- be that technology, cultural complexity, etc.

Which means, if we plot the path of the pendulum through time, we have an oscillating waveform that's perpetually increasing in amplitude. Wherever you are along that curve, from your perspective, the next time you will reach a peak higher than the last peak you encountered, you will have to pass through a trough deeper than the last trough you remember. Every. Single. Time.

The underlying question is, like with any feedback loop, at what point does the oscillation overwhelm the capacity of the medium to sustain it?
>>
Governor Torak - Fri, 16 Nov 2018 13:21:11 EST yunQUjt5 No.66265 Reply
>>66263
Except it's more like an upwards trend with larger up and downswings. So I know North/West European history best so I'll focus on that. The dark ages weren't actually as bad as people think and they were miles ahead of any pre roman empire shit. The renaissance was followed by the Napoleonic wars but we didn't even go backwards, we just slowed a bit. Then the industrial revolution was simultaneously awful and a huge step forward and so on.

I'm not even sure it's a single line. I think Guinan's post oversimplifies it too. We've had plenty of new tech and to say we've had nothing is to be really inconsistent with the definition of reinventing ideas. Those more streamlined phones use processors that have a manufacturing method we couldn't image even a decade ago. We are slowly working at editing the DNA of live cells. We can grow spare body parts of meat without cruelty in a fucking warehouse. We have betetr AIs. Culture is both stagnating and improving and we do have a strong growing undercurrent of ignorance and falsehood brought on by new media but it's always existed. It's just we'd previously found ways to master the old media and now we need to rise to the challenge again and ensure it enlightens rather than encourages anti vaxxers and flat earthers. At the same time during my life time a man could legally rape his wife, we are much less needlessly cruel to people who don't just want to fuck the opposite sex, women actually sometimes pay their half of the bill when you eat out. Now admittedly education is being defunded, the vulnerable abandoned to give the rich tax breaks and we're heading to our own bell riots scenario but at the same time it's not like everything will stop as we approach that point.
>>
Tora Ziyal - Sat, 17 Nov 2018 17:18:50 EST iAqQnJBT No.66271 Reply
>>66265
>>Except it's more like an upwards trend with larger up and downswings
So kinda like a line, with oscillations of increasing amplitude??

>>phones use processors that have a manufacturing method we couldn't image even a decade ago
Well, while phone manufacturing has been streamlined relative to a decade ago, processor tech hasn't changed in that time frame. We still use photolithography of MOSFET semiconductors, which is relatively ancient technology. We are shrinking feature sizes using that same paradigm, however.

>> It's just we'd previously found ways to master the old media and now we need to rise to the challenge again
You're oversimplifying the point which is why I think you're missing it. We're not just talking about media, we're talking about every aspect of society. The notion of continually growing advancements is precisely what I'm talking about, and everything you listed as positive can also have a negative. What we are now experiencing is the negative side of the positive we experienced when the internet first boomed. DNA editing can cure cancer and create demi-human chimeras. Vat-meat could solve animal cruelty but not without first concentrating food production in the hands of a few. Better AIs could calculate the answer to humanity's problems or calculate humanity is the problem.

My point is not that things aren't improving, it's that what appears to be decay and degradation are actually their own phases of evolution. The thing people need to realize is that the rebound is just as much a part of the process of progress as the good times. It is the wind up, it stores the energy which makes the progress possible. So, the sky isn't falling -- or it is, but it has fallen before, and it will fall again. It's just part of the process.
>>
Raven Overcoming Orchid !Tz0ULG.7to - Sat, 17 Nov 2018 21:37:24 EST pA4PLfmO No.66272 Reply
>>66260
>The end of the Space Shuttle, unreliable though it was, the potential loss of the ISS (since the Soyuz failed we might have to abandon it if things dont work out by late January)

Thing is, the Shuttle was a boondoggle in the end. If we had spent the same amount of money and R&D on a traditional launch system we could have done so much more with that money. The Shuttle was an artifact of NASA's corrupt 'we can get a metric fuckton of cash if we can figure out how to work nuclear weapons into the sales pitch' Reagan administration days.

We're paying for that now, because that launch system had a finite life span akin to someone driving a 40k car they bought brand new 20 years ago, but now it just sits in the back yard because it has 260k miles and it has rod knock.

Also it's a shame the Russian Federation never kept up it's work on the Buran. A space shuttle that didn't have integrated engines would have been so much more useful. Well, the rocket that shot it into space would have been useful, since you could use it to throw 3 space shuttle's weight of payload into space.

Here's a micro-doc about it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CwLx4L5NRU0&vl=en
>>
Vice Admiral Leyton - Sat, 17 Nov 2018 21:49:49 EST Hw08xEz2 No.66274 Reply
1542509389460.jpg -(21931B / 21.42KB, 500x364) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>66271
but we figured out how to stack shit. That's the serious advancement that brought us Systems on a chip and HBM memory. ARM processors are also legitimately catching up in terms of competitiveness with desktop workloads. 10 more years and we might see them in powerful rigs instead of just netbooks and phones.

Whereas 10 years ago ARM was the go-to for super heavily multithreaded servers with hundreds of cores running thanks to ARM's power efficiency.
>>
Guinan - Sat, 17 Nov 2018 22:02:46 EST D65nZOLV No.66277 Reply
1542510166024.jpg -(38745B / 37.84KB, 602x520) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>66271
>>66263
Well said, society functions like a metronome, and a swing to one end necessitates a swing to the other. As it is said, there is no light without darkness. And as Star Trek tells us, the only way to a utopian future is through decades of hell. Let's hope that's truly the case because we might be in for a hell of a ride.

>>66265
First, I apologize for the rant.. but.. well, I feel the dichotomy of the Vaccines-R-Gud vs the Vaccines-cause-enthusiasm is a false dichotomy that hides the reality of the situation by way of polarization

I'm just going to have to point something out here, something that I personally have never heard voiced, aside from in my own opinion. Vaccines are not good for humanity. And not for the reasons the so-called anti-vaxxer movement stereotypically claims. I believe if you understand the basics of evolutionary theory, you might agree with me, unless you've been overly-conditioned by the polarized propoganda that surrounds both 'sides' of this issue.

To put it in terms Sisko would understand, giving yourself a vaccine is like playing a game of slow pitch softball with children. Getting a disease and beating it yourself is like playing real baseball, with adults, some of which might play in the minor and major leagues. You might get your ass kicked, but as long as you survive, it'll make you a better player. The idea of 'herd immunity' weakens the entire herd by selecting for immune weakness, by taking away the only real form of natural selection that still exists in a civilized species. And worst of all, it's predicated on the false belief that antibiotics are more than temporary. But they aren't. We are engaged in an arms race between microbiota and science which we are mathematically guaranteed to lose. It is inevitable, and worse yet, it may be less than a century away. We can develop as many antibiotic compounds as we like, but life, as Jeff Goldblum says, "uh.. finds a way", and with microbes it does so very quickly, as the microbes living on and around your body have had a generation or two born in the time it took you to read this. Ever see soap or hand sanitizer that claims it kills 99.9% of all germs? Consider that the .1% that survives passes on its survival techniques. It is only a matter of time before evolution overcomes scientific innovation. And all the while, we are training our immune systems for weakness. And it's not just genetic, by the way, I'm not just saying the people who have genetic defects that make them have a weak immune system are the problem. Consider epigenetics, the emerging science that studies the shells of chromosomes. These shells, long thought to be more or less worthless, contain a vast amount of information and control which genes are activated, which are turned off, as well as a wealth of hormonal triggers. But the interesting thing about epigenetics is that we see that things that happen to you in your lifetime can affect which genes are hormones are triggered not only in you for the rest of your life, but in your subsequent children, and their children as well. Three generations. Epigenetics, so far as we know is mostly related to dietary and IMMUNE responses. That's right, immune responses. By dicking around with our immune systems, we are likely affecting the way that our children's, and their children's immune systems function. And what's worse, in most modern societies, there is no control group. No one who doesn't take these vaccines to point to and say 'hey look these guys are shit so therefore vaccines work'. And all for what? To eliminate polio? You realize that only about 1-3% of polio cases ended up with paralysis? Most people wouldn't even know they had the disease. The worst part is anyone who wants to opt out gets lumped into the same category. Sorry, but life is suffering. No one likes being sick, but give it a century or two and vaccines will have only paved the way for some unforseen microbe to kill hundreds of millions, who will have no antibiotics to turn to, and whose ancestors ensured they would have a weakened immune system because walgreens was giving away flu shots for only $20. Humans are so short-sighted when it comes to the future of their own species. If you're going to get vaccinations, it should be as minimal as possible, against the worst diseases only. Not the flu. Not chickenpox. That's fucking stupid. Your immune system needs to do battle with the real thing, as it has since time immemorial, that's how it works. And don't even get me started on fertility treatments.

Secondly, your claim that things were better for most societies in the dark ages than before the Roman Empire seems like a sweeping generalization that ignores the fact that many agricultural and technological innovations were simple lost from one generation to another. Things, technologically, scientifically, and intellectually speaking, were worse than before the days of the Roman Empire for most of Europe, for the first several hundred years at least.

But back to Ziyal's point, (>>66271), whatever hardships the human race endures only serve to propel us to the next level of our evolution. And there are a lot of things facing us in the future, but I am (relatively) hopeful that we can not only overcome them but emerge the better for it.. I only fear that it will take centuries to get there and I'll have to deal with the shit. >>66271
>>
Weyoun 8 - Sun, 18 Nov 2018 06:01:39 EST yunQUjt5 No.66284 Reply
1542538899373.jpg -(74443B / 72.70KB, 985x600) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>66271
We're not swinging backwards and forwards, we're on a drunken wander in an upwards direction. So no, what I'm saying is you're wrong because while we are going up and down, overall we go up further than down. We will not descend into a deeper dark ages than before civilisation, we will not even descend to pre industrial levels. We might drop a bit and we will climb to new heights when we realise our potential. Eventually we will swing but it won't be as far down as the swing before it, even if it will be further from the trend.

I focused on the media because you seemed obsessed with stuff that's just social media noise. I even said it gets more complicated. Stop being obtuse, refusing to acknowledge someone else's points and pretending they said something else doesn't make you more convincing. By the way, I know our space stations are failing but on the other hand we have gotten very good at selfies in cool places.
>>
Gul Evek - Sun, 18 Nov 2018 08:28:24 EST cVf3qXYu No.66285 Reply
When the conversation goes from "can't wait for season 2" to whatever the fuck you poindexters are talking about I think it's safe to say that The Orville really is the new Trek. When Cosmos comes back Fox should air them on the same night.
>>
Tora Ziyal - Sun, 18 Nov 2018 17:17:38 EST HeFO2p/X No.66286 Reply
>>66284
>>So no, what I'm saying is you're wrong because while we are going up and down, overall we go up further than down
That's exactly what I'm saying, so you're wrong that I'm wrong because you have shit reading comprehension, but you're right because you never actually disagreed with me in the first place.

>>Stop being obtuse, refusing to acknowledge someone else's points
It was my point. I am the one who made the original statement that you objected to. How can I refuse to acknowledge my own point? I never said anything about space stations. You have clearly confused yourself on who you were talking to.
>>
Harry Mudd - Tue, 11 Dec 2018 09:24:02 EST Qo4yytmf No.66498 Reply
>>66259
>the concord just made supersonic airflight a toy of the rich for a relatively short time
That was mostly because the underlying concept of supersonic flight was sabotaged (e.g. the trumped up issues with sonic booms) for economic reasons such as when it was realised you could just sell 'first class' subsonic for the same mark-up and make a much higher profit, among other things. That and the Soviets had given up on doing it after fucking it up so it was no longer a concern to respond to them. Actual space exploration (i.e. the Apollo program) was also abandoned once it was no longer a useful geopolitical tool. It's pretty sad in both cases when you consider that the handful of millions it would cost to fund is nothing compared to the cost of e.g. the Iraq War (trillions total) but the depressing fact is humanity only bothers seriously trying to invent new technology for either greed or conflict (and the latter is arguably a sub-type of profit, since some form of material or narrow gain is the goal of conflict). The current goal of humanity is the accumulation of resources and playing that game well means not investing in technology that won't help you do so.

If you want to think of a practical reason for the Federation abandoning money beyond it just sounding utopian maybe it's that: to change the incentive for doing things from only profit/survival to its own reward but acknowledging that humanity at least is flawed so replacing that reward with reputation. Multiple times TNG mentions that reputation (for example through service in Starfleet) is the only way to 'gain' in the Federation I think at least once in direct comparison to how the gaining and hoarding of wealth/resources is a big incentive in our time (possibly the episode with the defrosted 21st century people?).
>>
Guinan - Thu, 21 Feb 2019 22:35:09 EST D65nZOLV No.66541 Reply
1550806509066.jpg -(59047B / 57.66KB, 504x498) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
This episode is pretty fucking good so far
>>
Minuet - Fri, 22 Feb 2019 05:11:20 EST jmSOtBOw No.66544 Reply
>>66541
I'm watching them on a week's delay, but that's good to hear. Season 2 has been pretty underwhelming, with all this relationship focus so far. Not to mention the cutest cast member leaving and being replaced with someone I'm not too hot on.
>>
Guinan - Fri, 22 Feb 2019 17:25:52 EST D65nZOLV No.66549 Reply
>>66544
The loss of Alara is really sad for me too.. but this next episode was pretty nuckin futz. I'd like to say something about it but I feel like anything would be a spoiler. Can't wait for next week's
>>
Natima Lang - Sat, 23 Feb 2019 05:42:26 EST 8wC6phSM No.66555 Reply
>>66541
Great season so far. Only thing I didn't like this episode is how there is no explanation about why he is the only one without red eyes.
>>
Vic Fontaine - Sat, 23 Feb 2019 07:01:07 EST 4WVh8sFm No.66558 Reply
>>66555
cuz he's probably gonna be doing a double agent shit and save everybody or something
>>
Guinan - Sat, 23 Feb 2019 09:45:10 EST D65nZOLV No.66559 Reply
>>66555
I'd say it was mostly for the audience's benefit in identifying Isaac amongst his fellow robot people
>>
Vedek Bareil - Sat, 23 Feb 2019 10:38:14 EST qQ52nl19 No.66560 Reply
>>66555
This was a very silly episode to me. Especially the first "big reveal".

Seriously, of course they went full Skynet on their creators. How else do you wind up with a planet of only robots and no organics? How did no one in the Federation put that 2 and 2 together?
>>
Lt. JG Saavik - Sat, 23 Feb 2019 22:27:42 EST Qo4yytmf No.66561 Reply
>>66541
Saw the twist coming a mile away but at least we're getting something other than pure relationship crap for once.
>>
Arik Soong - Sat, 23 Feb 2019 23:19:57 EST jmSOtBOw No.66562 Reply
>>66549
I look forward to it. It's sad that I have to keep out of this thread, but it has already spoiled stuff for me. We picked a weird day to watch it.

But yes, Alara leaving the show sucks. The new character seems rushed, and mostly there to fill the Alara-shaped gap in the script. I would have liked if they'd done some fun meta humor with the new character, such as casting a smaller actress but making the character ever stronger. Would have opened up the possibility of more exaggerated weight lifting gags. Right now, she just seems kind of... there. I really feel nothing for her, and there hasn't been any good chemistry with the rest of the crew. All the other characters have had good set-ups, some in single episodes or in a few scenes. They haven't done anything like that with the new girl, probably because she's following scripts that already assume all that already happened.

Anyway, I won't read this for a while, I think. Spoilers and all.
>>
Nurse Alyssa Ogawa - Sun, 24 Feb 2019 20:33:25 EST Qo4yytmf No.66572 Reply
>>66562
> I would have liked if they'd done some fun meta humor with the new character, such as casting a smaller actress but making the character ever stronger.
I'd have been ok with going for an explicit play on the Pulaski situation in TNG and setting up arbitrary conflict with a member of the crew and then randomly throw her off the ship a season later.
>I really feel nothing for her, and there hasn't been any good chemistry with the rest of the crew.
They jumped too quickly into giving her a conflict episode (deflectors) before she'd had time to settle in with the crew. It'd have been much better if she initially got on extremely well with both Klyden and Bortus due to perhaps their being blunt/uncomplicated or somesuch and THEN Klyden turned out to harbour what would be by her standards at least very backwards views. At least then you'd have a story that was more about how it's not just the generic fundamentalists/neo-nazis who can be prejudiced but also people who barring some specific prejudices are otherwise open-minded and likeable. That'd be preferable to a retread of 'Mocclan society is cruel/backwards/slow to change/whatever' which was already handled in multiple previous episodes.

Basically I'd have made Deflectors an episode about how serious societal prejudice is mostly silent/invisible and enforced by normal people, not by the usually small but vocal extremists. In general this gets forgotten because communities like to blame that small group even if almost everyone implicitly gave their consent to that group's actions: sort of like how Germany decided to blame only the SS and Gestapo for what happened in Germany.
>>
M'Pella - Mon, 25 Feb 2019 02:30:43 EST 8wC6phSM No.66575 Reply
>>66559
Of course but it could have been addressed by someone. Someone had to have noticed. The kids were there too. They would have definitely asked. Then he'd give some plausible reason like humans prefer it to red but no, they just didn't address it at all.
>>
Keiko O'Brien - Thu, 28 Feb 2019 22:59:38 EST bsMTOC3z No.66602 Reply
1551412778528.gif -(2416178B / 2.30MB, 256x195) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
Really fantastic ending to that 2 parter
Keep up the good shit Orville
that space battle was like 100x more interesting than anything in Discovery
>>
Noah Lessing - Fri, 01 Mar 2019 01:03:46 EST 5SVJcPG+ No.66603 Reply
>>66602
I agree, it was a bit predictable but predictable doen't mean unenjoyable. I found I really liked this 2 parter.

I can't decide if the Krill are supposed to be the early romulans or klingons but the way the acted in this episode it certainly seemed more like a romulan relationship.
>>
Dr. Mora Pol - Sat, 02 Mar 2019 19:05:04 EST +xWHDIPk No.66606 Reply
>>66555
They mentioned that he was the only one built by the AI while all the others were built by the exterminated species. That may not be an explicit explanation but it implies a reason.
>>
KC Hunter - Sat, 02 Mar 2019 21:47:03 EST 5SVJcPG+ No.66607 Reply
>>66606
and why did they only need to build one? Does it have different specs? If their ranks were decimated inthe rebellion then they would have made more than one. Maybe Issac was/is their Section 01001101001 agent
>>
Commander Tebok - Sun, 03 Mar 2019 10:33:20 EST 6z6q1K3s No.66611 Reply
>>66607
They built one because they decided they only needed one.
>>
Alexander Cedron - Wed, 13 Mar 2019 08:31:27 EST VxCpzI+0 No.66706 Reply
I liked the new episode, it was nice to see Gordon not be just comic relief.
>>
Christopher Brynner - Sat, 16 Mar 2019 20:30:31 EST +xWHDIPk No.66752 Reply
>>66706
yeah that last one had an extra dose of trek vibes, the comedy seemed to be thrown in just because they had to hit a quota of jokes or some thing. Not that it was bad by any stretch. Just couldn't help but see the various trek episodes this had influence from.
>>
Vash - Sat, 23 Mar 2019 18:26:36 EST Qo4yytmf No.66821 Reply
Now that is how you do a good Orville episode. Perfect balance of comedy, relationship shite and light SF.
>>
Khan Noonien Singh - Wed, 27 Mar 2019 14:32:05 EST OI3//Vl7 No.66847 Reply
>>66821
Felt like they missed an obvious trick, which was to look up what had happened to the woman in her life.

They could even make her a recurring character, that would help ease McFarlane's penchant for shoehorning in 21st century references
>>
Brok'tan - Thu, 28 Mar 2019 07:50:20 EST Qo4yytmf No.66855 Reply
>>66847
I prefer that they didn't fall for either that cliché or having topa pick up smoking as well. It's easy to do that.
>>
Major J Hayes - Sat, 13 Apr 2019 20:58:27 EST 6z6q1K3s No.67094 Reply
1555203507126.jpg -(247901B / 242.09KB, 1920x1080) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>65279
>Season One
>critics hate it
>/1701/ blows a happy load every week

>Season Two almost over
>critics love it
>/tumbleweeds/

the fuck is going on in here?
>>
Major J Hayes - Sat, 13 Apr 2019 21:03:20 EST 6z6q1K3s No.67095 Reply
1555203800126.jpg -(297344B / 290.38KB, 1920x1080) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>65414
Also this post didn't age at all well. Oops.
>>
Governor Torak - Sat, 13 Apr 2019 21:32:45 EST gxeZ7K9T No.67096 Reply
>>67094
Apparently everybody left the site and the site stopped making money and now the site is basically a laptop in a basement. I'm sure The Orville is still beloved.
>>
Vash - Sun, 14 Apr 2019 00:24:24 EST 4WVh8sFm No.67098 Reply
>>67094
The orville gets mentioned in pretty much all the other threads somewhere

I think we just kind of accepted it as trek in the same general way we accepted that disco doesn't exist
>>
Katogh - Sun, 14 Apr 2019 05:07:50 EST Ao2CSlMZ No.67101 Reply
>>67096
A lot of people didn't LOVE it though.

It was good in places, it had a lot of heart but didn't always pull it off. Seth Rogan isn't funny. I'm not the only one. If it wasn't that brand of humour and the writing develops it could be going places. So far that doesn't seem to be the case (though it's still beating STD). Also the critics love it because it's owned by Disney now. Says a lot about journalism but who the fuck trusts most professional journos in this day and age?
>>
Vice Admiral Nakamura - Sun, 14 Apr 2019 17:37:17 EST oDV8iW5L No.67102 Reply
1555277837019.gif -(3379153B / 3.22MB, 241x200) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>67101
>seth rogan isnt funny
Do you mean McFarlane? I just like The Orville cause its not retarded rebranded Trek trash, it feels like TNG
>>
Kiaphet Amman'sor - Mon, 15 Apr 2019 00:40:36 EST eeplHt03 No.67103 Reply
>>67101
>It was good in places, it had a lot of heart but didn't always pull it off
Sounds like every Star Trek show tbh. I'm not one of those faggots that defend STD by saying Star Trek always sucked, but come on, every show has its stinkers. It can be hit and miss. But The Orville has the feel of exploration and solving problems by being better. The Orville has that in sapdes. The jokes are often too corny to land, but after a while the terirble jokes start to grow on you. And there are some episodes that pull of the "trek episode" feel so fucking well that I can't tell I'm not watching TNG. It's a fucking good show, and their heart being in the right place is really all that matters. Because at the end of every episode I feel satisfied because I just watched an episode of Star Trek.
>>
Corporal Chang - Mon, 15 Apr 2019 00:48:12 EST 4WVh8sFm No.67104 Reply
>>67103
while them jokes are usually awful I just take them as character defects that make the crew a little more human than what we get to see on most trek
>>
Hadley - Mon, 15 Apr 2019 03:43:24 EST NedDWUQ7 No.67105 Reply
>>67104
Trek characters may pop the odd bit of sarcasm, especially in ds9. But they usually never out right joke with each other or act "real" with each other save for the true Bros like laforge and data or O'Brien and Julian.

If a zakdorn war master said the tng crew benefited from a casual familiarity then the Orville crew has that at over 9000.
>>
The Doctor - Wed, 17 Apr 2019 05:08:10 EST HvfLXnkj No.67135 Reply
>>67094
S2 had too much "character development" crap and not enough of the monster/SF concept of the week comfyness that was so great in S1.
>>
Mordoc - Wed, 17 Apr 2019 18:19:19 EST Ao2CSlMZ No.67140 Reply
>>67103
Fair enough. I agree with a lot of what you like about it. I just think I got less mileage out of it than you did. It beats large chunks of voyager (though there were a few episodes which were as good as anything the other series turned out, often for different reasons though), most of enterprise and everything I've seen of DIS. The things you like about it are the heart I'm talking about. I felt that it was a sincere attempt to actually do trek by someone who got what it was really about. I don't think the writers can quite deliver top notch Trek but they aren't making bad TV. All the things you said are true, I just don't feel they are present in a strong enough way enough to say it's something I "love". While I don't dig his comedy I can respect Macfarlane as a fellow nerd and as someone who is an artist and not a producer of products.

If Picard doesn't deliver and Discovery doesn't find its way then Orville will be above average for Trek. If Orville releases a third season and nails its potential I think it can slide in above Voyager very comfortably. Unless it really loses its way it already beats ENT Though I have to admit I enjoyed most of the last season when the execs gave up and it do its own thing


>>67102
Yes. I did.
>>
DaiMon Nunk - Wed, 17 Apr 2019 21:18:09 EST HvfLXnkj No.67141 Reply
>>67140
I'd put ENT over VOY. S4 was great and S1 and scattered parts of S2 can be surprisingly watchable if you go in with a more open mind and remember the future guy is Archer trying to destroy the federation before it got going though really plots that don't try to obsess over arcs are stronger anyway.
>>
Azan - Thu, 18 Apr 2019 19:30:10 EST oLcgy3fm No.67171 Reply
1555630210209.jpg -(867432B / 847.10KB, 1536x2048) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
So there was a thing last night...

https://www.circlejerk.com/r/TheOrville/comments/bemph4/some_pics_from_last_nights_music_of_the_orville/
Some pics from last night’s music of The Orville panel in Hollywood
>One of the questions from fans at the end was “when is the Orville movie coming out?” To which Seth laughed & said, “one step at a time, we gotta do Season 3 first!” Chances are he meant we gotta get season 3 first but I’m foolishly hopeful that it’s good news.

It was a good panel. Showed clips from the show then talked to the composers about it. Their styles & inspirations & how lucky they are that Seth lets them be.

A few of takeaways: - the two part episodes had different composers due to time & schedule. But they ended up sounding similar by accident. The two never had time to talk to each other about it - except for the pilot they aren’t really able to get thematic excerpts from each other. So they mostly reuse the Orville theme & don’t have individual character themes - Fox wasn’t big on the idea of live musicians but Seth wore them down once they realized how big of a deal it was to him. - After seeing the clip of Isaac returning from his 700 years on the planet Seth joked about how they got a bigger budget for costumes in season 2. - the composers love how Seth lets them do their own thing & take advantage of ship shots, etc. “It’s nice to be able to write melodies again & not just atmospheric music” one of the composers said - except for Andrew (who Seth met during his singing albums) the other composers were film score heroes to Seth (used to collect film score albums in college) who was surprised they said yes when he asked if they wanted the job. Andrew technically didn’t have the experience but Seth knew that “if you can write you can write” (like they have one script writer on the show from Friday Night Lights who had never done sci-fi before but he said she knocks it out of the park every time) & knew the guy was good. So while it was a leap of faith it was only a tiny one. - one question from the audience was if Ron Jones was ever considered. While Seth sung Ron’s praises he really didn’t answer that question but instead said how composers are cast like actors are cast for a show. - Andrew occasionally works without a click track. He’ll use it for action scenes where music has to hit but for other moments he’ll free conduct during the record so the music can feel & flow with the scene better - the composers have to compose without any of the FX due to schedule. So most of the time they’ll see the characters reacting to something out the window of the ship as the actor staring at a green screen. The scoring stage is the first time they see any visual effects - though only about 75% of the way done. It’s often a “ahhhh” moment to see how their guessing works in conjunction. So far it’s been rare that their swells & hits are late due to guessing but it happens.
>>
Azan - Thu, 18 Apr 2019 19:35:00 EST oLcgy3fm No.67172 Reply
1555630500209.jpg -(515883B / 503.79KB, 2048x1536) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>67171
>But it can be fixed. - scoring session times vary widely due to the amount of music in each episode being different. Also type of music (conversation Vs action) can change the length as well. - (slight spoiler) the last episode of this season has some intense music in it. It was one of the longest scoring sessions, not because of any mistakes while playing, but because of how much of it there was - a lot of the cinematic moments with music on the show are thanks to Fox allowing them to have a longer show with fewer commercial breaks. Normally those would have to be trimmed or cut for time but they get to have "shoe leather" - on this show they (especially Andrew) try to dip the music themselves for dialogue instead of having the mixer do it. Any brass will drop out & woodwinds will take over. It's a pet peeve of Andrew to hear when the mix drops instead of the music doing so naturally so they try to do that - Don't make fun of the projectionist & the 20 second delay (of the theatre not the show) - to get approved Bruce sent over the theme song as a piano only track (instead of an orchestral computerized mock-up). They figured that if the piano alone could sell the piece then they truly had something memorable. - the theme song came first then the FX, animators & editors did their thing to time everything like the final engines to the music. Usually it's the other way around - the theme changes keys & moves around the keyboard a lot to symbolize the ship exploring & moving around space. - they only discussed season 1 music since that's what was on the CD - Seth wasn't happy that Fox puts a blanket compressor on the audio tracks for broadcast since it changes the sound of the music but it's what they do for every show on the network as a rule. If you want to hear the real untouched sound for an episode watch it on Hulu or AppleTV. (Or buy the La La Land Records CD!) - I didn't get an autograph since I didn't pay for the higher up ticket. I brought my CD from home anyway hoping maybe I could get one but no. They had it separated - when composing for the "flatland" scene the composer didn't know what it would look like due to lack of visual FX. And at the time Seth didn't know either to tell him because it hasn't been decided yet. So sometimes the composers have to rely & guess from the script since they can't always see or know what it will look like.
>>
Jossen - Thu, 18 Apr 2019 23:00:00 EST bOlOhkyn No.67175 Reply
>>67171
>Harmony Gold Theater
oh shit are they going to edit Orville in with Seaquest and Babylon 5
>>
Ardon Broht - Fri, 19 Apr 2019 15:26:02 EST 5sgrBooI No.67180 Reply
1555701962753.jpg -(282315B / 275.70KB, 1920x1080) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>it's an Ed and Kelly want to fuck but don't because of reasons
So this was what? The third? The fourth time they've Chris Brown'd this issue? And another on-the-nose speech from Ed. I want to like this show but goddamn they're making it hard this season.
>>
Quark - Fri, 19 Apr 2019 16:47:17 EST kXEoM6SO No.67182 Reply
1555706837306.png -(929571B / 907.78KB, 731x872) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
this show has become skins set in space, how sad

also, is adrianne palicky anorexic? those fucking legs mane
>>
Private E Hamboyan - Sat, 20 Apr 2019 06:52:14 EST 4xG8xdJJ No.67197 Reply
>>67182
Perhaps they used a different actress entirely and cgi'ed her face on.
>>
Colonel Lovok - Sat, 20 Apr 2019 07:13:50 EST gjBqwT+B No.67198 Reply
>>67182
>this show has become skins set in space
Do you really not remember how much of this shit TNG did?
>>
Captain Rixx - Sat, 20 Apr 2019 13:33:10 EST kXEoM6SO No.67204 Reply
1555781590074.png -(1851026B / 1.77MB, 1205x872) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>67197
actually, no, they didnt do that
there are many other scenes where you can see she has skin and bones legs
its just that the uniform hides it a little, its more noticeable when she wears normal clothes and the camera is filming her whole body and not just the upper part

this woman seriously needs to start eating some burgers smh tbh femme
>>
Captain Rixx - Sat, 20 Apr 2019 13:36:07 EST kXEoM6SO No.67205 Reply
>>67198
i watched TNG in its entirety last year and im pretty sure 80% of the episodes were science related and the ones that werent were usually geopolitics related

next to none of them were about who is dating who
>>
Admiral Patrick - Sat, 20 Apr 2019 14:20:49 EST g9gFrCIQ No.67206 Reply
>>67205
>next to none of them were about who is dating who
you should probably count again, and expand your search to every episode that is a literal fucking soap opera because there are so fucking many.
>>
Lt. Reginald Barclay - Sat, 20 Apr 2019 17:29:02 EST 4WVh8sFm No.67208 Reply
>>67206
>>67198
>>67182

Are you sure you're watching the show and not reading/watching something else entirely while thinking you're watching the show because I am not seeing what you are saying


>>67180
>>67135

I don't mind the character development if they actually get to continue the show for awhile, then it'd be nice to have those building blocks laid down

also I am not really seeing this drop in quality y'all be talking about, s2 seems to be right on par with s1 to me
>>
Dr. Mora Pol - Sun, 21 Apr 2019 01:20:31 EST eeplHt03 No.67210 Reply
>>67208
I think there has been a drop in quality, but only very slightly. And it's only really noticeable because the last couple episodes have been character heavy. The show is still brilliant and one thing that has really offset the character focus in season 2 is that the comedy has really found its identity. I've had some serious belly laughs this season. I don't think it was nearly as funny in season 1. Also, I don't mind the "character development" (wtf does it mean to put that in quotes) in season 2 because they've all really grown on me.
>>
Ikat'ika - Sun, 21 Apr 2019 12:38:15 EST 6EqCNQLb No.67215 Reply
>>67198
I do and I shit on TNG plenty for filler/character crap/reused plots, most people forget about them because a lot of TNG is so bland that it fades from your memory a few weeks after you see it. 'TNG did it' is not a valid excuse though or they might as well bring on a not-Wesley.
>>
Vice Admiral Leyton - Mon, 22 Apr 2019 02:00:43 EST 5SVJcPG+ No.67222 Reply
>>67208
Better overall than S2 of TNG, VOY, STD, or ENT. None of those were overall as good as S2 of The Orville was. (Its the first of the year so I just finished another complete rewatch) I think putting it that way and looking at it with that perspective its actually very good for a second series.
>>
Tallera - Mon, 22 Apr 2019 10:09:02 EST +FKPghSM No.67223 Reply
>>67215
>'TNG did it' is not a valid excuse

It's not an excuse. The argument was literally that Star Trek never did this shit. But it did.
>>
C-Higgy !lfsExjBfzE - Tue, 23 Apr 2019 01:32:13 EST pBmJ+Nqv No.67229 Reply
So hold up, does this mean that Past Kelly rejecting Past Ed is gonna fuck up Present Ed and Present Kelly's timelines?
>>
C-Higgy !lfsExjBfzE - Tue, 23 Apr 2019 01:34:54 EST pBmJ+Nqv No.67230 Reply
>>67182
Also comparing The Orville to Skins of all shows? This is someone that watched the latter show like twice through but come the fuck on bro.
>>
Lee - Tue, 23 Apr 2019 20:36:25 EST 5SVJcPG+ No.67236 Reply
>>67229
i thought that was quite obvious. What I want to know is Did the mindwipe malfunction or did someone make it do so and if so who and why
>>
Thalen - Tue, 23 Apr 2019 23:35:59 EST yLFBT7xS No.67239 Reply
>>67229
I thought the implication was that she was from a branching timeline all along after all. Her future isn't set in stone, and she's not doomed to the same fate as Old Kelly. We might see her show up in future episodes as something like a "Mirror Universe" equivalent.

>>67236
I took it to be like Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind. They erased her conscious memories, but she still retained a subconscious awareness of her experiences. The mindwipe was a success, but it's still not flawless technology.
>>
Guinan - Fri, 26 Apr 2019 12:10:56 EST D65nZOLV No.67273 Reply
1556295056303.jpg -(59758B / 58.36KB, 480x640) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>65279
Well, just saw the finale episode of season 2. I have to say, I like this entire series, there wasn't an episode among them that I didn't like. I really hope that the series continues (so far it's neither cancelled nor renewed so it's in a quantum state of flux). If you look at it purely in terms of storytelling and continuity, it's like they did what TNG was reaching for, what VOY failed to capture, and what ENT almost achieved: episodes easily able to stand alone but which also have building character development stories that intertwine to build an overall continuity that tells a story within itself. In my eyes, the idea of VOY that we were sold when it was new was that it was this Oregon Trail in space, and that the whole journey home was itself going to be an overarching story intertwined with every single episode, where stuff that happened had lasting effects, and so forth, but of course we didn't get that. We got TNG/DS9 leftovers being served on the wresting channel. (Come to think of it maybe it's good that it happened that way for OUR sakes, because it may have perturbed the timeline so much otherwise that /1701/ wouldn't exist.)

I would wager that Seth had a larger overall story planned out from the way things seems to be trending, and I hope that he gets the chance to tell us another season at least
>>
Tokath - Fri, 26 Apr 2019 20:41:00 EST kXEoM6SO No.67276 Reply
1556325660465.gif -(3600395B / 3.43MB, 240x196) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
what a disappointment this show is, they have no guts to do bold story-lines, they keep playing it safe, and that is why im dropping it, im done

a good example of a bold show is Farscape. at one point both aeryn and crichton get cloned and the then they die and the clones go on in their places. the writers did not at any moment chicken out and undo the stuff

the orville on the other hand is 100% afraid to do anything bold, everything is resolved in the same episode, nothing serious ever happens that wont be undone in a couple of minutes

they had a great opportunity with this timeline thing to do something really really bold, to change the timeline of the show and never go back, to explore the kaylon-conquered galaxy and continue from there, but nooooooooooooooooooo, kelly by some bullshit reason didnt get mind-wiped and because of that she is able to tell the timeline isnt the "proper" one. and guess fucking what, they just happen to have a fucking time machine to undo everything

even fucking STD was bold enough to send the disc*very 1000 years into the future and never come back

im done with this show, we were promised sci-fi and we only got is soap opera and relationship crap, fuck all of you saying that star trek did this all the time, STAR TREK NEVER DID THIS KIND OF BULLSHIT

im also not gonna bother writing like a human being because this chan has the worst color scheme ive ever seen and it hurts my eye
>>
Persis - Fri, 26 Apr 2019 20:55:34 EST 4xG8xdJJ No.67277 Reply
Why do they keep mixing meters and miles?
I get it the average US viewer has some sense of what a meter is, but a kilometer not so much. But if they do that why not stick to freedom units for sake of consistency then?

Mixing measurement system is just bad for space.
>>
Colonel Lovok - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 11:36:40 EST gOUFeB9G No.67288 Reply
>>67276
Star Trek did exactly that and you know it. You probably hate TNG too.
>>
Vosk - Mon, 29 Apr 2019 09:20:21 EST yLFBT7xS No.67302 Reply
>>67239
Well, I just saw the last episode, so I guess disregard everything I said here. I was clearly wrong.
>>
Deanna Troi - Mon, 29 Apr 2019 10:25:15 EST c0sJvd+s No.67304 Reply
>>67276
Lol you clearly haven't made it very far if you don't think the show never did anything that makes an impact on the show's universe.

Also, all your "critiques" are just critiques of the episodic formula. Go watch Game of Thrones.
>>
Chakotay - Mon, 29 Apr 2019 17:13:14 EST 26o2d26S No.67313 Reply
1556572394857.jpg -(408979B / 399.39KB, 2560x1440) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
It was... okay, I guess? The premise was hard to swallow and there were plenty of enthusiastic details to whine about but the show doesn't seem terribly concerned with that; story comes first with these guys and that seems to be working since reviewers are vomiting daisies all over it. Now we just wait and see if it gets renewed.
Btw the soundtrack has been released.
>>
Grand Nagus Gint - Thu, 02 May 2019 18:40:43 EST TcSMTlpl No.67365 Reply
Finally caught the last three episodes.

>Sanctuary
Was predictable and more or less shits all over the original interesting idea of whether or not we were judging their society by our standards (the cleft pallet comparison) in favour of a generic 'oppression is bad' episode. Also that's three Mocclan society is bad episodes in one season if I'm counting correctly: it was neat to have it as a one-off in S1 even if I think About a Girl was pretty shallow for what it was but if this was back in the 80s or 90s I'd be immediately swapping channels at the merest hint of that now.

>Tomorrow, and Tomorrow, and Tomorrow
Neat premise but as usual anything with Ed and Kelly is let down by their story being generic sitcom/tv drama fodder. I would have . Sometimes like with Lasting Impressions The Orville rips off a Trek episode and improves it. This was more like a rehash of the first Thomas Riker episode shitty timewasting old romance included. Also the Kaylons never would have given up waiting outside the black hole since they're machines who don't care about time and Issac in this very same show happily spent 700 years on a single planet saying it'd be mere seconds. That's really just a minor plot hole.

>The Road Not Taken
Obviously similar to a few TNG and VOY time travel episodes/season enders down to even having the ex security chief make an appearance. You could see where the plot was going but it was fun enough even if it was nothing special. I like the fact they specifically mentioned it was Claire not being aboard that was the issue rather than just Mercer not being captain: the idea that a seemingly minor choice like that could affect history so badly is a lot more fun than the idea of one man being so great he could do what nobody else in the Union's fleet could despite them all being highly trained. Also the resistance deserved to die because their tactical idea of 'let's all stand in the open and shoot floating heads' just seems silly. I liked evil Issac.

Overall I'm unimpressed with S2. Too much office in space and character bullshit not enough comfy monster/SF idea of the week fun. I actually miss some of the more blatant humour too. I'll happily give it another series since Trek often took 3-4 to get going but I suspect seth is going to be too taken by the better critical reviews and will carry on down this path instead of taking the good parts of S1 and blending them with S2's character writing like I'd want.

Crossposting this from another trek board elsewhere
>>
Grand Nagus Gint - Thu, 02 May 2019 18:50:52 EST TcSMTlpl No.67366 Reply
>>67222
ENT bucks the trend there because, in my opinion, its S1 was the second strongest season it had. I'd probably agree though that's it better than everyone else's S2. I only hope that they make an effort to gather feedback from the people who watched and enjoyed S1 rather than the bandwagoning critics and circlejerkors who only jumped on the show after STD flopped and they saw the real Trek fans siding with The Orville.
>>67273
>Storytelling and continuity
I will credit them with at least referencing past episodes and the issues/plots therein regularly. SG-1 did that and it makes things feel a lot more realistic for characters to bring up past similar experiences than have Picard repeatedly fail to call a yellow alert the moment troi has a headache or bad dream.
>>67276
Not every show has to pull constant twists and dramatic bullshit out its arse. I prefer a more episodic format with perhaps occasional background plotlines that carry over and you dip in and out of (e.g. Orville's krill and kaylon plots) to season long arcs like BSG or S3 of ENT. Farscape is great though, if you do want something more character based and fags should watch it.
>>67277
Can't speak for burgers but most bongs mix meters and miles every day. Only older people care about yards and feet outside of measuring people's height which is still feet and inches.
>>
Noah Lessing - Thu, 02 May 2019 20:38:59 EST bOlOhkyn No.67368 Reply
>>67366
in the USA if you said meter people will assume you mean the gizmo that measures the thing
>>
Admiral Nechayev - Fri, 03 May 2019 01:55:22 EST 60zgf9Xq No.67372 Reply
>>67368
I always assume they are just talking about The Meters, you know the funk band?
>>
Species 8472 - Fri, 03 May 2019 15:01:23 EST TcSMTlpl No.67381 Reply
>>67368
Interesting. Bongland was similar until the EU regulations required metric.
>>
Lt. Darien Wallace - Tue, 07 May 2019 11:52:19 EST gOUFeB9G No.67444 Reply
1557244339963.jpg -(154034B / 150.42KB, 376x633) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>67381
lol you ass holes gave us this system and then drop that shit and today every one makes fun of us for using imperial.
>>
Icheb - Thu, 09 May 2019 23:57:23 EST 88XCVyhW No.67460 Reply
1557460643293.jpg -(298807B / 291.80KB, 1200x918) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
Hi, haven't been here in ages.

Just checking in, do you guys like Orville?

Watched both seasons on hulu recently. Great shit.

One of the few things I've seen in life that have completely exceeded my expectations. Went in thinking it was going to be Family Guy in space and was completely surprised to find out it was the best Star Trek fan fiction ever conceived...in a good way. It's a new Star Trek series that capitalized on hindsight in the best way. Surpassing Discovery in every way which in all reality is truly a disappointment but we have something new at least and a new precedent that can be followed in the long run.
>>
Guinan - Fri, 10 May 2019 00:54:17 EST b048m/L8 No.67461 Reply
>>67460
This boats has been almost entirely unified in support of the Orville and in opposition to STD. However, some people have whined about the abundance of relationship heavy episodes in s2.. but personally I'm right there with you, I can't believe how consistently good it is
>>
C-Higgy !lfsExjBfzE - Fri, 10 May 2019 14:08:47 EST wVzEiZvf No.67465 Reply
>>67461
This. The relationship episodes can be hit or miss like I thought the episode with Gordon in the simulation with the girl from the time capsule was well done though the Ed/Kelly stuff is hard for me to care about. But yeah the general consensus on here and on /mtv/ is The Orville has a positive reception.
>>
Sarah Sisko - Fri, 10 May 2019 15:13:07 EST Tws+Pvrh No.67466 Reply
>>67465
>>67461
I like it when they focus on relationships. How characters interact with each other, how they can grow from that experience with each other, etc. In STD it's just the Michael Burnham show and everyone else gets resigned to the background while we focus on explosions. The relationship aspect grounds it in a way so that we can connect with those characters which makes the stakes higher because you actually give a shit about what's happening. Also Seth wanted to focus on those episodes more because it would save budget for the big Kaylon episodes. I feel like it was a good decision.
>>
Gor - Sat, 11 May 2019 11:12:50 EST NxCadDVu No.67474 Reply
>>67461
>boat
I'm fine with us being a boat. I call being the ship's Broccoli.
>However, some people have whined about the abundance of relationship heavy episodes in s2.. but personally I'm right there with you, I can't believe how consistently good it is
I'm one of them but it's still better than STD and most other modern TV.
>>67465
>I thought the episode with Gordon in the simulation with the girl from the time capsule was well done
That had just enough actual light SF in it to make it a good episode as well as a character focussed one, though the use of one of the show's strongest actors obviously helped. I wouldn't classify it as relationship-filler.
>>
C-Higgy !lfsExjBfzE - Mon, 13 May 2019 00:50:26 EST ZrugFMJZ No.67493 Reply
Orville renewed for a 3rd season so we can all rest easy.

>>67466
>>67474
I mean doing those kinds of episodes aren't a bad idea and it helps to space out the action heavy overarching storyline driven episodes. It gives the audience the chance to see characters' backgrounds being fleshed out and personal relationships between characters being developed. And I wasn't saying that particular episode was relationship filler but that those kinds of episodes can be hit or miss but that one was certainly a hit and one of the best episodes of the season.
>>
Captain Rixx - Tue, 14 May 2019 04:46:08 EST mSdo0TI4 No.67506 Reply
>>67493
Fuck yeah. Orville has got to be the best current sci fi. If dark matter was still running there would be competition.
>>
Homn - Tue, 14 May 2019 22:28:28 EST Qlw+gQL1 No.67518 Reply
>>67493
>I mean doing those kinds of episodes aren't a bad idea and it helps to space out the action heavy overarching storyline driven episodes. It gives the audience the chance to see characters' backgrounds being fleshed out and personal relationships between characters being developed. And I wasn't saying that particular episode was relationship filler but that those kinds of episodes can be hit or miss but that one was certainly a hit and one of the best episodes of the season.
The problem is there's been very little actual SF episodes to space out with the character crap this season.
>>
C-Higgy !lfsExjBfzE - Tue, 14 May 2019 22:49:01 EST ZrugFMJZ No.67519 Reply
>>67512
Correction, it's on Hulu.

>>67518
Which is an inevitability given that they're limited by the constraints of their budget but I agree more action and less drama would help bolster the sci fi nature of the show.
>>
Homn - Wed, 15 May 2019 01:11:11 EST Qlw+gQL1 No.67521 Reply
>>67519
>Which is an inevitability given that they're limited by the constraints of their budget but I agree more action and less drama would help bolster the sci fi nature of the show.
SF doesn't have to be action based or expensive. Arguably the stronger episodes both of Trek and of The Orville so far are those that don't spend a lot of money and time on too much special effects.
>>
Cmdr. Peter Harkins - Wed, 15 May 2019 04:17:23 EST 60zgf9Xq No.67523 Reply
>>67521
>SF doesn't have to be action based or expensive

this right here, the best episodes in my opinion are the total headfuck ones which usually have very little actual combat in them

I'm talking Frame of Mind and Inner Light my dude
>>
B'Elanna Torres - Wed, 15 May 2019 11:26:30 EST gOUFeB9G No.67528 Reply
>>67523
yeah man the best sci fi is just used a vehicle for what Q considers the final frontier for Humanity.

this is also the reason I like B sci fi so much.
>>
Jimmy - Thu, 16 May 2019 11:36:57 EST fYnLtQ3w No.67539 Reply
>>67523
Exactly. I'm not opposed to a bit of action now and then in the same way as I'll forgive the occasional character heavy episode but that shouldn't be the bulk of the show. If you dig back to Trek's origins a lot of TOS's creativity with SF premises is actually because they didn't have the budget to do tons of special effects and had to find excuses for why they were reusing existing sets from other shows.
>>
Nevala - Mon, 20 May 2019 01:26:01 EST HeFO2p/X No.67580 Reply
So I just started S2 and got to the astrology planet episode and it has such a huge science blunder in it that I stopped watching to complain in this post. So to save Bortas and Kelly they engineer a fake star to fix the Gelliac constellation. For reasons relevant to the C-plot about the Gelliac with a baby we learn that the end of the Gelliac sign was like two days earlier. But then we see the constellation Gelliac in the night sky. What determines being in a sign is the position the sun is in at dawn...so if two days earlier the sun was in Gelliac in dawn, it obviously can't be in the night sky now unless this planet has years that last like two weeks. This is really dumb for an episode that's basically all about preaching about how scientifically illiterate astrology is.
>>
Dmitri Valtane - Mon, 20 May 2019 02:35:00 EST YPNiWCbC No.67582 Reply
>>67580
I'd be more concerned with a start shining from low orbit that with the editors getting the night sky correct.
>>
Nevala - Mon, 20 May 2019 16:22:56 EST HeFO2p/X No.67587 Reply
>>67582
They handwave that by saying the shuttle jams up their telescopes, which, ok, you gave me a line to show me you were paying attention I can deal. But you can't handwave away the position of the planet and the sun. It's sloppy and it makes me think maybe they don't actually have science advisors? Like does Seth think he actually knows enough about science to do it all himself? Cause obviously not, Trek wouldn't make an error like that in the hey-day.
>>
Kevin Mulkahey - Tue, 21 May 2019 12:12:07 EST 26o2d26S No.67592 Reply
1558455127854.jpg -(270122B / 263.79KB, 1920x1080) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>67587
>It's sloppy and it makes me think maybe they don't actually have science advisors? Like does Seth think he actually knows enough about science to do it all himself? Cause obviously not, Trek wouldn't make an error like that in the hey-day.

It's not sloppy. It's deliberate. They already showed us in season one that the science will easily take a back seat to accommodate plot and drama. From a filmed media perspective you want the fake star and the planet in the same shot so people can see them together and understand what's going on. If the star had instead been placed at a more distant location it would have taken time to show that and to explain that "Oh hey we're putting the fake star machine here and this is a LaGrange point or whatever so we can leave it forever and it won't move." But that's two or three minutes spent not showing Ed's clumsy speeches to the aliens and the crew's murderfest escape from the prison so it had to be compressed into "Our fake star is so close to the surface that birds are flying into it but the aliens will never figure it out."

They had a similar problem on Star Trek The Motion Picture. Roddenberry wanted the drydock to be in a geosynchronous orbit. He was told that to properly show it the Earth would have to be the size of a basketball so he tossed the idea. Trek did its own fudging but it was nowhere as aggressively egregious as Orville.

That whole episode was a dumpster fire imho.
>>
Kornan - Tue, 21 May 2019 17:31:59 EST HeFO2p/X No.67593 Reply
>>67592
>>It's not sloppy. It's deliberate.
Well that makes me even saltier. I wouldn't care so much if the show wasn't amazing in every other way. I know you're better than this Seth.

On that note, 'A Happy Refrain' is amazing. 'In Theory' if Data wasn't such a space autist (which is saying a lot considering Isaac's severe case of space enthusiasm in this episode.) It generally blows my mind how like, supportive of each other and positive the crew are. There's nothing else like this on TV right now.
>>
Cmdr. Erika Benteen - Wed, 22 May 2019 21:09:23 EST bOlOhkyn No.67607 Reply
>>67592
yeah that's also why fleet combat in DS9 requires everybody to fly their ships about thirty feet from each other so they can all fit in the screen at once
>>
Dr. Yuris - Thu, 23 May 2019 03:22:03 EST 7NUfjlmN No.67612 Reply
>>67580
I never even noticed that.
>This is really dumb for an episode that's basically all about preaching about how scientifically illiterate astrology is
I assumed it was taking aim at pseudo-science in general rather than only astrology. You could argue parts of it would also apply to religion too I guess but that angle was handled better in S1 anyway.

>>67592
>That whole episode was a dumpster fire imho.
I actually liked the original slightly goofy premise and first third or so of the episode, it worked in a monster/planet of hats of the week sort of way like how TOS would take something and make an extreme analogous version of it to criticise it. Also even if it was a bit overdone how excited they got over first contact hit the right note and the clues about everything not being quite right were good. I just wish they'd given those 1-2 minutes to the basic scientific explanations even if they were handwaves and didn't have the excessively violent escape attempt because the ending goes to shit. It needed to give a short bit of time during the negotiations to Ed asking them why they think the Union would share their beliefs when they had an entirely different set of constellations, for example, and an escape attempt that didn't involve seeming to justify the planet's views about how prone they are to violence would have been fine.

Actually if we're on the topic of improvements I'd also like to have seen them be in less of an obviously shit camp and more of a high quality 'care facility' which, while not explicitly bad, was still a prison of sorts. This could ether have been played straight where they genuinely try and provide the best experience for a group they think is fundamentally flawed (historical parallels with certain views about colonisation/the white man's burden) or to also have a dig at psychiatric facilities and how prone they are to misdiagnosis or those studies they've done here where people have been committed to them then acted 100% normally and instead of being discharged have just been diagnosed with having further issues.
>>
Dr. Yuris - Thu, 23 May 2019 03:23:14 EST 7NUfjlmN No.67613 Reply
>>67607
And obviously why ships in Trek and indeed The Orville are always on the same plane. Or why maps of the Neutral Zone are always 2D.
>>
Leeta - Thu, 23 May 2019 05:08:58 EST gOUFeB9G No.67614 Reply
>>67592
I can excuse "orbital magic" by keeping in mind these powerful future ships can hover at many times over 1G for days so what is an orbit but a parking spot or the scenic route at best. But leaving some thing supposedly with out thrust so close and it's supposed to keep a celestial relative position is stretching it at best but what ever it's not hard sci fi by any means. I just can't believe any planet of people would be that stupid to be fooled so hard and expect that to stick.... or was this episode really a jab at how most of Picards solutions would probably unravel the second they left orbit.
>>
Leeta - Thu, 23 May 2019 05:12:46 EST gOUFeB9G No.67615 Reply
>>67612
If the prison set didn't look like they just bolted a bunch of ply wood together they got form home depot that afternoon it might have been ok but that was so low budget that gay jolly african-americans from outter space had better sets.
>>
Guinan - Fri, 24 May 2019 19:51:26 EST 188qcWQ0 No.67642 Reply
>>65279
Hey y'all niggas wanna hear some shit that will rock your world?!
The actors for Kelly and Gordon just got married
>>
Krax - Sun, 26 May 2019 19:16:31 EST HeFO2p/X No.67660 Reply
Hey so I take back everything I said about the astrology episode proving their science was dumb. I wanted to throw my screen out of the room when they got to a black hole's event horizon and were like 'no shhh it'll be ok if we just put the tip in.'
I guess the general sweetness of the two Kaylon 2-parters makes up for it, but goddamn, what? 'Like, the light can't go fast enough to escape, but luckily we can, by going reeeally slow.' I guess I just need to stop trying to take it's technobabble as seriously as genuine Federation-grade Treknobabble.
>>67642
I can't. even. I guess it proves they're both good actors since I can't imagine that at all, but, wow.
>>
Vice Admiral Leyton - Wed, 29 May 2019 05:29:49 EST gN+YgDIS No.67686 Reply
>>67660
Nigga warp drive goes faster than light. It's not that retarded.
>>
Pah-wraith - Wed, 29 May 2019 20:07:57 EST HeFO2p/X No.67687 Reply
>>67686
They don't have warp, they have quantum drive. And, you can clearly see they aren't going to quantum to get out, they're just maneuvering out on thrusters like it's a normal day. If they had said they needed to quantum to get out I would have ignored the fact that they weren't being crushed and been fine, but they go out of their way to show that they understand that light is too slow to escape a black hole, then go slowly to escape a black hole. It's a double-punch to the brain I can't take.
>>
Odo - Sun, 02 Jun 2019 14:37:22 EST 4xG8xdJJ No.67700 Reply
>>67687
Since there is no tech manual on the Orville you don't know that.
If you weren't so dense you'd conclude that what you see as thrusters are actually reaction-less force generators, which should they ever exist are a plausible way of archiving FTL.
Generally from what we've seen from the show Planetary Union tech seem to be a about a century beyond 24th century Federation tech so even that is consistent.
>>
Christopher Pike - Tue, 04 Jun 2019 00:54:42 EST HeFO2p/X No.67714 Reply
>>67700
>>If you weren't so dense you'd conclude that what you see as thrusters are actually reaction-less force generators,
So wait, my original statement is that I think this is dumb, give reasons based on what I see on the screen for why its dumb, and you say no, I'm dumb because I didn't imagine some total other bullshit that's nowhere to be found in order to wipe the assholes of the writers for them?
We know they have quantum drive as their means of achieving FTL. They say it plenty of times. When they are at quantum speed, stars go whooshing past them -- which they didn't do in this scene. They don't say anything about magical force generators, which aren't real so you can't say that they could achieve FTL, which also isn't real.
So uhm, again, I still think what I said at first, and I think your reasons for saying what I said is dumb are pretty, uhm, dumb, so I'm getting off the ride here.
>>
Captain Kurn - Tue, 04 Jun 2019 01:17:21 EST MDQN8/b3 No.67715 Reply
>>67714
Stop being enthusiastic, Orville isn't trying to be some super hard scifi
They have "warp" engines that can be stable inside an event horizon, why is that so hard for you to grasp
>>
Lauren - Tue, 04 Jun 2019 16:32:48 EST 60zgf9Xq No.67721 Reply
>>67714
don't worry I heard that season 3 is going to be entirely made up of technical explanations of the ship and it's going to be riveting television
>>
DaiMon Tarr - Tue, 04 Jun 2019 20:21:24 EST HeFO2p/X No.67723 Reply
1559694084726.jpg -(26414B / 25.79KB, 480x360) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>67715
What's hard for me to grasp is why you're spending so much energy defending a non-existent plot device when the most obviously true and simple statement is to say 'that happened because the writers were lazy' and move on to never speak of it again?

>>67721
Trek was made by and for technical spergy nerds who wanted but probably weren't going to get into the space program. Shaming me for being interested in the technical aspects of space ships on a trek board is not a very effective move...
>>
Legate Porania - Tue, 04 Jun 2019 21:36:14 EST jwjJ078M No.67725 Reply
>>67715
There's a bit of a difference between just being soft SF and handwaving boring technical explanations and doing things which are just in outright opposition to what even the average viewer would expect. I don't mind the planet thing from the Gilliac episode though I don't like how the ended it in terms of writing for example since the ability to do something at least broadly like that would be within their capabilites even if the method they picked to do it is silly but it is a bit questionable to treat a black hole in such a slapdash manner. I mean it didn't bother me much in what was overall a silly/indulgent episod like that but usually in soft SF black holes are treated as a scary inescapable death pit which is about what the average person thinks of them in reality. Randomly giving a fairly unsatisfying explanation for them not being so is questionable particularly when, if it were so easily done, it'd be a common in-universe tactic for hiding and also then something the Kaylons would thus expect and have a counter to ignoring that if they were machines they'd happily wait outside it for longer than the average human lifespan anyway. Hell we have an in-universe example of that with Isaac in Mad Idolatry from S1 so this is more than just nitpicking how non-robotic they act in general since it's a direct contradiction of previous canon.

It did make me sit and think, even if only for a second or so, that their action was strange which means it could do with at least bit of an explanation even if it was only an in-universe 'refactor the deflector shield, it's risky but it's our only chance' to show why people wouldn't do it routinely/why they can do it despite their tech level not seeming up to it. If something breaks suspension of disbelief like that it's pushing beyond what you can excuse just by being soft SF.

>>67721
>don't worry I heard that season 3 is going to be entirely made up of technical explanations of the ship and it's going to be riveting television
That would unironically be better than episode after episode of relationship crap and rehashes of 'Mocclans are bad' which get worse every time. Actually I've just realised that the portrayal Mocclans is going through the same decline as DS9's Ferengi where at first they were just radically different to humanity/the 'good guy' Federation/Union and interesting because of it but gradually turning into generic 'bad people' societies who are just extreme parodies of negative parts of current or past human society with funny shaped heads who can only be redeemed by adopting humanity's/the Federation/Union's society and morality, something that is the exact opposite of Trek's approach to cultural differences.

Sadly this shit seems to be reviewing well so we'll lose what made S1 so refreshing for the niche market that likes actual SF first and anything else second now that there's a larger market in the audience (and sympathetic hack critics) who just want generic character drama and lazy progressive-leaning progressive is a fucking terrible term analogy flavoured with the trappings of another genre (crime, SF, westerns, fantasy). At least we've yet to see season long arcs and unexpected pregnancies.
>>
Legate Porania - Tue, 04 Jun 2019 21:42:24 EST jwjJ078M No.67726 Reply
1559698944923.jpg -(182359B / 178.08KB, 1480x480) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>67725
>Sadly this shit seems to be reviewing well so we'll lose what made S1 so refreshing for the niche market that likes actual SF first and anything else second now that there's a larger market in the audience (and sympathetic hack critics) who just want generic character drama and lazy progressive-leaning analogy flavoured with the trappings of another genre (crime, SF, westerns, fantasy). At least we've yet to see season long arcs and unexpected pregnancies.
Or to put it another way the show seems to be slowly morphing from light SF with a healthy dose of comedy into the same generic drama with limited comedy, character focussed crap and poor attempts to incorporate mainstream-issues-by-analogy instead of a show that does its own thing and tries to speak about issues that aren't just pulled from recent headlines and solutions/points of view that aren't just what the mainstream or media pretending to be the mainstream thinks are correct. This basic format is usually dressed up by slapping in spaceships or whatever to pretend that its another genre when it's really not just like how the reimagined BSG was just generic 'gritty' twisty/filler drama with the surface-level trappings of the show it stole from or The Walking Dead quickly turned into an endless soap opera with zombies.

I'm probably too worked up about this but I get annoyed when a show goes to shit this early on.
>>
Legate Porania - Wed, 05 Jun 2019 15:46:21 EST jwjJ078M No.67738 Reply
>>67732
Yes, and while TOS used analogy it actually targeted things other shows weren't and gave opinions different to what 90% of other media were giving: it was actually saying something rather than agreeing blindly with the mainstream at the time. The difference is ORV is just picking the same controversies and opinions everyone else is doing. About a Girl's first half is better since it's approaching something similar but a bit different to current controversies and brings up other ideas like the comparison to a cleft pallet, though it shits the bed in the second half by again going for the obvious human/current society answer and having some of the dumbest courtroom arguments Trek has ever seen. Actually one thing S2 ORV does deserve credit on doing differently is the Mocclan porn scenes. Most media is far touchier about even hinting at the realities of homosexual sex/porn compared to what they're willing to show of hetrosexual porn and even though it was played for laughs here I'll give it some credit.
>>
Corporal F Hawkins - Thu, 06 Jun 2019 20:18:31 EST b2kjICL7 No.67745 Reply
(spoilers) So can I go through the episode with Kelly having her younger self appear from her past. Time travel is always to another universe, so when they send her back it wouldn't be to her original place. It's another place where most likely there would already be a Kelly there. Working quantumly from the machine that started it, there's only one instance in one universe where she is pulled from her past.
I don't know if they can target the original universe? Or if it's possible, they seem to think in trek its always something different on a tangent.
>>
Nava - Fri, 07 Jun 2019 02:54:40 EST 60zgf9Xq No.67746 Reply
>>67745
well if you subscribe to the idea that all possible universes are out there then you would only have to find one out of an infinite number of them that the kelly in that universe was disappeared from her timeline right before they sent her "back"
>>
Corporal F Hawkins - Fri, 07 Jun 2019 11:12:39 EST b2kjICL7 No.67750 Reply
1559920359387.jpg -(38765B / 37.86KB, 633x356) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>67746
Infinity wouldn't fit into the realm of the physical because of size and layer limitations, the expansion would overweigh the boundaries.
Find an infinity of an already insignificant possibility is too small.
>>
Corporal F Hawkins - Fri, 07 Jun 2019 12:57:15 EST b2kjICL7 No.67752 Reply
>>67750
umm thinking about it, if that's their angle then when they send Kelly back the many time lines of themselves sending her back simultaneously could cause overlap and multiple Kellys could end up at the other end on some of the canceled out timelines.
Anyway, a person can only do a number of things, so there may be not that many time lines going on in the first instance.
>>
Tokath - Sun, 09 Jun 2019 05:23:05 EST 60zgf9Xq No.67769 Reply
>>67750
>Infinity wouldn't fit into the realm of the physical because of size and layer limitations, the expansion would overweigh the boundaries
I disagree
>>
Colonel Lovok - Sun, 09 Jun 2019 10:46:34 EST b2kjICL7 No.67774 Reply
>>67769
but if you flip an infinity into another one to cancel it out from a time-stamped physical point, there would be unexpected results. Maybe because there was and always is in Trek, the stories.
>>
Admiral Owen Paris - Wed, 12 Jun 2019 22:16:54 EST b2kjICL7 No.67795 Reply
1560392214960.webm [mp4] -(8725687B / 8.32MB, 640x272) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>67779
Sounds like it's all turning into an episode of Future Man.
>>
Admiral Hayes - Thu, 11 Jul 2019 21:55:07 EST 5SVJcPG+ No.67940 Reply
>>67914
Wait, Orville is back for S3 in August and they are just now releasing a comic between S1 and S2?
>>
C-Higgy !lfsExjBfzE - Sun, 14 Jul 2019 03:08:20 EST ZAnqIwnj No.67959 Reply
>>67940
Season 3 isn't back till midseason 2020, which seems to be when they're airing the show going forward, so it makes sense to release the comic this week before it premieres in a few months.
>>
Homn - Sun, 14 Jul 2019 23:32:03 EST 5SVJcPG+ No.67962 Reply
>>67959
It doesn't matter when they release the comic or the s3. The comic takes places between s1 and s2. Both of those are already over. I mean its nice to have but when it releases doesn't really matter one bit. If the comic took place between S2 and S3 it would make more sense.
>>
C-Higgy !lfsExjBfzE - Mon, 15 Jul 2019 14:09:38 EST ZrugFMJZ No.67964 Reply
>>67962
I get what you're saying in that they could have done this last year because there was a year long wait in between seasons but I guess the characters and stuff they're introducing in the comic will become a part of this upcoming season.
>>
Prophet - Tue, 16 Jul 2019 23:48:56 EST 5SVJcPG+ No.67970 Reply
>>67964
That is a fair assessment and a good possiblity. My point was simple that the comics they are releasing take place between S1 and S2 both of which have ended. Now, I realize that they can't go back in time and release the comics in the corrent time frame I'm just saying that S3 premiere date and the release of the comics doesn't really matter(unless your speculation is true) since the comics will take place more than a season after it "should" and since it is between S1 and S2 then s3 has no bearing.
>>
Ensign Herbert - Sun, 21 Jul 2019 05:15:30 EST wPqebFzz No.68004 Reply
1563700530497.jpg -(215163B / 210.12KB, 1920x1080) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
This just in: The Orville is moving to hulu.

https://variety.com/2019/tv/news/the-orville-season-3-hulu-1203274526/

>MacFarlane announced Saturday at the show’s San Diego Comic-Con panel that Season 3 of the sci-fi series will air exclusively on Hulu rather than on Fox as it has for its first two seasons.

>According to an individual with knowledge of the situation, MacFarlane’s current workload and the length of time it takes to finish work on the show’s numerous special effects sequences would have meant that Season 3 would not have been ready for a midseason debut. New episodes are now expected to launch on Hulu at the end of 2020. The streamer currently has the first two seasons available to subscribers.
>>
Guinan - Sun, 21 Jul 2019 12:44:49 EST q+ftfeAn No.68007 Reply
>>68004
Fuck.. late 2020? That's a whole nother year. So this change is probably going to be permanent? I have hulu so that's no big deal.. but it was nice to be able to watch it on actual television
>>
C-Higgy !lfsExjBfzE - Sun, 21 Jul 2019 17:45:35 EST ZAnqIwnj No.68018 Reply
>>68007
Looks like it's a permanent change but it's probably for the best like The Expanse moving from Syfy to Amazon Prime Video.
>>
Thomas Riker - Tue, 23 Jul 2019 03:47:51 EST VJrL+BwN No.68042 Reply
1563868071276.jpg -(291272B / 284.45KB, 1920x1080) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
What the shit.

https://news.yahoo.com/orvilles-adrianne-palicki-scott-grimes-040654188.html
>Adrianne Palicki and Scott Grimes have ended their relationship just days after stepping out together.

>Two months after the pair tied the knot, Palicki, 36, has filed for divorce from her Orville costar, 48, according to The Blast.

>Court documents obtained by the outlet indicate that the actress filed the papers on Monday in Los Angeles.

It was Grimes' third marriage. How do you fuck up this hard, this fast?>>65279
>>
Guinan - Tue, 23 Jul 2019 11:41:05 EST b048m/L8 No.68046 Reply
>>68042
That is genuinely depressing.. I hope it doesn't leave toxic fallout leaking onto the show again like the whole Alara thing. I want Orville to not die, and if either of the two leave the show or get weird it would seriously hurt not only the show but my soul as well.
>>
Jadzia Dax - Thu, 25 Jul 2019 03:44:21 EST WLJtCX4q No.68061 Reply
>>68046
I'm sure Seth MacFarlane is thrilled that two of the most important characters on the show did this. Considering how much they interact with each other I have a hard time envisioning a scenario where shit wouldn't get weird.
>>
Guinan - Thu, 25 Jul 2019 09:11:35 EST b048m/L8 No.68063 Reply
>>68004
>>68042

I mean it seems obvious to me that THIS is the real reason s3 is delayed. It's just really, really bad optical to blame your actors

Report Post
Reason
Note
Please be descriptive with report notes,
this helps staff resolve issues quicker.