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Now Playing on /mtv/tube -

WATCHMEN

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- Sun, 10 Nov 2019 19:08:50 EST u4b4+vSo No.411343
File: 1573430930192.jpg -(73757B / 72.03KB, 620x413) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. WATCHMEN
couldn't find a thread
episode 3 soon
thoughts so far
is the wheelchair dude the hangman?
nite owl in gaol
silky still pining for big blue dick
old coot locked away with cloned servants, trying to escape mars?
>>
Naoko Mori - Sun, 10 Nov 2019 19:12:23 EST IBJAbzvX No.411344 Reply
I'm waiting for the season to end and for there to be a decisive answer to whether this sucks or not. Reviews are way more mixed than most shows seem to get, at least so far. Feels like HBO has fallen real far lately, back in the day I'd watch anything they put out like this without even questioning it.
>>
Ice King - Sun, 10 Nov 2019 19:13:43 EST u4b4+vSo No.411345 Reply
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>>411343
Is the game warden a resurrected Rorschach, by the big blue god, to watch the old coot?
>>
Ice King - Sun, 10 Nov 2019 19:20:13 EST u4b4+vSo No.411346 Reply
>>411344
>waiting for the season to end
probably a good way to approach a series
but having read the comic and seen the film, I'm sorta invested into following this down the rabbit hole
and yeah after got, hbo is abit lost trying to get the next big one
>>
Boxy Brown - Sun, 10 Nov 2019 21:12:09 EST j9Ahosmg No.411349 Reply
>>411343
I saw episode 1 super excited about this and was incredibly disappointed.
>>
Ice King - Mon, 11 Nov 2019 02:07:03 EST u4b4+vSo No.411361 Reply
>>411349
it seemed to be opening a new stage of the watchmen
the 80's MAD society of the cold war is over
the internal strife, denial, poverty, class distinction where there was not to be and societal guilt seems to be the next phase
>>
Monster Carrot - Mon, 11 Nov 2019 23:58:35 EST JpOBaa5v No.411388 Reply
This show is bad lol, but I sure am enjoying how fucking dumb and weird it is week to week. This must be how y'all felt during True Detective Season 2 (which, btw, y'all didn't fucking deserve but it was actually GOOD).
>>
Luna Lovegood - Tue, 12 Nov 2019 00:35:23 EST N8jerDVb No.411389 Reply
>>411388
I couldn't put my finger on it and you just summed it up perfectly.
>>
Hodor - Wed, 13 Nov 2019 08:06:38 EST qf/75Hxy No.411426 Reply
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Finally caught up... and it stinks.

I've seen better DC/Vertigo fan films pull this shit off with zero budget. Get fucked Lindelof.

Doom Patrol and Swamp Thing are 10x better than this hamfisted attempt to revive a three decade old story.

Where are the fucking stakes??
>>
>>
Name - Wed, 13 Nov 2019 18:59:29 EST pVJL9ayO No.411437 Reply
I'm gonna give this a chance since so many of you normie fucking capeshit fans hate it.
>>
Daffy Duck - Wed, 13 Nov 2019 20:21:14 EST B7DiVK5I No.411440 Reply
>>411437
I haven't even seen it, but I am convince what the anons say here it's true.
>>
Monster Carrot - Thu, 14 Nov 2019 03:21:23 EST qf/75Hxy No.411450 Reply
>>411445
Yeah. But on a budget of $0.00 This adaptation is an 85% accurate version of issue 6 of Sandman.

Strangely enough Netflix's Sandman adaptation has already started shooting season 2. Whatever that means. Most likely getting ready for the cancellation announcement.
>>
Wes Anderson - Thu, 14 Nov 2019 15:28:21 EST 9Oh2a4gN No.411460 Reply
I just saw that E;R review of it, and it seems hilariously retarded, I'll probably get drunk and watch it one day for laughs. I'm still going to be looking forward to the second season of The Boys which is a superior mockery of capeshit.
>>
Georgie Henley - Thu, 14 Nov 2019 15:53:30 EST +Lb33GKN No.411462 Reply
>>411460
I wouldnt say this is a mockery, more like a hopelessly tone-deaf adaptation of a 30 year old comic universe with modern day social issues, and it shows. Also Damon Lindelof, so hilariously stupid shit thats like "super deep" man
>>
Cosmo Kramer - Thu, 14 Nov 2019 16:29:55 EST K+JAA4tm No.411463 Reply
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>>411460
>E;R
Maybe a Youtube Nazi isn't going to have the most balanced opinion on a franchise that was originally created by an Anarcho-Communist snake wizard, no matter how good or bad the resulting adaptation turns out to be.
>>
Wes Anderson - Thu, 14 Nov 2019 16:37:49 EST 9Oh2a4gN No.411465 Reply
>>411463
I can like Alan Moore comics and YouTube nazis all the same. I'll still give this the time of day... eventually.
>>
Sean Young - Thu, 14 Nov 2019 16:49:24 EST XRxLm6cH No.411466 Reply
>>411465
>I can like... YouTube nazis
Yeah, but could you maybe do that on another chan?
>>
Wes Anderson - Thu, 14 Nov 2019 17:06:31 EST 9Oh2a4gN No.411467 Reply
>>411466
I said I still wanted to watch this show I don't know what you want from me
>>
Michael Cimino - Thu, 14 Nov 2019 17:14:24 EST E5p0/xCR No.411468 Reply
>>411466
hey now, I know free speech isn't cool around these parts, but so long as he's not trolling or being pointlessly aggressive, he's entitled to his opinions and choices of media, no matter how shit they may be.

*sigh* I miss when being left leaning meant being pro free speech. Stupid fucking horseshoe theory being right. nb for off topic and politics. Also because this show sucks, enough eith the TIK TOK TIK TOK already, it's a shitty gimmick thatworked in the comic but trying to play on the whole watch thing again just feels forced and unecessary
>>
Cosmo Kramer - Thu, 14 Nov 2019 17:26:33 EST K+JAA4tm No.411469 Reply
>>411468
>Watchmen + politics = "off topic"
>unironically referencing horseshit theory
>thinks the watch motif in the original comic was a "shitty gimmick"
This guy's brain is smoother than Dr. Manhattan's butt.
>>
Michael Cimino - Thu, 14 Nov 2019 18:30:06 EST E5p0/xCR No.411474 Reply
>>411469
It's a shitty gimmick in the show, it actually worked in the comic.
>>
Charlie Sheen - Thu, 14 Nov 2019 20:15:44 EST gb0DXCZb No.411476 Reply
Eh, the show isn't that bad. The Ozy stuff is actually kinda boring, but Sister Night is solid and I enjoy seeing where her arc will lead.

So far(3 episodes) The Seventh Kavalry just seemed like cop killers more than "we hate minorities" but that will probably change.
>>
>>
Andrei Tarkovsky - Fri, 15 Nov 2019 22:18:02 EST q7M4KDzz No.411549 Reply
>>411476
If you think 7th calvary isn't blantantly racist you literally haven't paid attention to ANY of the themes of the show presented thus far.
>>
Jesse Pinkman - Sat, 16 Nov 2019 06:17:05 EST IBJAbzvX No.411553 Reply
>>411549
The racism junk is why i stopped watching, I could tell I was dealing with some boring SJW shit when the show was 8 minutes in and the entire episode so far had taken place in the 1920s and was all about how evil white people are and how all black people are pure paragons of virtue.
>>
Alice Murphy - Sat, 16 Nov 2019 06:33:00 EST 8EphNjns No.411554 Reply
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>>411553
I can't imagine what it's like being so simultaneously dumb and easily triggered that merely referencing a well-known aspect of American history causes one to completely shut down and turn off their brain and start demanding a safe space.

I mean, you chose to watch an adaptation of fucking Watchmen of all things, how were you not ready for a damning criticism of America's history and hierarchical systems? The fuck were you expecting?
>>
Jesse Pinkman - Sat, 16 Nov 2019 06:42:06 EST IBJAbzvX No.411555 Reply
>>411554
The problem was that it was 8 entire minutes of the show. The scene could have been 90 seconds but clearly the show was going to linger and obsess over racism for the entire episode. The Boys didn't make me wait 8 minutes before showing any superheroes.
>>
Alice Murphy - Sat, 16 Nov 2019 06:46:05 EST 8EphNjns No.411556 Reply
>>411555
>8 entire minutes of a show based on a hyper-political comic was political
First of all, are you okay?
>>
Morgan Le Fey - Sat, 16 Nov 2019 06:52:52 EST K+JAA4tm No.411558 Reply
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>>411553
Hey, remember when the original comic made it explicitly clear that the superheroes it is so critical of, and the power structure that they serve, has the violent subjugation of black people as one of its stated purposes?

Or maybe you don't remember that, because you have no idea what Watchmen or Alan Moore are really about, and you were expecting this to be just another braindead lowest common demoniator ego-stroking capeshit safespace for your chud mentality?
>>
Jesse Pinkman - Sat, 16 Nov 2019 07:01:07 EST IBJAbzvX No.411560 Reply
>>411558
lol you guys get so triggered when someone says why they didn't enjoy a show. Yes, I know the comic and have read most Alan Moore comics, even his lesser known stuff like Providence. I just didn't dig the shows direction, I watch TV to get away from the constant racism shit in the news. But nowadays if you say shows about racism are boring, you're either a racist too, or a gibbering moron who doesn't respect Alan Moore's vision.
>>
Morgan Le Fey - Sat, 16 Nov 2019 07:08:24 EST K+JAA4tm No.411561 Reply
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>>411560
There are plenty of valid reasons not to like the show.

It's just conspicuous how you choose the dumbest reason possible, focus on that dumb reason to the exclusion of any other valid criticisms, and that dumb reason just so happens to dovetail with the motivations of the otherchan frogposting chuds that insist on infiltrating here from time to time.
>>
John Candy - Sat, 16 Nov 2019 18:38:22 EST sRA0fCC5 No.411591 Reply
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>>411555
>8 entire minutes of the show
Considering how few burgerfags even know that this historical event even happened, and how triggered some of you get at the mere acknowledgement of its existence, 8 minutes isn't nearly long enough.
>>
James Doakes - Sun, 17 Nov 2019 06:50:06 EST IBJAbzvX No.411611 Reply
>>411591
I assume that stuff still happens, it doesn't make it any less boring to sit through.
>>
Nana Visitor - Mon, 18 Nov 2019 00:12:13 EST mj0AHdJm No.411626 Reply
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>>411343
It's not good,but not bad

I can't stop watching it.

Even though I sometimes don't know wtf is going on. Hope it comes together at end
Gonna go back and watch the animated comic movie
>>
Keira Knightley - Mon, 18 Nov 2019 13:05:41 EST I69pn9Dl No.411647 Reply
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>>411560
>you're either a racist too, or a gibbering moron
>>
Curtis Donovan - Mon, 18 Nov 2019 21:08:17 EST YzNkBYR0 No.411663 Reply
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>>411343
"Okay, which one of you guys left the giant fucking Squid here?"
>>
>>
Greg Corbin - Tue, 19 Nov 2019 18:30:02 EST io/VFBzy No.411682 Reply
>>411343
So uh, all the funhouse mirrors in the funhouse break.

Funhouse mirrors are made of mylar and plexiglass. I don't see how they'd all shatter. Polycarbonate, PETG etc would certainly not. Therefore the funhouse mirrors were made of acrylic. A cheap material befitting the shitheap that is New Jersey.

The more you know, niggas.
>>
Louise Jameson - Sat, 23 Nov 2019 09:04:33 EST IBJAbzvX No.411731 Reply
>>411728
lol i think you're just angry that you're still watching this boring show and cool kids like me knew to bail less than 10 minutes in
>>
Muscle Man - Sat, 23 Nov 2019 09:55:17 EST 9Oh2a4gN No.411732 Reply
>>411731
If the show was actually good people would be talking about that instead of diverging into unrelated tangents.
>>
Simon Petrikov - Sat, 23 Nov 2019 17:49:48 EST JpOBaa5v No.411736 Reply
Just checking back into to say, once again, that this show is very bad but also hilariously weird and I'm gonna hang in there lol.
>>
Emma Watson - Fri, 29 Nov 2019 02:25:22 EST mj0AHdJm No.411822 Reply
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>>411343
completely dropping the show after that forced faggotry...I feel dumb with nobody to blame but myself for not dropping the show the first episode with all the "race war" bs
>>
Alex Kingston - Fri, 29 Nov 2019 07:17:32 EST f/yHosJf No.411828 Reply
so sick of every movie/show going for the "black pain porn" angle. I miss when black characters could just be normal characters, now every single black role has to be about dealing with racism. SNORE.
>>
Jin - Fri, 29 Nov 2019 08:28:24 EST K+JAA4tm No.411829 Reply
>>411828
>every single black role has to be about dealing with racism
>every single black role
Just taking the front page of /mtv/ as a random sample:
>Star Wars, Marvel, South Park, Joker, Rick and Morty, Mr. Robot

Basically none of the black roles in there are going for "black pain porn". I guess maybe Killmonger from almost 2 years ago, but aside from him every other MCU black guy is the same quipping fast-talking Marvel shithead as everyone else.

I don't think your problem is "every single" black role addressing the recorded history of racism in America because that clearly isn't what's happening. I think your problem is "even a single" black role addressing it.

One, single popular recent property among a sea of generically cheerful popular recent black roles is way too much for you and enough to trigger you.

Maybe don't get triggered by history so much, pussy.
>>
C-Higgy !lfsExjBfzE - Fri, 29 Nov 2019 21:33:41 EST jRjEOvBm No.411849 Reply
>>411828
Well Queen and Slim just came out but it seems to be doing pretty well with audiences and critics
>>
>>
Zoe Washburne - Sat, 30 Nov 2019 14:06:12 EST TC95cZlk No.411866 Reply
>>411466
He's actually a pretty lowkey nazi with mostly legit anime takes.

I wish him death for fucking up my Hitler meme game but let's be honest, that was always on a ticking clock.
>>
Legolas - Sat, 30 Nov 2019 14:12:27 EST 9Oh2a4gN No.411867 Reply
>>411866
Eh, I just went along with the n word there because I think he's more of an edgy kid and it's pointless arguing about it
>>
Leatherface - Sat, 30 Nov 2019 15:57:17 EST JPMo98z/ No.411871 Reply
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>>411867
He's admitted to trying to "red pill" his mostly underage nerdlet audience on the Jewish Question and is pretty obviously a full-blown Nazi, so nice try.
>>
Halle Berry - Sat, 07 Dec 2019 10:28:12 EST FWkMaKle No.412049 Reply
Q: but who watches men?

A: women and gays
>>
Eric Idle - Sun, 08 Dec 2019 08:45:18 EST 4rHppqvi No.412083 Reply
This show is complete garbage and everyone involved in this should be fucking ashamed of themselves. Did even a single one of them read the original Watchmen?
Why would you get the idea that it needs a sequel?
Why would you get the idea that a sequel should be like THIS?

Fucking state of entertainment industry, taking up old ass IPs and selling them as propaganda pieces, nobody would give a single fuck about this garbage if it hadnt "Watchmen" as a title, I hope at least in the future people will look upon the 2010s as the decade of cultural degradation and insignificance that it was.
>>
Eric Idle - Sun, 08 Dec 2019 13:14:58 EST 4rHppqvi No.412089 Reply
>>412087

You know what Im talking about, writers are using Watchmen and other IPs to shoehorn in their own political views. I have nothing against anyone doing this actually, can enhance a product immensely if you dare to give it a very personal touch, but its just done so clumsily all the time now, there´s no originality, everything feels the same, everything needs to be about race relations now and rich/poor dichotomy.

Where are the characters? Rorschach wasnt just a vigilante, he was a victim of child abuse, a fucking outcast and a doomsday shouter at day, he had an actual arc to become so ruthless, you could feel that the writer poured some real personal issues and experiences into that.

Why cant there be no drug addicts as characters anymore? Alcoholics? Legit refugees out of a war torn country? Orphans? Whatever, just something interesting that you can relate to in some way, feelings of abandonement, despair, survivors guilt. Why is the most prominent character of the show a black woman from the underclass AGAIN? Thats barely a character and not a lot of people can relate to it, based solely on that, including me.
>>
Linda Harrison - Sun, 08 Dec 2019 13:29:54 EST K+JAA4tm No.412090 Reply
>>412089
You think the average viewer can relate better to an alcoholic child-abused orphan refugee from a war torn country than a normal black woman?

I find that hard to believe.
>>
Eve Myles - Sun, 08 Dec 2019 13:39:57 EST tJI9VR3l No.412091 Reply
>>412089
>You know what Im talking about, writers are using Watchmen and other IPs to shoehorn in their own political views.

No, I don't. What exactly is it about this show that is "propaganda" what is it about that "propaganda" that makes it especially bad?
>>
Lana Wachowski - Sun, 08 Dec 2019 17:12:14 EST E5p0/xCR No.412108 Reply
All media is propaganda in some form
>>
>>
Sister Mary Eunice - Sun, 08 Dec 2019 19:57:00 EST U8aG6jGf No.412118 Reply
>>412090

Already hinted at what I mean, read closely man. Do you have no memories of drug abuse or at least a friend that dabbled with that? No refugees or soldiers that you know that were in a war torn country? No friend from a bad home or not witnessed abuse by parents firsthand? Never felt lonely, never got to know someone personally that lost a parent early?
Can subscribe to all of that, these are quite universal things, I dont know a single black woman from the underclass though, media is fucking oversaturated with this archetype and its doing fucking nothing for me, not for anyone I know either. I dont think Im reaching when I say that this is true as well for the majority of people that read the original Watchmen.

>>412091
I spelt it out already, by shit propaganda I mean political views that are inserted without nuance, in a world where they hardly fit, but you are supposed to eat up and believe it anyway. At the moment these are leftist talking points, class struggles, racial conflicts, they are often not allowed to be criticised so the writers get away easily with writing their show in a very bland and boring way as long as they adhere to that.
Its basically a way to churn out more low effort garbage and get people to buy up begrudgingly, cant complain openly, only thing you get, minimize risk of a "new" project failing.

Leftist ideology could actually be employed in a thoughtful way, with real characters and not accumulations of the same cheap tropes every time, you know they could actually be nuanced, very few are like this now, used to be much more in the past.


>>412108
Not exactly wrong, but it has been very hamfisted for the most part of the 2010s, could be way better, what a shit decade for tv/cinema/books/vidya/comic/music whatever.
>>
Akira Kurosawa - Sun, 08 Dec 2019 20:45:56 EST K+JAA4tm No.412121 Reply
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>>412118
I can guarantee that the average American or Britbonger has met more poor black women in their life than they have orphan war refugees.

Maybe you're posting this from Myanmar or Cambodia or some shit and this isn't the case for you, but your experience is not representative of either HBO's general viewing audience or the Anglophone comic nerds that read the original comic.

>leftist talking points
>a world where they hardly fit
>Watchmen
Do you even know who Alan Moore is?
>>
Sister Mary Eunice - Mon, 09 Dec 2019 07:46:47 EST U8aG6jGf No.412136 Reply
>>412121
>Myanmar
>Cambodia

And I can guarantee you that its not nearly as uncommon for a lot of countries in the world to have a very scarce if any black population, the world isnt nearly as multiculturalist as certain shows or movies want you to believe, simply not messing with colonialism or slavery in the modernity like Bongland or Murrica among a few others did has this effect.

You´re right of course, HBOs target audience are burgers, original Watchmen´s target audience were Anglophone comic nerds, but the internet has changed everything, its the very reason why I can even communicate with you. I have access to the original Watchmen and any HBO show although I dont live in the US, I could relate greatly to the original comic, it was written with more universal ideas about human struggling in mind, I cant relate at all to the show, its themes are blown out of proportion even for a good portion of the US population.

I dont give a fuck who Alan Moore thinks he is but if you are implying that Watchmen originally contains leftist talking points you´re a fucking idiot. Watchmen was about the concept of Free Will and how a lot of different people struggle with that, it even subverted ideas of class struggles and typical race relations.

Veidt comes from a humble, not noteworthy family, in fact he discarded everything and began anew, made his way to the top all on his own, ridicules the concept of class struggle.
Rorschachs psychiatrist in prison is a well off black man, its the white guy opposite him whos haggard, an outcast of society and to be pitied, the black guy here is a position of authority, he comes around to seeing the world less rose coloured and in the end still chooses compassion over apathy. Very well written character, not a single black stereotype about him.

Its kinda obvious that you have no interest in having a real argument, you dont even adress my main point that the writing is very weak, probably too brainwashed into thinking that everything you see on tv is the truth and to rabidly defend shitty written shows just because they fit into your way of thinking about politics, I just wish that things could be different again, that there was an end to this shovelware garbage and that we could have real stories, with real characters again instead of clones of clones of stereotypes conforming to mainstream ideologies.
>>
Polly - Mon, 09 Dec 2019 13:21:28 EST EHbBEZVq No.412145 Reply
>>412118
>political views that are inserted without nuance, in a world where they hardly fit, but you are supposed to eat up and believe it anyway. At the moment these are leftist talking points, class struggles, racial conflicts, they are often not allowed to be criticised so the writers get away easily with writing their show in a very bland and boring way as long as they adhere to that.
Which ones, when? You haven't given any examples. You've explained what would make you mad if they showed up in the text but you haven't explained when or where they show up in the text to make you this mad.

Do you have any examples?

>I dont know a single black woman from the underclass though, media is fucking oversaturated with this archetype
Like who? How many times have we seen this archetype as a main protagonist in recent years?
>>
Jack Donaghy - Tue, 10 Dec 2019 22:20:10 EST bqgVzYHw No.412175 Reply
How is this show getting good reviews lol? This is soooooooo bad. I don't know how someone that evidently misread the original work SO BADLY could have been given the driver's seat on this thing. Jeeeesus.
>>
Old Gregg - Wed, 11 Dec 2019 06:52:20 EST IBJAbzvX No.412180 Reply
>>412175
Critics give good reviews to anything that's obnoxious and preachy
>>
Old Gregg - Wed, 11 Dec 2019 11:29:48 EST L3ErbklO No.412186 Reply
>>412136
>Veidt comes from a humble, not noteworthy family
"My inheritance offered lifelong idle luxury, and yet, needing nothing..."
He explicitly does not come from a humble family. His parents were wealthy enough to leave him independently wealthy for the remainder of his life. Meaning that he started out "from nothing" with all the educational, health and societal advantages that a growing up in a luxuriously wealthy family imparts.

Adrian was the villain, and he was explicitly shown to be wrong. He was wrong about his childish obsession with Alexander, he was wrong about the need to squid New York, he was wrong about humanity's capacity to come together on its own, he was wrong about the durability of his new utopia.

The last bit of dialogue he has in the comics is God telling him that he's a shortsighted hubristic fool.

If your interpretation of Watchmen is that Ozymandias DESTROYS the concepts of class struggle, racism and wealth disparity with FACTS and LOGIC, then you either didn't read the comic or you are dangerously stupid.
>>
William Shakespeare - Wed, 11 Dec 2019 20:53:32 EST OsnMVhCl No.412194 Reply
Is this show good? I remember having a Netflix and Chill session with this girl one time, and not being able to make it past the first five minutes. Then I proceeded to bone her.
>>
Jake the Dog - Wed, 11 Dec 2019 21:01:34 EST bqgVzYHw No.412195 Reply
>>412180
I mean. The original work is quite preachy and has strong, good politics. Alan Moore is an actual leftist. Lindelof is just a goofy know nothing liberal that fundamentally understands the original work.
>>
Sir Loin - Thu, 12 Dec 2019 18:11:58 EST 0LFshtnQ No.412215 Reply
>>412186
>If your interpretation of Watchmen is that Ozymandias DESTROYS the concepts of class struggle, racism and wealth disparity with FACTS and LOGIC, then you either didn't read the comic or you are dangerously stupid.

What the fuck? No, Watchmen isnt at all about class struggle, racism, wealth disparity whatever chism of have and have nots you want to call it, that was kind of my point, Moore subverted these tropes by telling you that they dont matter several times over. See Veidt and talking about his parents being nothing remarkable and starting from scratch after they died, I dont even know where you take that "luxuriously wealthy family" from, I dont remember it like that at all.
Also see the black therapist and that there are basically no mentions of capitalism vs. communism rethoric despite the time period.

Watchmen is fundamentally about the concept free will and how various different characters interact with it.

-Ozy sees free will as something to be done away with, its a deplorable asset to humanity for him that endangers the entire species, thats why he tries to sell everyone a big fat lie with the squid invasion from Planet X, he´s basically the genius chess players who sees the disaster on the board unfolding and wants to move every piece so that it doesnt come about. He thinks himself smarter than everyone else and in a position to make better decisions for the whole, Manhattans sick burn at the end is calling him out on his illusion of grandiosity, humanity simply cant be "solved" to be peaceful, the human spirit, life will prevail being unpredictable and free.

-Manhattan is a character thats even above the chess player, hes the game master basically, being able to alter the rules and create a new game all for himself. Being able to see the past, present and future simultaneously makes him jaded on free will and downright inhumane, free will doesnt really appear for him since everything is written down already, regains his positive outlook on life by seeing that human life is still so uniquely affected by a persons free will, that people and their history, their personality are individualistic and more than just a piece in a predictable game of chess.

-Comedian is an aware chess piece, he believes in free will but thinks that it doesnt really matter in the great scheme of things, so you got free will to basically do as you please but you cant really make a noteworthy change, best to go with the flow and have a good hearty laugh while doing so, hes such a staunch believer in free will that hes almost entirely amoralic. Veidt seemingly getting away with misleading everyone into forsaking their own agency and giving up west vs east conflict of wills makes him break down, subverts his entire style of living.

-Rorschach is another aware chess piece and an extreme believer in free will, he thinks its the only important thing in life, no matter the outcome, you should always follow your own personal creed to the bitter end because thats what makes you humane, complacency, giving up your free will, that makes you into a despicable sorry excuse for a human being. Hed rather die than compromise his agency, and so he does in the end.
Hes a rorschach test for the reader: Do you agree with him? What do you make out of your free will in your own life?

-Nite Owl and Silk Spectre are both unaware chess pieces, they struggle with the roles they´ve been assigned to, they have progenitors that they try to please but they´re not sure if they´re happy with doing that, in the end they conform and find their place, they remain unaware though, basically a spoof of superheroes being the guys making the world altering decisions all the time.
These two dont, they are driven to every action by outside factors: Nixon says you´re done? Ok. Rorschach says theres a conspiracy afoot and we should investigate? Ok. Veidt feeds the entire world a massive lie to ensure piece and you should shut up about it? Ok.
Theyre your average guy and gall having trouble with conflicting free will and assigned future.

There remains absolutely fucking nothing of this in the new series, the original work is completely misread by applying the lense of Current Year poltical thinkings, you dont really seem to have understood what Watchmen is about either, if anything though the OG stuff was something that lends itself to meaningful discussion and various readings, in contrast to this HBO bullshit.
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Billy Madison - Thu, 12 Dec 2019 20:14:07 EST egxAn1jy No.412216 Reply
>>412215
I dunno I'm not the biggest fan of where it's going but do you really think it's appropriate for it to even try to continue the themes of the original?

Because that's also a real recipe for shit a la Star Wars.

Still, the Tulsa stuff is interesting shit. The Veidt Europa stuff is interesting shit. The Wade Tillman shit is interesting. The Dr. Manhattan stuff is PROBABLY going somewhere...

What I cannot stand is the fucking smug dipshit Damon Lindelof gotcha non-foreshadowing riddles explicitly designed to make absolute dumbshit fanboys fawn over how clever he is in the rewatch. VERY few of them actually work the way foreshadowing should.
Like, they're not foreshadowing. It's just Lindelof Manhattaning the story by being able to flip through the pages and insert vacuous callbacks to future events, which is about one notch more sophisticated than Arya-kills-the-Night-King.

And my god there's a fucking lot of them. I thought Lindelof was redeemable when I started this. fuck him in his dumb face.
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Billy Madison - Thu, 12 Dec 2019 20:14:56 EST egxAn1jy No.412217 Reply
>>412216
This shit had BETTER come together for something and I'm not waiting for Season 2. This fucker wrote on Lost and we all know how that went.
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Boyd Crowder - Thu, 12 Dec 2019 21:14:07 EST pbtxsbH0 No.412220 Reply
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>>412217
>This fucker wrote on Lost and we all know how that went.

Beaker is lost for words
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Turanga Leela - Thu, 12 Dec 2019 21:50:25 EST K+JAA4tm No.412221 Reply
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>>412215
>I dont even know where you take that "luxuriously wealthy family" from, I dont remember it like that at all.
Yeah, because you didn't read the comic.

>Hes a rorschach test for the reader: Do you agree with him? What do you make out of your free will in your own life?
No, Rorschach was transparently meant to be read as a disgusting, closed-minded, reprehensible character that repulses normal people. Alan Moore has made this very clear in interviews, and he's been perplexed at the fact that people haven't understood that.

>“I wanted to kind of make this like, ‘Yeah, this is what Batman would be in the real world.’ But I had forgotten that actually to a lot of comic fans that smelling, not having a girlfriend—these are actually kind of heroic. So actually, sort of, Rorschach became the most popular character in Watchmen. I meant him to be a bad example, but I have people come up to me in the street saying, ‘I am Rorschach! That is my story!’ And I’ll be thinking, ‘Yeah, great, can you just keep away from me and never come anywhere near me again for as long as I live?’”

>"I have to say I found Ayn Rand’s philosophy laughable,” Moore continued. “It was a ‘white supremacist dreams of the master race,’ burnt in an early-20th century form. Her ideas didn’t really appeal to me, but they seemed to be the kind of ideas that people would espouse, people who might secretly believe themselves to be part of the elite, and not part of the excluded majority.”

Your problem isn't that you have some respectful reverance for the original comic, your problem is that you're irrationally spooked by black women or whatever. If you don't like this series that's fine, but it's not because you're a fan of the original material, because you clearly didn't understand it or - most likely - never even read it. You're just a chud.
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Tinkerbell - Fri, 13 Dec 2019 05:07:02 EST 0LFshtnQ No.412224 Reply
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>>412221
Nigga Im done arguing with you, all you do is throw insults and insinuate that I didnt read the comic, which is clearly not the case, I read it severeal times over. Why is it that you choose to disregard large swathes of my posts and only go after tiny itsy bitsy spots that are unrelated to anything you made your argument about before?
Did your years of experience in internet trolling made you this way?
Why is it impossible for you to actually argue about something, how is this satisfactory to you?
Really, just how petty can a human being become?

In any case, Id implore you to try reading the whole thing without any prejudiced lense of Current Year politics, its almost laughable how you get so hung up about a single sentence but fail to get the actual character of Veidt, I mean nigga the explanation for that sentence is repeated several times on the same page, I cut it out for you. Veidts parents are explicitly stated to be INTELECTUALLY unremarkable, its the whole POINT of the sentence you quote to show that his class origin is not something that matters for his character, its written to make a reading such as yours impossible, yet here you are.

I cant state enough how I dont give a fuck about Moore´s political views and especially not about an interview that was conducted 20 YEARS LATER where he´s obviously assblasted to the nth degree because he thinks that his characters are read incorrectly.
You dont name a character fucking Rorschach if you dont want to him to be an in joke about characters that are morally grey but espouse extreme black&white thinking.
If Rorschach is to be universally hated then how come he was given a background that would make you sympathezise with him, an upbringing with child abuse, so unlike the Comedian?
Why make him the fucking protagonist with frequent voice overs?
Why the entire deal with the "What do you see in the pictures?" ? Why the "I leave it entirely in your hands." at the very end, how is this not to say "Hey its up to you what to make of it.".

Moore is a miserable piece of shit, and you know it, I know it, he himself probably knows it, hes disowning everything and everyone that doesnt fit his current world view, even stuff he did in the past himself.

>your problem is that you're irrationally spooked by black women or whatever

Yeah like complaining about a character written shittily is being spooked by the fact that she is black, get a hang of yourself you fucking sheep.
Honestly all in all just sad, Id love to actually talk about the comic and I find it almost depressing that the only continuation or adaption that did it any right is the movie, its just not a lot, and the original one is such a gem.
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Turanga Leela - Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:25:28 EST K+JAA4tm No.412227 Reply
>>412224
>Veidts parents are explicitly stated to be INTELECTUALLY unremarkable, its the whole POINT of the sentence you quote to show that his class origin is not something that matters for his character
No, the point of that sentence is to show that they were intellectually average.
The point of the sentence about his inheritence is to show that they were well above average in terms of wealth.

Those are two different things. Class and intelligence are different concepts, which is why we use different words to describe them by the way.

You said that you didn't remember Veidt's family being luxuriously wealthy. I provided direct textual evidence of that. You were wrong. Pretending that you don't understand what words mean isn't going to change that. Stop acting dumb. You didn't understand the comic.

>how come he was given a background that would make you sympathezise with him
>Why make him the fucking protagonist with frequent voice overs?
To criticise and deconstruct Batman (as well as Mr. A and the Question and other Ditko characters), who is the protagonist of his own stories and has a sympathetic background that is supposed to justify him turning into a weirdo in a costume who brutalizes people. And because having a direct narrative of Rorschach's inner thoughts makes it easier to show the reader just how insane and disconnected from reality he is (as well as providing an unreliable narrator to help set up the main mystery to be discovered).

The creaters of the comic, not just Moore but also Gibbons, have already answered your questions. But, interestingly, when presented with those answers instead of accepting them you just decide that your misinterpretation of the story is the real truth that you know better than the people who wrote it. When presented with the facts of what this story is about, you refuse to listen and instead defer to your feelings about what you want it to be about.

How exactly do you expect HBO to be true to the original story if apparently the only person on earth who knows that truth is you? Not the creators, not the millions of people whose interpretations line up with the creators, just you?

>hes disowning everything and everyone that doesnt fit his current world view, even stuff he did in the past himself.
His current world view is the same as he's always had. He has always been a super-lefty, and his comics have always reflected that.

You didn't understand the comic, but instead of just accepting that you've weaved some ridiculous conspiracy where you know better than the creators of the comic who are lying about what it was about for some reason, based on nothing but you own inability to accept that the source material never agreed with your political leanings.

>Yeah like complaining about a character written shittily is being spooked by the fact that she is black
You haven't actually explained how she's written poorly. All you've done is complain about how you can't empathize with poor black women, how you're triggered by seeing poor black women in media, how there need to be less poor black people in media, and used the term "Current Year" a lot.

You've made it very clear that your real problem with this show is being spooked by black people, as well the fact that you apparently hate the source material and everything it stood for.
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Fuu - Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:46:15 EST wdHyeAoI No.412229 Reply
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>>412224
You do realize that it's possible to be upper class and intellectually unremarkable at the same time, right?

Right?
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Jayne Cobb - Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:46:43 EST u+SQmS1M No.412230 Reply
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>people in this thread
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Rupert Grint - Sat, 14 Dec 2019 18:47:06 EST zx1q0Nl5 No.412270 Reply
>>412224
Fuck off back to the future faggot. Seriously. Take your retarded alt-right talk somewhere else, you fucking cocksucker. Fuck off.

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