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420chan is Getting Overhauled - Changelog/Bug Report/Request Thread (Updated July 26)

Black death in Arabia/India

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- Fri, 25 Mar 2016 05:41:50 EST UbbM3HsU No.56607
File: 1458898910241.jpg -(109919B / 107.34KB, 736x701) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. Black death in Arabia/India
I'm kind of interested in the black death, I guess that's a popular enough topic.
Thing is I always hear brief mentions of how it started in Arab nations and moved west as it moved east, and also hit Persia and India (so I guess Afghanistan too?)

And... you never hear about that. There's so much literature and media about the black death in Europe and it's effects on killing SO MANY people but I've found nothing in terms of what it did to the Muslim world.

Then I was thinking, maybe due to genetic differences (Like how Native Americans were destroyed by smallpox but Europeans carried it without symptoms) ... maybe those middle eastern folks weren't as susceptible and didn't die in such huge numbers, and that's why no one makes a big deal about it?

Or maybe there's just not much info available in English because Eurocentrism.

I have done some searches on the topic and come up with essentially nothing.

Does ANYONE know anything about this, can give me an overview or recommend some books/articles/documentaries/whatever.
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Nell Grimforth - Fri, 25 Mar 2016 08:12:14 EST uM5wTvBs No.56609 Reply
For starters, I don't think there was much of a "black death" outside of the broader European context. Something like half of all fatalities are estimated to have happened outside of Europe, but the scholarship and interest in the topic are evidently VERY Eurocentric. A more general purpose term would be second plague pandemic. Here's an old academic article that looks generally excellent:

>The Second Plague Pandemic and Its Recurrences in the Middle East: 1347-1894
https://sci-hub.io/10.2307/3631953
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Graham Shakeridge - Fri, 25 Mar 2016 21:17:03 EST UiYTZ6ut No.56611 Reply
the black plague happened specifically because europeans up until the industrial revolution were filthy savage chimps living in mud and shit with no concept of hygiene, unlike most of the rest of the world
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William Bapperfoot - Sat, 26 Mar 2016 17:11:54 EST XFbI7gxA No.56612 Reply
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>>56611
That's really not true. Europeans had a fondness for public bathhouses from the Roman period until, actually, the mid 1300s. Bathing and cleanliness were highly valued. The only reason that people STOPPED bathing frequently was due to the decline of bath-houses as the population boomed in the early 14th century, causing deforestation and a lack of fuel to heat water. The death-knell to bathing for the common people was in fact THE PLAGUE, because for an entire generation in the mid-1300s there was justifiable fear about congregating in public. After that, the institution of bathing was pretty much gone, and baths were restricted to the rich upper-class who could afford the luxury of bathing in private.
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Matilda Susslefun - Sat, 26 Mar 2016 17:49:31 EST FqRGTRMQ No.56614 Reply
>>56612
Eh, no. While I'm not going to generalize the medieval Europeans, there were prominent Christians during the early middle ages, that talked shit about washing yourself a lot - because guess who - the pagan Vikings sure loved washing themselves a lot.
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William Bapperfoot - Sat, 26 Mar 2016 17:57:27 EST XFbI7gxA No.56615 Reply
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>>56614
Obviously you can't millions of people in disparate cultures across nearly a thousand years, but it's a fact that bathing was not at all uncommon in European towns for most of the medieval period. The Romans were huge on bathing, and left behind an enduring set of public traditions and infrastructure that promoted widespread hygiene among all but the lowest tiers of society.
The fact that fringe Christian ascetics railed against bathing is an attestation to its commonality - you don't need to condemn a thing unless a goodly portion of people are doing it.

http://www.medievalists.net/2013/04/13/did-people-in-the-middle-ages-take-baths/

Read this, it's very thorough.
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Beatrice Firringville - Sun, 27 Mar 2016 17:22:22 EST FqRGTRMQ No.56618 Reply
>>56615
Just because you bath, doesn't mean you're clean. You need proper sewer work to get rid of that filth. You need garbage disposal etc.

I don't think I've ever read anything about Europeans outside people living in South-Europe taking care of getting rid of their filthy bathwater, excrements and garbage.

Do you know anything about it?
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Jenny Lightfuck - Mon, 28 Mar 2016 08:10:09 EST Tkqef7x1 No.56619 Reply
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>>56618

Well, here is something I've learned from studies of Jorvik (York), is that they had a system for garbage (which is actually one of our biggest contributors to what life was like back then, food, agriculture and stuff), the common practice among vikings was bathing every week and grooming of hair, makeup and accessorising with braids and the like.

The anglo-dudes did also wash, just more like.. Once or thrice a month if you were part of the usual rabble.

If you're from Britiain or Scandi you've mighta heard the word Midden? It comes from the danish mødding, which means garbage. They had a system for domestic crap, and since most the shit they threw were organic they didn't have to worry about the problems -we- face with todays trash.
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Nathaniel Crandlehatch - Thu, 31 Mar 2016 19:36:18 EST NPevHm2F No.56625 Reply
>>56607
The Black Plague hit a Mongol Horde (not sure which one) as they were outside a Genovese trade city. The Mongols were too decimated to take the city, but catapulted some of their plague-riddled corpses over the city walls before leaving.

That's probably how the plague spread to Europe.

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