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Worst battles in human history

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- Fri, 12 Feb 2016 07:46:23 EST CwlDQeu1 No.56482
File: 1455281183872.jpg -(127399B / 124.41KB, 800x614) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. Worst battles in human history
I'm in a pretty soul crushing mood today and I've been thinking about the battle of Passchendaele. All factors considered is there a worse battlefield in human history? Will the world ever see such horrors, like those witnessed by the men in the general vicinity of Ypres during the war? 24 hour shelling, machinegun lines, snipers, chemical attacks and corpses everywhere? By comparison the highly mobile combat led in WW2 seems like a dream to me. Am I missing something?
37 posts and 1 images omitted. Click View Thread to read.
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Ernest Hizzleham - Sat, 26 Aug 2017 14:51:00 EST Rv8hXdtD No.57262 Reply
1503773460029.jpg -(262231B / 256.08KB, 1280x720) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>57255
I really enjoyed the movie, mainly because I kept laughing my ass off at ridiculous scenes like that.

Not sure that was the filmmakers' intention, though.
>>
George Piddlestone - Sun, 27 Aug 2017 01:31:18 EST PMeC+LId No.57263 Reply
>>56496

In that one example, carthage held out for seven fucking years, which would have been enough to defeat almost any other invading enemy, except the romans. The romans first asked for 10,000 talents, and when this was paid, asked them to give 300 noble hostages, and when this was done asked them to give up their weapons and they did so to keep peace, at which point the romans asked them to abandon the city to live in the hills, and then the carthaginians realized they had been tricked, now having to defend the city without weapons. I'd say they did pretty well considering. The romans burned them out house by house, much like the crushing of the warsaw uprising, it saves men to simply destroy rather than take.
>>
Matilda Cickleforth - Sat, 02 Sep 2017 19:43:37 EST i2pzJk0z No.57264 Reply
1504395817878.jpg -(94803B / 92.58KB, 509x587) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>57263

the 3rd punic war was the stuff of legends unseen ever again in the ancient world

the carthaginians actually dug a canal under the nose of the romans to create a new harbor and avoid the blockade, men swam in the ocean carrying torches to set roman ships on fire, carthaginian women used their own hair to create bow strings etc

after carthage fell, the character of the romans never recovered they fought barbarians and civil wars and slowly faded away

What if...?

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- Tue, 18 Jul 2017 01:26:19 EST Redgi3D4 No.57230
File: 1500355579902.jpg -(216281B / 211.21KB, 965x772) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. What if...?
So what if all modern wars suddenly had to be fought with swords and other pre gunpowder weaponry?

What would the military tactics be like? Would small groups of armed men run around as they do in modern war with guns or would we have to revert back to lining up in a field?

At first i thought it's obvious that we would adopt modern strategies and tactics but if an enemy decided to go for the line up in a field approach and just started marching toward whatever their target was (a city for example) small pockets of men would seem kind of pointless.

If someone can be bothered to waste time giving me some speculations, i'd be very interested to read. Also would be pretty interested in any examples of ancient armies doing operations that closely resemble modern strategies.
6 posts and 2 images omitted. Click View Thread to read.
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Barnaby Cuckletedge - Tue, 08 Aug 2017 07:23:37 EST rbK+gS1r No.57245 Reply
>>57244
Durrr, of course, they work fine on shit like gambesons and naked skin/normal clothes too.
>>
Cyril Gindleshit - Wed, 09 Aug 2017 11:50:28 EST Redgi3D4 No.57246 Reply
>>57241
>I have an essay to write now.
Do it, please cover tactic and strategy differences
>>
Cyril Hucklespear - Thu, 10 Aug 2017 10:36:41 EST Redgi3D4 No.57247 Reply
On the topic of crossbows, i'm not sure what my rules allow for but if kevlar was allowed to stay then i'm guessing we'd have to go back to plate anyway. Last time i checked most blades would be able to get through kevlar and I assume crossbow bolts would be able to penetrate too.

Churchill

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- Wed, 21 Sep 2016 09:17:19 EST jg4fL/jL No.56882
File: 1474463839322.jpg -(56051B / 54.74KB, 648x365) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. Churchill
So Churchill has been on a lot of people in the UK's lips on account of him now being on a lot of people in the UK's notes.

There's been a lot of backlash from the people who link him with the Bengal famine, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bengal_famine_of_1943 and blame him for their deaths. There's also stuff like this popping up http://hitlerorchurchill.info/ (try it, it's interesting). Plus there was his collosal fuck up during WW1 with the Dardanelles.

ALL THAT SAI I can't bring myself to hate him. People of history don't exist in a vaccume, and are products of (and in Churchills case, shapers of) the time they live in. I'm not denying that the Bengal famine was an atrocious loss of life and as a Scottish person I've never been a fan of Britain or the British Empire, but part of me just allows it. This alcoholic infinitely quotable badass that embodied the attitudes of the nation he ruled at the time. Even if the nation was allowing massive amounts of Bengalis to starve to death...

I don't really know what I'm trying to say here, I'd like to think it isn't so simple as "He's a product of his time so that makes it ok" but I can't really explain it otherwise. I'm no apologist to the atrocities commited on his behalf but I just find myself unable to get that pissed off with him. I've heard there's people refusing to accept the £5 notes with him on it.

So what do you guys make of him?
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Lydia Dartbanks - Tue, 04 Jul 2017 11:43:57 EST YYFtDXxk No.57212 Reply
>>57005

I love this revisonism lately to use pictures of Roosevelt and Churchill with some Canadian rather than the usual photos with Stalin as the third party
>>
Doris Mucklekurk - Sun, 16 Jul 2017 06:28:17 EST 9CoQeyOj No.57228 Reply
>>57212
>it's revisionism to use different photographs than that one famous one of the yalta conference
>>
Walter Blisslewut - Sun, 16 Jul 2017 14:47:13 EST sVSDp2E0 No.57229 Reply
>>57228
Hey man, history is what you see in history textbooks.

Historical Inconsistencies in Christianity

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- Sun, 07 May 2017 12:22:37 EST zZvV2w/f No.57182
File: 1494174157092.jpg -(163253B / 159.43KB, 736x997) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. Historical Inconsistencies in Christianity
I think I just became aware of a large one that most people probably look over or ignore.

According to the Pauline Epistles in the NT, Paul of Tarsus was tasked by the Jewish High Priesthood to go to Damascus to root out the Christian believers there and take them back to Judaea for judgment and execution. This account is already problematic enough considering Paul's supposed Pharisee background and his collaboration with the Sadduccees, and the fact that "Christians" had not even coalesced into a separate religion at the time Paul said his conversion occurred.

But the glaring problem is that: how is it that the Jewish High Priests had jurisdiction over Damascus? At the time, Judaea was a province of the Roman Empire, and of such low status that it was administered as a client of the Roman province of Syria (an Imperial-type Province).

Furthermore, the Jewish Priesthood had many of its prerogatives removed stripped: by 28 CE, the Romans had removed or limited the ability of the Jewish courts to impose capital punishment or to judge themselves by their own ancient laws. Considering the reputation of the Priesthood/Sanhedrin of being 'collaborators', it's likely they themselves

So how the fuck could Paul have been tasked by the Priesthood to go to Syrian Damascus to arrest Roman subjects there? It's the equivalent of a Louisiana policeman driving all the way to Austin in Texas and arresting people there and claiming jurisdiction. It makes no sense, and reeks of a fabricated story.
3 posts omitted. Click View Thread to read.
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Sidney Blackstock - Wed, 28 Jun 2017 19:12:54 EST +cP8QzkY No.57205 Reply
Rome, despite being viewed as installing completely new and radical governments and changing the duties of the people themselves, making slaves et cetera, often used the government currently in power as a force underneath their army.

What reason would they have to care about ordering the church around if they paid taxes?

Also I read on /b/ some guy doubting Jesus existed and while the few fragments of his life that remain are proof enough for some people, I wanted to point out that the New Testament mentions that the Jewish churched paid the Romans to be silent about him. There are still some sources beyond the Bible, but what better source to learn about Jesus anyways?

The fact that the Bible is incredibly accurate is proof enough I think
>>
Lydia Dartbanks - Tue, 04 Jul 2017 11:26:09 EST YYFtDXxk No.57209 Reply
Jews were given more autonomy than most since the Romans respected their "authenticity" if you will--they were old, and well documented as very old, and Rome--being deeply conservative--revered old things.
>>
Phoebe Wavingnine - Mon, 10 Jul 2017 07:34:52 EST n86/MK/a No.57215 Reply
Religious people are very good at ignoring inconsistencies in their beliefs. That's all there is to it mate.

saharan slave trade

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- Fri, 28 Apr 2017 22:44:19 EST tC/dl63y No.57170
File: 1493433859782.png -(329421B / 321.70KB, 600x499) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. saharan slave trade
Any of you follows know any good books about the trans Saharan slave trade? Watched a few good YouTube videos on it and was wishing to learn more.
7 posts omitted. Click View Thread to read.
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Nathaniel Clayspear - Thu, 15 Jun 2017 05:36:52 EST ncjsiAmY No.57198 Reply
>>57194
Sounds like the rich has been using racism to divide the working class for centuries...
>>
Beatrice Happerbury - Tue, 20 Jun 2017 11:44:06 EST YiUudFwN No.57199 Reply
We shouldn't be too surprised. Redneck Southern states do intentionally underfunded their own school systems, after all. It only makes sense that they would be so ignorant of their own history along with everything else.
>>
Jarvis Pinnersere - Sat, 24 Jun 2017 01:09:14 EST N6lY6tKM No.57203 Reply
>thread on islamic slavery
>devolves into "muh US slavery was worse"
classic

The peasants, citizens and background characters of history.

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- Wed, 28 Jun 2017 21:19:05 EST 99/qp7+6 No.57206
File: 1498699145998.jpg -(65944B / 64.40KB, 500x385) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. The peasants, citizens and background characters of history.
Most of history is the mundane everyday goings of the populous,
I believe that the masses are really what history is about, not great men.
I'd like to take a chance to talk about the people, the collective, the
"zeitgeist" if you will of the population.

ITT: We talk about the people as if they were a great person.

For instance:
The majority of peoples in the United States (2017) is a slightly overweight, suppressed and tired person. He works for a company that sees him as little more than a resource and he's pretty tired of it. But he's loyal and works hard, to a flaw even and takes any abuse he's given at work for a fairly low wage.

He doesn't trust the government and is skeptical of most people claiming to be a savior. He's very religious and donates a good amount of his cash to christian charities. He tends to only read things that affirm his beliefs and is not open to new ideas. He is divorced or in a loveless relationship, he doesn't much care for his children who for the most part are not as far as he'd hoped they'd be in life.

U.S man (I say man because the U.S is inexplicably masculine) is getting over a long racial-based guilt. He drinks a few beers a day. He drinks a few cups of coffee a day. He's on medication and sometimes doesn't even know what for. He's skeptical of his neighbors, especially if they have darker skin.

U.S man, currently is evaluating his options and is jumping to extreme stances. I hope he can hold it together.
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Betsy Sinkinwidge - Fri, 30 Jun 2017 18:08:43 EST OIj+UVJT No.57207 Reply
1498860523050.jpg -(268879B / 262.58KB, 1024x685) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
Hell yeah. I think about that shit all of the time.. The real super heroes are the mother fuckers that ate shit and lived through horrid conditions to propel humanity into a state where it was able to thrive. And I mean.. The level of shit eating just built progressively on top of itself.

i.e. everyone has ate shit, but some have ate more shit than others. The barely evolved homo sapien that lived into there 30's and endured the most painful ailments is one level.. The European settler that lived in the more recent centuries was one.. I mean altogether, those struggles add up to get us to this point, here..

It's pretty wild because we don't know shit about them. And really, they're us. We are reflective of them. But their conscious experiences were so much more fucked up than ours - not to say they didn't experience pleasure, too. Or even a satisfying life. But there's so much painful momentum that had to be built up by those poor assholes to get us here.

Historical artifacts questions.

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- Wed, 21 Jun 2017 13:27:22 EST CfVamwXk No.57200
File: 1498066042627.jpg -(3052098B / 2.91MB, 4032x3024) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. Historical artifacts questions.
Hey fellow stoned history geeks. I have a very interesting piece of militaria in my collection. My research into this is sadly minimal, I learned that Special Forces trained in Germany, and were housed in the same barracks the Waffen-SS trained in. The Death Head was sort of a moral patch in a way. But I would like any more info on this Beret if you guys have any knowledge in this.

And too keep the thread going, if anyone has any historical item from history they are curious about post them here and tell us what you know. Maybe someone can answer a few questions.
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Nicholas Dunkinfuck - Wed, 21 Jun 2017 13:29:25 EST CfVamwXk No.57201 Reply
1498066165627.jpg -(3178744B / 3.03MB, 4032x3024) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
Here is the soldiers name. Googling found very little as well.
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Archie Dingershaw - Fri, 23 Jun 2017 23:23:43 EST nzDJ3VGr No.57202 Reply
The flash (badge) goes with the 5th Special Forces Group. I seriously doubt it was ever worn in Germany though and not just because that group was never deployed there. That person probably had a patch with just the pattern and they would put their rank in the center.

As for repurposed Nazi construction, that happened all over. There are still Americans living and working in Nazi buildings.

Indian History Thread

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- Mon, 01 Jun 2015 16:50:48 EST OE1PGRtd No.55613
File: 1433191848818.jpg -(196788B / 192.18KB, 500x375) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. Indian History Thread
INDIA
I don't hear nearly enough about Indian History, 'specially since they invented shit like our number system and how the ancestors of many Indians are so intimately linked with the ancestors of most Europeans
Like, you know, Sanskrit, Parsi, and Greek share a relatively recent ancestor, 'specially compared to languages like Basque and Spanish or Finnish and Swedish.

So, what d'you think is NEAT about India? Some shit from the Harrappan Civilization? Some fucking thing the Buddha did, or Jainism, or maybe some Hindu mythologies? Babur? The British East India Company? War with Pakistan?
Tell me what you know about the worlds most populous democracy!
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Cedric Cellersud - Thu, 04 May 2017 10:16:38 EST 8iQhyERG No.57178 Reply
>>55613
"Everyone bathe in the same river for 200 years. When they ask, you are spiritually advanced."
>>
George Nondleshit - Sun, 07 May 2017 12:06:29 EST YEmgtMe4 No.57181 Reply
>>57178
>Everyone bathe in the same river for 200 years.
Is this supposed to be a joke based off of a fundamental misunderstanding of how rivers work?

The big M

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- Wed, 14 Sep 2016 19:45:23 EST PqJIYKVF No.56862
File: 1473896723745.jpg -(108720B / 106.17KB, 363x500) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. The big M
/his/, what's the deal with Mussolini? Was he cool? Does he just get trashed because he was a fascist, or was he actually a dic?

pic related.
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Caroline Grandridge - Mon, 24 Oct 2016 19:21:17 EST 8hSk1rC9 No.56944 Reply
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>>56943
Those are all places Italy invaded and annexed before and during WWII, many of which were neutral or axis powers.
It's silly to paint a fascist power that claimed it was their people's right to conquer other people as some benign victim who just wanted autonomy for their people.
>>
Cedric Cellersud - Thu, 04 May 2017 10:20:33 EST 8iQhyERG No.57179 Reply
>>56862
Look to your left. Now look to your right. Neither of these people will correctly lecture you on Mussolini. College students majoring in political studies have a 1 in 5 chance of being enamored with fascist thought.
>>
Martin Derrysere - Sat, 06 May 2017 00:57:36 EST gLL4HKNH No.57180 Reply
>>56862
I'd say the italian fascist movement in general is more interesting than mussolini the man. In a nutshell he was a socialist (like most anti-establishment intellectuals at the time) who was kicked out of the socialist party due to his refusal to accept neutrality in WW1. Fascist intellectuals saw the bolshevik experience as a failure due to the wide spread famine which occurred after the revolution. He was apart of this circle, although not keenly influential in fascist thought per-se, which through the vanguard of a few heavyweights saw itself make a natural transition from socialism -> national syndicalism -> fascism. This was the a result of asking a pretty important question, how can we get italy off its knees sucking the dick of european powers and on its two feet as a super power?

Italy unified late during the fervor of nationalism unleashed by napoleon and the economic development of italy was also behind its neighbors. Italy needed an industrial revolution but found itself devoid of the natural resources necessary to spark it as england/germany/france were doing.

The result was, in my opinion, a patchwork 'third way' out of economic obscurity and into supposed greatness; part of that was the use of nationalism via their Roman heritage to justify their (once again...) late arrival to the colony scene. Mussolini was expedient in the sense that he wasn't really an ideologue, although i'd say he was an intellectual. Early in fascist development (1921) Mussolini said,

"The state must maintain all imaginable possible controls, but it must renounce every form of economic management"

But fascist third-way corporatism eventually (in my opinion) found itself give way to good ol' fashion socialism under the bolshevik model.

Suomio

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- Mon, 14 Dec 2015 12:34:00 EST SbLL3rxd No.56367
File: 1450114440685.jpg -(117583B / 114.83KB, 700x525) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. Suomio
Why didn't the Finnic culture/language spread in Europe? They were there longer than Indo-Europeans.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v3UH-lSm-40
10 posts and 3 images omitted. Click View Thread to read.
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Reuben Smallridge - Tue, 17 Jan 2017 00:25:51 EST GwUD1vEi No.57042 Reply
Because Indo-Europeans domesticated horses and invented war chariots.

Also it did spread, much of the northern part of European School is made of Republics with significant Finno-Ugric populations.
>>
Nigel Doffingtat - Thu, 26 Jan 2017 00:31:36 EST ueQZvpy5 No.57050 Reply
finno-ugrics spread out toward the urals and siberia

I-Es spread out to western europe and even then it was not complete cultural assimilation until the roman era as there are many pre IE european holdouts in antiquity (etruscans, nuragics, eteocretans/cypriots, paleoiberians plus the forefathers to the basques)
>>
Ebenezer Dishson - Wed, 03 May 2017 16:13:34 EST 8gNEOVqK No.57175 Reply
>>57007i know this whole crazy finnish meme is great but this doesnt look any more complex than latin really. it starts with a root word and branches off into a few different word meanings depending on how you use the root, then each word has different tenses and forms depending on context, like how you have to conjugate verbs and decline nouns in latin. It's confusing as fuck for an english speaker, but so is Latin to be fair, it's just a little easier because we happen to still use a lot of latin roots.

emailing academics?

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- Sat, 26 Mar 2016 17:16:48 EST XFbI7gxA No.56613
File: 1459027008847.jpg -(65343B / 63.81KB, 640x432) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. emailing academics?
Would it be inappropriate to email a question to an associate professor at a major university about sources for a course of his that's cited on wikipedia?
I'm trying to find information about Uruk's population in the third millennium BCE, but most of the figures online don't cite any real scholarly data and a reference to part of a course this professor taught is the most I can find on wikipedia.
7 posts omitted. Click View Thread to read.
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Hamilton Bollerdock - Sun, 08 Jan 2017 14:02:17 EST cVNnBfM0 No.57035 Reply
>>56613
Email their graduate students. They do all the work anyways.
>>
Hamilton Clayville - Sun, 23 Apr 2017 18:28:02 EST ERYmyDk/ No.57162 Reply
1492986482876.jpg -(675657B / 659.82KB, 1440x2560) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>56613
If you are close to the campus you can probably stop by his office during office hours.
>>
Ebenezer Dishson - Wed, 03 May 2017 16:09:45 EST 8gNEOVqK No.57174 Reply
>>57162
thats weird to do if you're not even a student at that university though
emailing the guy isn't weird op, but i see why you'd ask. if his email is on the school website and he has published work, (what history professor hasn't published at least some journal articles, though?) you are totally fine to email him about his work.

Learning all the things: Greece

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- Wed, 05 Apr 2017 22:58:33 EST z22WJzz+ No.57137
File: 1491447513706.jpg -(29963B / 29.26KB, 366x488) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. Learning all the things: Greece
If I wanted to learn all there is to know about Ancient Greece and its history (especially concerning their political system, mythology, major philosophies/philosophers, and how these things related to and affected lives, from the top echelons of society down to the average person), where would you recommend that I start?

ITT give me documentaries, books, podcasts, articles or just tell me any facts that you personally find interesting about the aforementioned subjects. I want to know things
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Sidney Sigglestone - Fri, 28 Apr 2017 22:10:40 EST +A561kbm No.57169 Reply
>>57168
Sir, if you watched Ave Imperator instead of Historia Civilis, you might be a little more stoic and a little less prone to hyperbole and emotional instability. Valete.

Logical Catholic Order

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- Fri, 17 Mar 2017 22:40:39 EST Ygs9AYXj No.57124
File: 1489804839632.png -(798974B / 780.25KB, 1000x982) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. Logical Catholic Order
Is or was there a Catholic order of which the testaments of the bible are interpreted as histories of interactions between humans who had technology to live eternal life and those who were other than possessing technology to live eternal life?
I am a Catholic, and though I'm spiritually starving for some community realism...so I want to know.
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Kyle Lewis Sison - Sun, 19 Mar 2017 12:38:09 EST Ygs9AYXj No.57128 Reply
1489941489260.jpg -(187780B / 183.38KB, 594x567) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>57127
I'm just early (hopefully) and trying to save. If I succeed then you succeed...so wish me luck?
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Cædmon Clipian - Wed, 19 Apr 2017 02:34:06 EST 56/DbdeS No.57160 Reply
>>57124
The neo-orthodoxy movement of the 20th Century laid the groundwork for realist Christian ordinance, but was largely a Lutheran trend. If I were you, I'd disavow Catholicism if realism is what you seek.
>>
Cædmon Clipian - Wed, 19 Apr 2017 02:34:06 EST 56/DbdeS No.57161 Reply
>>57124
The neo-orthodoxy movement of the 20th Century laid the groundwork for realist Christian ordinance, but was largely a Lutheran trend. If I were you, I'd disavow Catholicism if realism is what you seek.

The history channel isnt history hear my drunken rant!

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- Sun, 09 Apr 2017 17:07:48 EST ozqZ+LdR No.57141
File: 1491772068605.png -(428490B / 418.45KB, 499x499) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. The history channel isnt history hear my drunken rant!
Pawnstars:

Scripted TV show with made up historical objects 80% of the show is about the characters and not history

Ancient aliens:

Some batshit insane guy trying to convince everyone that aliens exist and created our plant is not history, there isnt any historical evidence or facts confirming this.

Swamp People: Bunch of redneck inbreds hunting alligators and living in louisiana

Ax men: Lumberjackasses logging trees

Big Rig Bounty Hunters: Some fat fuck that repossess trucks

American Pickers: some con artists who pick garbage then claim its old and historical and raises the prices above being fair at all.

Counting Cars: Spin-off of pawn stars, has nothing to do with history

Mountain men: some old bearded guy yelling at other bearded guys showing survival skills in the mountains.

Alone: Basically the real life hunger games again 80% of the time it's about them it has nothing to do with history.

Forged in Fire: basically metalworkers,...that's about it.

The Curse of Oak Island: Two closest homosexuals trying to solve an urban legend in a scripted tv show that will never be solved.


Tell me /H I S/ How the fuck am i supposed to learn anything about the past or how this can benefit real life historians?
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Archie Supperlan - Fri, 14 Apr 2017 23:44:35 EST GJTiKYyy No.57158 Reply
1492227875131.jpg -(13091B / 12.78KB, 300x168) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
I completely agree, the history channel is just reality tv now to be competitive
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Sidney Sammergold - Tue, 02 May 2017 10:56:44 EST jf6fe/6r No.57172 Reply
>>57141
>>57159
>>57157
It's not just this History Channel... It's every channel. Sci-fi has wrestling. TLC is half reality and home and garden shows. The Home & Garden channel is half cute-animal shows. BBC airs Star Trek TNG for half the day. It goes on and on. No US channel that airs with a particular genre or style manages to maintain it for more than a handful of years before it hijacks itself for more profitable, entirely unrelated programming.

Oh, and there's another writer's strike coming up, so get ready for even MORE reality shows!

You're kinda stuck with on-demand or the Internet. The commercial model of television is just plain broken for specialty channels, even though all hundred of those channels are all owned by maybe five corporations, and they could certainly use the "popular" channels to fund the specialty channels. One would *think* that fact would prevent this crap, but alas, it is not the case, as each is forced to compete for earnings individually.

PBS still has its ups and downs I suppose.

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