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420chan is Getting Overhauled - Changelog/Bug Report/Request Thread (Updated July 26)

booze

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- Sat, 08 Feb 2014 05:48:22 EST YQbpBzlB No.12678
File: 1391856502037.gif -(35370B / 34.54KB, 600x600) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. booze
In the aftermath, liquor will be a valuable means of trade and keeping morale up as well as medical purposes. You need to know some ways of getting some good, clean alcohol.
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Faggy Digglelet - Sat, 08 Feb 2014 08:13:55 EST Ti9Rfmi/ No.12679 Reply
I like the wok Still, Looks pretty damn good. I'd suggest a 7/8th's if a seal around the wok with a handful of filter paper in the 1/8ths section to stop the pressure getting too high and to also reduce the loss of vapour compared to one without a seal.

In terms of getting a better taste.
You're going to want to make sure you have a glass/ceramic collection bowl.
The stool should be plastic. (Wood is a bitch to disinfect and Metal would transfer a lot of heat.)
The aim with these Idea's is to prevent you from "cooking" your distillate which will cause a burnt flavour, be very dry and unpalatable. (But like you'd care if you hadn't drank in a year or so.)

My personal preference would be to employ a a long metal tube in which the distillate gas cools down and then drips into a container outside of the heated area. (Probably has a little more loss of vapour due to open tube, But allows for simple and easily fixable still that can be made much larger.)
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Polly Gindlewodge - Sat, 08 Feb 2014 12:56:40 EST f11bOjgF No.12680 Reply
this shit is going to blow up
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Faggy Digglelet - Sat, 08 Feb 2014 15:16:37 EST Ti9Rfmi/ No.12681 Reply
>>12680
If you're an idiot then I highly suggest you stay away from stills. You sire should go stand in the corner if you don't trust yourself.
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Oliver Clayworth - Sat, 08 Feb 2014 16:04:34 EST iHLEtJum No.12682 Reply
That thing would be tiny. It would probably be half a days work to distill a decent sized shot.

Homebrewing beer would be efficient, but distilling would be more trouble than it's worth unless you're going to do it on a much larger scale.
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Faggy Digglelet - Sat, 08 Feb 2014 17:55:33 EST Ti9Rfmi/ No.12683 Reply
1391900133621.png -(62946B / 61.47KB, 800x405) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>12682
Without access to a large supply of disinfectant or even good brewers yeast will require you to distil your brews or risk a bout of creamy, white coloured diarrhoea. Or worse. ( I've never heard of any being lethal, Just extremely unpleasant.)

Also that still is fucking huge for a homebrew still.
I "think" it's just literally the brewing bin with a few bits thrown in and a wok on top.
-Bad idea btw, You need to remove the head and the tail for distilling, Since it's 15% before distillation there's generally a handful of toxins present from fermentation some of which float, some of which sink. Using a syphon remove the Heart of your brew. Which is what you should use for distillation.

Also pic related, Is a typical size home-brew setup for the guys who like to experiment (And also don't have the dollar for a good setup)
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Polly Honeyhood - Sat, 08 Feb 2014 21:32:48 EST f11bOjgF No.12684 Reply
1391913168945.gif -(9069B / 8.86KB, 811x394) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>12683
not to mention the lack of a thermometer,


all you need to make a still is a pressure cooker, some corks/rubber grommets, and copper tubing. cold water for the coil would be nice as well but water in general is good enough.

pic releated
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Eliza Crillychere - Fri, 21 Feb 2014 18:23:36 EST PEZyd0pP No.12722 Reply
>>12683
>Without access to a large supply of disinfectant or even good brewers yeast will require you to distil your brews
Nah. First of all, you CAN get wild yeast by just letting your shit spontaneously ferment. They'll taste strange, but you can re-use them, and they'd get better as time goes on. Shit, MOST booze back in the day was made with wild yeast, and it turned out alright. Especially when it comes to wine and cider. And you won't get sick, unless you made the fermentables with a high pH like potatoes (in which case, hell yeah you gotta distill). Fruit is safe. Mashed grain is safe. Anything that start fermentation in an aerobic environment (which is a good practice) is safe. ANything with a low pH is safe.

> You need to remove the head and the tail for distilling, Since it's 15% before distillation there's generally a handful of toxins present from fermentation some of which float, some of which sink. Using a syphon remove the Heart of your brew.
You're confused. Heads and tails are the first and last bits to come out of the still, not the layers in the wash. Using a siphon doesn't get rid of the heads and tales. Siphoning gets rid of the lees (yeast that sank) and yeast or flavoring that's floating (wood, hops, herbs, etc.). If you've got mold contamination floating on the top, then siphoning can also help with that.

Also, your pictured setup is ridiculous. THat's for small-scale lab distillations. A 2 liter version of that setup would cost at least a couple hundred bucks new. Lab glass is expensive. >>12684 is a more accurate low-cost setup, but even then there are cheaper/easier pot stills one can make.

Check out homedistiller.org if you want to learn.
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Eliza Crillychere - Fri, 21 Feb 2014 18:31:51 EST PEZyd0pP No.12723 Reply
>>12683
ALso, disinfectant isn't a big deal. people brewed for thousands of years without it. Boiling water and cleaning with that is effective enough. Or passing shit over a flame. COntamination won't make you ill.
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Fuck Mirringwet - Fri, 21 Feb 2014 21:16:13 EST G6HToNeh No.12724 Reply
>>12722
I get you in some parts, But I just need to explain this.

Wild yeast works a treat in a tight situation.
But quite simply, no matter how hard you try, No matter which flavours and sugars you throw in that mix. Regardless of your setup and how fancy your equipment is. If your yeast is wild yeast. You might as well piss in a bottle and call it ale cause it'll probably taste the same.

In regards to removing toxins, Read a book on syphoning spirits lad.
For ale it's just making sure no yeast gets caught, With anything stronger than 12% or so it's dealing with methanol among others as well (Which will fucking kill you regardless of how big your beer belly be) and if you don't remove that shit from your distillate before you distil. Well then you just dropped your flash point of your distillate by anywhere in-between 5% to 35% percent. Have fun with the ambiguity mixed with the fire/pressurised container. Not to mention that stuff is poisonous to everything that needs to breathe as well.

>>12723
Ah yes, Could be one the leading reasons our lives spans are 3-4 times longer than that of humans who lived less than 300 years ago.

Personal note, My setup is actually quite bitching, That image just represents the absolute basics, Yanno layman terms. no need to get complex, Just enough to preserve the feel and knowledge of how simple a distillation is.
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Phoebe Handleson - Fri, 21 Feb 2014 22:14:28 EST PEZyd0pP No.12725 Reply
>>12724
>In regards to removing toxins, Read a book on syphoning spirits lad.
I googled "syphoning spirits", and all I'm seeing is shit about world of warcraft stuff. There was one link to a homebrew store for siphons.
> With anything stronger than 12% or so it's dealing with methanol among others as well (Which will fucking kill you regardless of how big your beer belly be) and if you don't remove that shit from your distillate before you distil.
1: Methanol/Ethanol and water are homogenous in the mixture, thanks to diffusion. You will not reduce the amount of methanol or fusel alcohols by siphoning. You are simply wrong about that, and I challenge you to find a reliable source saying otherwise. Look at here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diffusion
2:Methanol and fusel alcohols are removed during distillation, not before. The first shit to come out of a still is methanol (heads). MeOH has the lowest boiling point. Then comes the mixture of ethanol and water. Then more water/ethanol, with some higher alcohols (the tails).
3: The methanol will kill you if you drink the concentrated heads. When it's diluted throughout the ethanol/water mixture, it poses less of a threat. In most cases, you'll die of ethanol poisoning before methanol poisoning. That is why you A: throw out the first portion of distallate. And B: Don't collect the distillate in different fractions. Let it all mix (except for that first bit you throw out, and the last bits you let drip to the waste bucket.
4: The antidote to methanol poisoning is ethanol. So as long as you've got true booze in your mixture you'll be fine. See #1. You want a homogeneous mixture. That mixture is easy to get, thanks to our friend diffusion.
5: I'm not trying to minimize the dangers of methanol. If you manage to concentrate a bunch and drink it, you die. If methanol and fusels are in your booze, you will at least get a worse hangover.

Look at it like this: Wine has a significant amount of methanol in it. Drink a bottle of wine, and most people get a worse than usual hangover. If you were to distill that methanol and drink it, you'd probably be fine except for a headache. If you drank 14 bottles of wine, you'd die of ethanol poisoning. If you distilled the methanol from 14 bottles of wine, you might go blind (it would produce about 1/10 the LD50, so you might even die. Shitty situation). However, if that methanol were dispersed with the ethanol from 14 bottles of wine: a) you'd be drinking some of the antidote b) you'd be drinking a dangerous amount of ethanol to approach the dangerous amount of methanol. MORAL OF THE STORY: THROW THE HEADS OUT.

Now, most methanol produced during fermentation is from hydrolysis of pectin. Red wine has a lot of pectin, which is why I used that as an example. A quick google search showed that the FDA considers 0.1% MeOH safe in red wine, so that's the percentage I assumed with above estimates. I assumed a 100mL LD50 (again, quick google search), meaning anything approaching that is dangerous.
> Well then you just dropped your flash point of your distillate by anywhere in-between 5% to 35% percent. Have fun with the ambiguity mixed with the fire/pressurised container. Not to mention that stuff is poisonous to everything that needs to breathe as well.
Say you were distilling pure methanol. Yes, you'd want more ventillation to avoid poisoning. However, It's pretty much the same amount of a fire hazard (pure methanol is a standard organic chemistry solvent. It's not like ether, where you've gotta be on your tippy toes about fire hazard).

>Ah yes, Could be one the leading reasons our lives spans are 3-4 times longer than that of humans who lived less than 300 years ago.
No, It's the reason brewers, winemakers, monks and alcoholics didn't get cholera. Disinfectants are very important for surgery and open wounds. Fortunately, a low pH in a liquid is all that's needed to prevent pathogenic microbes from growing. I don't know why acidophile pathogenic bacteria in liquid media don't seem to exist, but I'm glad the niche isn't filled. THere might be an exception to that rule, but if so, it's rare enough to ignore.

>Personal note, My setup is actually quite bitching, That image just represents the absolute basics, Yanno layman terms.
Oh, so it's just an illustrative diagram? Or do you have a similar setup? Feel free to get technical, I'm a chemist. If you have a similar setup, kudos. It's atypical, but cool.

Check out the website I mentioned. There's lots of misinformation about distilling, and you seem to have absorbed a lot of it (happens to the best of us).
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Phoebe Handleson - Fri, 21 Feb 2014 22:29:13 EST PEZyd0pP No.12726 Reply
>>12724
>But quite simply, no matter how hard you try, No matter which flavours and sugars you throw in that mix. Regardless of your setup and how fancy your equipment is. If your yeast is wild yeast. You might as well piss in a bottle and call it ale cause it'll probably taste the same.
It depends on what you're making, where you are and your luck. If you're making a sour beer, you've got a good chance at success. If you're making cider, you've got an excellent chance of success. If you're making wine, you've got a OK chance of success.

If you're making a lager, you're pretty well fucked. If you're making an ale that's not sour, you're fucked. If you're unlucky, enjoy your vinegar. Because you're fucked.

I think the history of how long it takes to domesticate yeast is hazy, since for thousands of years, people didn't even know they were using yeast. What's clear is that wild yeast is viable, but a bit of a crapshoot. If you get a wild yeast brew that's drinkable, you should brew a few batches with it. If you still like it, keep it. If not, try the crapshoot again.
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William Dibbleteck - Sat, 22 Feb 2014 19:41:04 EST G6HToNeh No.12731 Reply
>>12725
Your post is most detailed, I think we agree on the same points but for different reasons. My aim is taste, Yours appears to be theory, which is admirable none the less, I guess it's best I take better precautions and see if any the stuff I think I know is wrong after this long.

My setup btw is brew bin, fixed side valve (2.5cm from base) drains straight into still which is basically a pressure cooker inside a water bath set to 74C. There's a removable Ssteel pipe that fits into the valve. Runs for 100ft in coil fitted to the fixed side valve inside another brew bin filled with cold water. It then drains the distillate into either bottles or into a container to be distilled again. (Only for when the taste is horrendous and you need to water it down with alcohol)

Sounds weak, But that water bath is the babe, makes the entire set-up almost stationary, just need to click a couple buttons and let it go.

Yes disinfectant was a good thing for mankind, But a barrel of brett ale (That's the name of the vinegary ales you mentioned) isn't disinfectant Its sludge waiting for the water to disappear. When it does there's where a shit load of bacteria (mostly bad) will gorge itself on leftover yeast particulates. I know that's not terribly bad or particularly unsafe, But I'd just rather not have to deal with the diarrhoea again, I learnt that lesson a long time and many, many pants ago.

Also yeast is easy, You can take a single dried brewers yeast and split it almost indefinitely if you have a refrigerator, Keep early generations chilled for a long time so that when your main culture is losing it's edge you can reintroduce a whole bunch of high quality yeast to take over again.
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Ebenezer Piblingdick - Mon, 24 Feb 2014 09:58:03 EST PEZyd0pP No.12736 Reply
>>12731
> My aim is taste, Yours appears to be theory, which is admirable none the less, I guess it's best I take better precautions and see if any the stuff I think I know is wrong after this long.
Yeah, that's true. I don't have any experience distilling booze. I've read about it, and I know all the chemistry involved (I'ma chemist). Siphoning might help with the flavor (IDK), but It does nothing for the methanol content. homedistiller.org has a lot of info on both theory and flavor.
Sounds like a nice setup you've got.
>Also yeast is easy, You can take a single dried brewers yeast and split it almost indefinitely if you have a refrigerator, Keep early generations chilled for a long time so that when your main culture is losing it's edge you can reintroduce a whole bunch of high quality yeast to take over again.
Yeah, true. It's also possible to harvest from bottle conditioned beer. Also, if you have a fermentor that makes "topcropping" possible (taking yeast when they're floating at the top of the brew), the yeast will keep their edge almost indefinitely. THat's the original way, and some breweries still do it (granted, they still have a micro lab to keep tabs on the yeast).

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