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Vince Li, man who beheaded passenger on Greyhound bus, given absolute discharge by Ian Hettingkedge - Mon, 13 Feb 2017 18:52:33 EST ID:pLlEOZYt No.155794 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/canada/manitoba/vince-li-discharge-1.3977278

Vince Li, the man who was found not criminally responsible for beheading a man on a Greyhound bus in 2008, has been granted an absolute discharge.

The Manitoba Criminal Code Review Board ordered the discharge on Friday, saying Li, now known as Will Lee Baker, does not pose a significant safety threat.

Vince Li OK'd to move to Winnipeg group home
Vince Li could get absolute discharge

Baker was found to have been suffering from untreated schizophrenia when he stabbed, beheaded and partially cannibalized Tim McLean, 22.

McLean's mother, Carol de Delley, a vocal critic of Canada's not criminally responsible laws and who believes Baker should remain in custody for life, posted to Facebook on Friday that she has nothing to say about his discharge.

"I have no comment today. I have no words," de Delley wrote.

Baker was found not criminally responsible in 2009 and spent seven years in treatment at the Selkirk Mental Health Centre before being allowed to move to Winnipeg, where he was treated at Health Sciences Centre.

Last year, he was permitted to move into independent living, but he had to abide by certain rules, which included taking medications and attending counselling appointments.
>>
Doris Saddledock - Mon, 13 Feb 2017 21:37:28 EST ID:ZVDP4LkU No.155795 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Although part of me is happy that a guy not criminally responsible for what he did is able to get a second chance, I cant help but think it's entirely wrong. He killed and began eating a person because he wasn't medicated, and now he'll be free to not medicate himself if he chooses and have the whole situation happen again. They stress that he realizes how important his medication is, and he likely does, but who's to say he always will?

We've all gone through rough patches in life, and sometimes things get so bad we quit caring about our own future and do something irresponsible. If this happens to him, and he decides to stop medicating, it could very well cost someone their life. Whats done is done, I'm just glad that if worse comes to worse, the blood won't be on my hands. Unless God tells him to kill me, that is.
>>
Martha Nivingtutch - Mon, 13 Feb 2017 22:31:34 EST ID:tTbJ2n2O No.155796 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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Wow. What the fuck.

There is no fucking way that guy should be on the streets with only medical attention between him and other people. He should be behjnd fuckkng bars.

He decapitated a guy and ate his fucking brains.

You do that ONCE. And go to jail forever, after that.
>>
Betsy Blatherstone - Mon, 13 Feb 2017 22:39:34 EST ID:EjFN0ri2 No.155797 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>155796
STOP IT. This poor human is a victim of society. Your words are hurting my delicate sensibilities.
>>
Hedda Worthingwill - Mon, 13 Feb 2017 22:41:40 EST ID:0hiLuBpD No.155798 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155796
It's the [CURRENT YEAR +2], what do you expect?
>>
Graham Claycocke - Mon, 13 Feb 2017 23:44:08 EST ID:mFK5yRIO No.155799 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Realistically, all he needs is heavy medication and supervision. It's not necessary to keep someone under lockup forever because they were unmedicated and started hearing God telling them that they needed to stop an alien invasion of Earth. Severe mental illness killed that guy on the bus.

The killers first words in court? Pleading to be killed for what he did.
>>
Doris Saddledock - Tue, 14 Feb 2017 00:10:29 EST ID:ZVDP4LkU No.155801 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155799

>Realistically, all he needs is heavy medication and supervision.

Absolutely, which is why it's distressing to see them give him an absolute discharge instead of a conditional discharge. It wouldn't take much to make sure this doesn't happen again. I do think we should focus on reintegrating the mentally ill back into society, but I don't think that route is the best for this kind of case.
>>
Frederick Surrywater - Tue, 14 Feb 2017 00:24:15 EST ID:Mq+mJb1B No.155802 Ignore Report Quick Reply
rehabilitation, not punishment. The US can learn a thing or two from their northen neighbors
>>
Martha Buffingmed - Tue, 14 Feb 2017 00:36:33 EST ID:+5q0zMgm No.155803 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>155802
lmao how do you rehabilitate someone away from the disposition to decapitate people and eat their god damn brains
>>
Graham Claycocke - Tue, 14 Feb 2017 00:55:36 EST ID:mFK5yRIO No.155804 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155801

No yeah I agree that the possibility for a simple release is kind of off at this point, but all they've actually done now is put him in a group home under supervision, which isn't as expensive I bet as housing him in a prison.

Sure they say he may have the possibility of being let go for good, but courts in America also told Charlie Manson that he was eligible for parole, lol. Just because a court says as a matter of procedure and law (based on sentencing guidelines, usually) that someone can go free eventually, doesn't mean it'll ever happen.
>>
Betsy Pinningstone - Tue, 14 Feb 2017 01:53:08 EST ID:GLH3C+SV No.155805 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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No, no, no. Fuck this shit. This is fucking stupid beyond words.

This guy loses his fucking hall pass. This is not the kind of thing you medicate and talk through.
>>
Priscilla Gankinstone - Tue, 14 Feb 2017 03:34:50 EST ID:ngsDMbPV No.155806 Ignore Report Quick Reply
should have been executed like he wanted. why torture him like a pet.
>>
Hedda Worthingwill - Tue, 14 Feb 2017 03:41:16 EST ID:0hiLuBpD No.155808 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155803
For real haha, the only rehabilitation needed is a bullet in the back of the head. Hard to believe there are people in this thread unironically supporting reintegrating this sick fuck back into society.
>>
Betsy Trotgold - Tue, 14 Feb 2017 06:49:52 EST ID:cbhMfSls No.155810 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155805
Uh, if you can medicate a schizophrenic that talks to himself, you can medicate a murderous schizophrenic. Fuck, you are retarded.
>>
Wesley Clubbleson - Tue, 14 Feb 2017 13:12:59 EST ID:r14Wb2/L No.155811 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155810
Are you volunteering to live next door to him?
>>
Graham Duttingbury - Tue, 14 Feb 2017 13:18:20 EST ID:QYpjCH3+ No.155813 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155810

You have two ____, both are broken. One ____ killed a stranger in their sleep in a public place, decapitated said stranger, then proceeded to mutilate and eat the murdered person in front of others. The other ____ has not murdered anyone, and while prone to outbursts in public spaces when confronted and is easily irritable and makes others uncomfortable with their rambling and frenzied speech in public.

They're both broken, both suffering from the exact same condition, and there's no guarantee you can fix either one. That being said, which one do you attempt to fix? Would you attempt to fix both even if the end result could be failure on your behalf and your failure putting others in danger? At what point do you prioritize the lives of others that could be affected by these broken _____ above your desire to fix them? Or do you not consider the collateral damage because it does not affect you and you're convinced will not affect you in any way?
>>
Graham Cishman - Tue, 14 Feb 2017 13:21:18 EST ID:4NdD7HSe No.155814 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155813

Look into the effectiveness of treatment and rates of re-offense in cases like this instead of engaging in speculation
>>
Wesley Clattingfoot - Wed, 15 Feb 2017 05:11:27 EST ID:mM9fZu54 No.155839 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Paranoid terror and stigmatization of mental illness still alive and well in the first world I see. Such bravery, to be so quick to call for the caging or death of an unwell person.
>>
David Greencocke - Wed, 15 Feb 2017 06:15:16 EST ID:NSHJykeG No.155840 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155839
I keep getting this paranoid delusion that this guy may decapitate me and then eat my brains and i don't know what to do about it!
>>
Lillian Sollerkere - Wed, 15 Feb 2017 06:39:26 EST ID:cbhMfSls No.155841 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155813
Past results are no indication of future performance. All investments are subject to risk, which should be considered prior to making any investment decisions. Consult your personal investment advisers before making an investment decision.
>>
Alice Nimmerbanks - Wed, 15 Feb 2017 12:09:58 EST ID:knFhJQjN No.155844 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155841

What is the investment being made in Vince Li? A chance for violent cannibal murderers to have a second chance at freedom?
>>
Simon Grimwell - Wed, 15 Feb 2017 12:23:33 EST ID:i2SzqmZt No.155845 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155839
Well pardon me but I think I'll put the life of the person he killed, and possible more deaths ahead of his, which you seem to hold so dear simply because he's fucking insane. If the guy was just a madman and not diagnosed schizophrenic would you still think he should be treated as a victim of his own crimes?
>>
Twiggy - Wed, 15 Feb 2017 12:27:12 EST ID:o2t41hRF No.155846 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I remember seeing a murder show about this guy. He's out? Fuck.
>>
Edward Duckgold - Wed, 15 Feb 2017 12:36:48 EST ID:QYpjCH3+ No.155847 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155845

That's irrelevant, he's an actual schizophrenic. That being said, not all schizophrenics murder, decapitate, mutilate, and eat people. I'm all for medicating and rehabilitating non-dangerous schizophrenics, "non-dangerous" meaning ones that have not shown any inclination of causing serious harm to others (acting hostile, shouting at people, or attempting to hit them with their fists would not be considered "dangerous" in this case). Li is a "dangerous" schizophrenic that has a documented case of an evil act.

I get it that Canadians pride themselves as being the tolerant North, but it's irresponsible to let someone like Li out into the public with no supervision just because you believe you've "cured" him. Institutionalize someone like Li, allow them to work and converse with others institutionalize to quell your concerns and allow him to live a controlled, but reasonable life, until he dies.
>>
Jack Blibberlun - Wed, 15 Feb 2017 22:39:34 EST ID:mM9fZu54 No.155865 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155845
>If the guy was just a madman and not diagnosed schizophrenic would you still think he should be treated as a victim of his own crimes?
>If the guy was just a madman

Well then yes, obviously.
>>
Lillian Wadgefatch - Thu, 16 Feb 2017 01:53:43 EST ID:4NdD7HSe No.155867 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155845

>if the circumstances were completely different, would you evaluate the situation differently?

What a pointless question
>>
Martin Hasslestone - Thu, 16 Feb 2017 02:07:46 EST ID:knFhJQjN No.155868 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I got a question:

If a schizophrenic priest was raping lil boy bootyholes cause he thought he could fuck satan out of their assholes, would it be okay to let him return to preisthood after he was cured by miracles of modern drugs?
>>
Lillian Wadgefatch - Thu, 16 Feb 2017 02:26:54 EST ID:4NdD7HSe No.155869 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155868

The Catholic church bends over backwards (bazinga) to not punish priests who aren't even schizophrenic who rape kids so probably
>>
William Fuckinghood - Thu, 16 Feb 2017 03:12:11 EST ID:WKsW9UhP No.155870 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>155869
Your response creates a fallacy that fails to address the question.

The question was not about things that have happened or what others might do.

The question was: Would it be okay?
>>
Edward Subbersick - Thu, 16 Feb 2017 08:31:33 EST ID:cbhMfSls No.155875 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155845
People die every day. People get murdered by completely sane people every day.

What is your outrage about that?

People always go batshit insane when a crazy person commits murder, calling for death penalties or life imprisonment, and then some regular guy beats his brother-in-law to death over a debt, or stabs his wife to death because he was jealous of her talking to the neighbour - and people just think "oh that's just murder, he'll just do life and maybe they'll shave some years off by the time he's elderly if he has been nice in prison."

What's the logic in that? The crazy guy had no control over his actions when he murdered someone, meanwhile the sane person was in FULL CONTROL when he decided to murder someone.

This is completely batshit insane. People are deadly afraid of crazy people killing, but no one fucking sees that ANYONE AROUND YOU could just murder you for some personal subjective reason while being completely sane.
>>
Hugh Horrychuck - Thu, 16 Feb 2017 08:55:51 EST ID:fVxlLS44 No.155876 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155870
what pokemon is this
>>
Cyril Blythestone - Thu, 16 Feb 2017 11:04:04 EST ID:zx3znhxH No.155877 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>155875
No shit, it's because you can't anticipate what some crazy nutjob is gonna do. They're sitting on a bus and then they decide that they should really kill you, completely out of the blue. In both of the examples you gave, you can understand why they did it and see the logic behind it. That doesn't mean you agree with it or think it wasn't bad / wrong / stupid / immoral / whatever, just that you can process the situation and make some sense of it. I'd also argue that the husband stabbing his wife for talking to the neighbour straddles the line between sane and mentally unhinged and that a dude killing his wife after walking in on her cheating on him would have been a better example, but that's not the point.

People don't like things they can't wrap their heads around. It's really as simple as that. It's the same reason why our ancestors had a hundred gods for every part of life, there was a bunch of shit they couldn't possibly begin to explain and it was unnerving so when somebody came up with an answer, everybody was on board.
>>
Lillian Wadgefatch - Thu, 16 Feb 2017 11:20:23 EST ID:4NdD7HSe No.155878 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155870

Ask a stupid question, get a stupid answer

It's not relevant in the slightest
>>
Martin Hasslestone - Thu, 16 Feb 2017 11:54:18 EST ID:knFhJQjN No.155880 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155878

How is it not relevant? Because you don't want to argue for child rape?

You're right, child rape is unsavory compared to being stabbed to death, beheaded, and cannibalized.

The truth is you're making excuses for a homicidal lunatic because this particular homicidal lunatic is more mentally unstable than normal homicidal lunatic. I can't wrap my head around how that logic makes sense to you, so I wont. Instead, I'm going write the following:

If Vince Li was a sane man in all respects, and he stabbed, beheaded, and cannibalized a person, he should go to prison for life.

If Vince Li was a diagnosed scizophrenic, and he stabbed, beheaded, and cannibalized a person, he should go to prison for life.

And I'll put this forward too:

If any of you see me running around stabbing, beheading, and eating people, feel free to put a bullet in my head. I would prefer being dead to being a danger to everyone around me.
>>
Lillian Wadgefatch - Thu, 16 Feb 2017 12:30:34 EST ID:4NdD7HSe No.155881 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155880

No, it isn't relevant because what the catholic church does does or would do in a hypothetical scenario has no bearing on this at all. I can't fathom why you think it would.

There's a reason people aren't help criminally culpable for actions committed when they're mentally unhinged, it's because they're not intentionally committing a crime. The law makes a distinction between willful and unwillful acts, hence separate charges for manslaughter and murder. They're not in control, their illness is. That's why you medicate them, because it solves the problem. People who are (relatively) sane and murderous are inherently dangerous, people who are schizophrenic and have a violent episode are no longer dangerous when they're on their mediation.
>>
Eliza Gaffinglitch - Thu, 16 Feb 2017 14:09:14 EST ID:i2SzqmZt No.155882 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155867
>>155878
>>155875
It's a totally relevant question, because it doesn't matter exactly what was going on inside the mind of the person to see the effect of said person on society. If the person was just murderous, or if he was completely losing his shit and became murderous, it doesn't matter, they're both fucking murderous. The whole point of jailing and prosecuting people is to place threats to society in a place where they're no longer threats to society. The fact that he has a diagnosed condition doesn't change the threat that he poses.
>>
Albert Bummleset - Thu, 16 Feb 2017 14:17:07 EST ID:aIivaRsS No.155883 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155882
>The whole point of jailing and prosecuting people is to place threats to society in a place where they're no longer threats to society.


Thats the key though. They believe he is no long a threat. The recidivism rate for those who were declared NCR and then deemed to be no longer a threat are far lower then the general criminal rates.
>>
Lillian Wadgefatch - Thu, 16 Feb 2017 16:52:43 EST ID:4NdD7HSe No.155889 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155882

Okay...here's the equation.

Schizophrenic person who killed someone + medication = someone who is highly unlikely to ever hurt anyone again.

Now do you get it?
>>
William Devingdore - Fri, 17 Feb 2017 12:53:26 EST ID:NSHJykeG No.155913 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>155889
>>
George Blackdale - Fri, 17 Feb 2017 13:05:57 EST ID:aIivaRsS No.155915 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155913
Again, recidivism rates for those declared NCR due to insanity, and deemed fit to be released are far lower then the normal rates for felons.

Unless you think the doctors are wrong with Li, or that you feel that justice needs a stronger punishment focus.
>>
Priscilla Moshson - Fri, 17 Feb 2017 13:29:49 EST ID:i2SzqmZt No.155916 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155915
I think justice needs a stronger punishment focus when it comes to murder.
How do you think the victim's family feels. I understand that him rotting away in jail or in a mental institution doesn't help anyone but it still doesn't feel right for this dude to do this, then just get released, regardless of his mental state during.
>>
James Gadgehit - Fri, 17 Feb 2017 13:52:19 EST ID:Yt/Fze/s No.155917 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155916
>I understand that him rotting away in jail or in a mental institution doesn't help anyone but it still doesn't feel right
Fuck your feels. If the numbers back it up, then your feels are irrelevant.

Actually, your feels are irrelevant either way, but I'm surd you get the idea.
>>
Caroline Baddleville - Fri, 17 Feb 2017 14:42:50 EST ID:I3orHF0H No.155918 Ignore Report Quick Reply
This man is all risk and no reward. I imagine no amount of psychological assessment could have anticipated him cutting someone's head off so there's no reason to assume he's now fit for society just because hes taking drugs and some big heads say so. Lock him up or deport him if he's not native born
>>
Emma Trotson - Fri, 17 Feb 2017 16:42:05 EST ID:kOO0oq2A No.155919 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155916

Again, they aren't in control, the are not a person willfully choosing to murder, they are essentially criminally insane when the killing occurs. Punishing someone for something they wouldn't have even chosen to do if they were in their right mind is just draconian. It is unreasonable to have expected them to do anything else when the demons were talking to them in their mind.
>>
Emma Trotson - Fri, 17 Feb 2017 16:50:58 EST ID:kOO0oq2A No.155920 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155918

>I imagine no amount of psychological assessment could have anticipated him cutting someone's head off

If he had had the necessary treatment and been medicated it wouldn't have happened. I wonder if he had health insurance.

>Some big heads say no

Thankfully we live in a world where the people who actually know what they're talking about are occasionally listened to and their knowledge can be used to discover what's actually true and act with reality in mind. That's why they're in charge of understanding and treating schizophrenia and you aren't.
>>
Albert Shakedock - Fri, 17 Feb 2017 18:56:21 EST ID:FbB9VtEo No.155922 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155920
Yes, mental health practitioners and the DSM are widely regarded as infallible.
>>
Hamilton Lightwater - Fri, 17 Feb 2017 19:57:23 EST ID:kOO0oq2A No.155925 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155922

Who said anything about infallibility dumbass?
>>
Matilda Pebblehood - Fri, 17 Feb 2017 20:36:43 EST ID:ZVDP4LkU No.155926 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155919

It was god talking to him, not demons. I believe he should be reintegrated, however he should still be monitored on a regular basis. He's likely harmless when medicated, but leaving a proven violent schizophrenic in charge of medicating himself doesn't sit well with me. All it takes is someone to check up on him once a day.

Could you imagine the backlash if he just took off for a few days and killed someone else? What a story that would be.
>>
Hamilton Lightwater - Fri, 17 Feb 2017 20:40:46 EST ID:kOO0oq2A No.155927 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155926

I agree
>>
Ian Gimblebut - Fri, 17 Feb 2017 21:29:41 EST ID:dfoQiEUf No.155928 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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This thread is filled wih total fuckig assholes who should pull their heads out of their own asses before this ridiculously psychotic fuck forgets his meds and comes along and cuts it out for them.
>>
Nigel Brullerman - Fri, 17 Feb 2017 22:05:16 EST ID:fDrN6bij No.155934 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155925
What is the acceptable margin for error in this circumstance?
>>
Isabella Grandworth - Sat, 18 Feb 2017 03:02:06 EST ID:Ko4AQbB+ No.155937 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I just wanna drop in and mention some things to you guys, as a Winnipeg native who remembers the original incident vividly and has had a lot of experience in the local mental healthcare system.

Vince Li is not a free man, don't misunderstand this, he meets judges yearly who'll review his case and any relevant changes and decide if he can remain free. He cannot move without the approval of his medical team. He takes his medication under legal supervision, I'm not sure the exact details but this means that either someone is watching him swallow pills every single day or he's being injected with large doses of long lasting medications monthly, if he were to skip out on this there would be a manhunt and likely criminal charges separate from the incident years ago. He lives in a secure halfway house with 24/7 psychiatric monitoring, the proposed Absolute Release in the years to come would mean he could move into a private residence and likely move down from 24/7 surveillance to daily or weekly visits to ensure compliance with his medication. If nothing else this'll save our healthcare system money and manpower that could be routed to people who are both in much more danger of acute mental illness and who havn't committed a crime.
This comes after 8 years of intense psychological evaluation and treatment, his psyche is more understood than almost anyone in the country, if its possible to declare anyone "not a risk" he's had more vetting and evidence put towards that claim than any other person in this country.


And finally for American friends who might not understand the criminal justice system in Canada. From your perspective we can be relatively soft on crime, the maximum possible sentence for any crime (first degree murder and treason) is life with no parole for 25 years, most offenders are paroled at some point after they're eligible. Even if you considered Mr Li criminally responsible for his actions it'd be second degree murder which carries a minimum ten years of parole ineligibility, the vast majority of offenders with no incidents in custody and who express deep remorse and a desire for penance as Mr Li have are paroled as soon as they are eligible, so even convicted of murder he could reasonably be out in 2 years.
All that said, we also have far less civil liberties than Americans do on a fundamental constitutional level and this applies to the justice system, if the Crown doesn't want you out you will simply never see the light of day again. You don't even have to commit a crime, judges and the RCMP can order peace bonds on citizens who they feel might commit a crime.
>>
Isabella Grandworth - Sat, 18 Feb 2017 03:05:55 EST ID:Ko4AQbB+ No.155938 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155937
Sorry for double posting but after thinking some more I have one more thing I want to add, on the money and manpower note.
Why should someone who's for all intents and purposes sane and stable be taking up a bed in our overcrowded mental health system? There are countless people who could use the resources being tied up there solely to keep the public from feeling uncomfortable. People in the same situation Mr Li was in 8 years ago.
>>
Isabella Grandworth - Sat, 18 Feb 2017 03:12:03 EST ID:Ko4AQbB+ No.155939 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155937
and shit, I didn't realize he'd already been given the absolute release. most of that still holds though. my bad
>>
Shitting Passlewell - Sat, 18 Feb 2017 03:27:00 EST ID:StRcVATO No.155940 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>155938
An American jury would have dropped a first degree charge on him, letter of the law be damned, and threw away the key. 25 to life here too, with capital punishment on the table in some states.

No reason to rehabilitate, since there is only treatment and no cure in this situation. No reason to treat, since he should be put down for what he did anyway.

Yes, yes, the death penalty can prove to cost more on paper, than a life sentence. Either way, who gives a shit about remorse or illness here. A fuck up like this isn't something that should see the benefit of a soft response.

Where's the incentive to stay sane anymore? Why not just flip out and decapitate people? Countries that go soft on this kind of crime benefit no one.

Anyway, he's probably being kept alive, so he can be carefully studied in a medical context. Not because anybody gives a fuck.
>>
Hugh Honeybanks - Sat, 18 Feb 2017 04:20:33 EST ID:mM9fZu54 No.155941 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155940
don't cut yourself on that edge
>>
Polly Sendlesetch - Sat, 18 Feb 2017 05:25:00 EST ID:+5q0zMgm No.155942 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155937
Well we're all glad he's okay now. Thank god. I mean, after he decapitated that guy and began to eat his brains, we were all worried about his well being. Thank you, tolerant north for taking care of this poor guy. He was, and always will be our #1 concern.
>>
Nicholas Clebberdock - Sat, 18 Feb 2017 10:12:58 EST ID:bq9mUpwR No.155944 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155889
Schizophrenics are really bad about not taking their meds.
>>
Hamilton Lightwater - Sat, 18 Feb 2017 16:56:11 EST ID:kOO0oq2A No.155946 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155940

Do you STILL not understand that he didn't willfully commit a crime, as a sane, thinking person, or are you just sick in the head yourself?
>>
Basil Fuckingstock - Sat, 18 Feb 2017 18:16:39 EST ID:cbhMfSls No.155948 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155946
He's American. Of course he's sick in the head.
>>
Doris Ginningcheck - Sat, 18 Feb 2017 20:03:52 EST ID:D8XUDV9z No.155952 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155946
Does that matter? He's possessed by a psycho killer cannibal. Kill him.
>>
Archie Tootshaw - Sat, 18 Feb 2017 21:38:54 EST ID:knFhJQjN No.155954 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155946

You keep trying to argue about how it was okay that he beheaded and started eating a guy because he wasn't in a right state of mind, like, how can you not see that it doesn't matter?

If someone killed your mom tonight, would it matter to you if the killer was sane?
>>
Doris Buppermetch - Sun, 19 Feb 2017 03:15:54 EST ID:r14Wb2/L No.155956 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155946
who the fuck are you captain Picard? Going to confine him to quarters or some thing? Oh I know take away his holodick privileges. He wont murder ever again.
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Edward Channingket - Sun, 19 Feb 2017 03:19:50 EST ID:oo4nSESc No.155957 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>155954
Yeah, this isn't manslaughter like, whoops! Got drunk and drove my car into a playground and decapitated 5 children!

But if it WAS a drunk driver more people would be on board with a life sentence, because "chose to get drunk" is part of the idea, and that scumbag was completely fucking irrensponsible about alcohol. People would howl for a drunk driving death sentence.

Oh! Okay! So, "chose to get drunk" means "chose to decapitate children"?

But asshole does the reverse, goes off his meds, and same basic outcome. Yeah... whatever.

This guy's failure mode is unprovoked psychotic mutilation. Unlike a drunk, who fails into normal mode and requires an automobile and drunk-mode activated by alcohol.

The barrier is low in each case, but one requires the will to activate, while the other is the default mode. Lock him up, even if he's old and sucks.
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Fucking Seffinglock - Sun, 19 Feb 2017 09:39:02 EST ID:aIivaRsS No.155958 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155956
That was Janeway.
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Matilda Piddlepitch - Sun, 19 Feb 2017 14:47:12 EST ID:cbhMfSls No.155961 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155954
Yes. Because a sane killer made the clear choice to murder. Duh. Are you too fucking retarded to understand the concept of diminished control of the self, or do you believe in some kind of retarded bronze-age jew-caveman soul shit?
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Jarvis Bellytick - Mon, 20 Feb 2017 00:57:18 EST ID:8N7KDLv+ No.155971 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>155961
So it wasn't his fault. So fucking what. That should not preclude him never again seeing the light of day.

If his life is fated to forever lack choice, and thus it his a misery he can never unknow, then his life already wasted on madness will not be missed in some pit of a cell he'd scarcely understand if pills were never wasted on him.

Admit it. The cruel pragmatism is what bothers you, not the cold clarity of purpose. Some of us know what to do in these situations, rather than collect a clutter of lives in some dust bin like an incompetant grandmotherly hoarder.
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Sidney Fanderpick - Mon, 20 Feb 2017 01:47:52 EST ID:B7EBVJHu No.155972 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155971
Alright, if you won't accept an argument of justice, how about utility?

According to people who are far more able to make the determination than anyone here, the man is no longer a danger.
The fact that his illness costed someone's life does not diminish the value of his own life considering his illness is controlled.

For your concern that he is more likely to commit murder because he has done so to be valid, you would have to be far more concerned about every single non-mentally ill release as they have a higher recidivism rate.
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Hannah Pittdock - Mon, 20 Feb 2017 03:00:26 EST ID:NuDb/mEX No.155973 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155972

fuck your entire stance. fuck anyone who commits murder, especially in such an atrocious manner. execute them, eradicate them from the gene pool. fuck rehabilitating this subhuman animal, it is a WASTE
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Sidney Fanderpick - Mon, 20 Feb 2017 03:20:15 EST ID:B7EBVJHu No.155975 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>155973
If it's not about justice or utility, what exactly is your argument?

It makes you feel better to know a guy was killed over something he had no understanding or control over?
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Angus Sishbutch - Mon, 20 Feb 2017 06:48:57 EST ID:cbhMfSls No.155976 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155971
Protip, none of us have any choice. Free will is a fucking joke. Your entire life is set in motion by the events that preceded it. The universe is deterministic. It doesn't matter if the arrow of time moves forward or backward, the result is always the same.
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Oliver Crollerspear - Mon, 20 Feb 2017 08:35:22 EST ID:fVxlLS44 No.155977 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155976
my man.
chemical reactions are all we are, or will ever be. the meat in our heads likes to create reason after the fact.
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Jarvis Murdlock - Mon, 20 Feb 2017 14:06:29 EST ID:okcxXpDl No.155990 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155976
>The universe is deterministic.
Even if it is the sheer amount of information, and Heisenbergian uncertainty means that for all practical purposes our choices do matter. Einstein taught us that perspective does matter after all. Even if we confirm a deterministic universe that very confirmation will change it since we are part of it.
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Martha Bropperturk - Mon, 20 Feb 2017 14:23:19 EST ID:lYEV514W No.155991 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155990
Sure is /pss/ in here...
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Jarvis Murdlock - Mon, 20 Feb 2017 14:38:35 EST ID:okcxXpDl No.155992 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155991
Not really. Physics itself would dictate that anything that could effectively simulate the future must be a) more complex than this universe and b) not not affect the process itself.
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Charlotte Sallerstock - Mon, 20 Feb 2017 21:41:36 EST ID:EjFN0ri2 No.155996 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155977
You've got that reversed. Reason (aka the mind) created the "meat in your head".
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Shit Grandwell - Mon, 20 Feb 2017 23:06:29 EST ID:xjXqe+2t No.155997 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>155992
Only slightly. Virtual computing shows us that a system can describe a replica system of itself, within itself, and require only a small amount of breathing room as an affordance layer as a control surface for proxying and listening to events that change the virtualized simulation.

Based on this, without any significant chaotic noise disrupting a scenario, and with suffient awareness of preconditions, plenty can be predicted before it happens.

Consider the inevitable collision of the Milky Way galaxy with the Andromeda galaxy. Since we know enough about both systems before the event, and since the event will be taking place at geological timescales, and since we're way in front of it, we'll probably be able to completely simulate the results long before they ever happen.

It's really about scope, proxkmity and duration of the situation that dictates what we can predict.
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Augustus Drubbleworth - Tue, 21 Feb 2017 03:43:55 EST ID:L1VWkTBK No.156001 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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In the real world, this guy would have been killed. Africa, China, Brazil, Russia, non-pussy nations...he would have been shot on the scene, and then shot again, and again, until dead. No sympathy would be had for him. He would be called a witch, a sorcerer, and his death would be priased.

All except the superstitious crap, is exactly how it should have gone down, and that's what justice is.

Now you've got a broken guy, who will never contribute anything to society (schizos have low iqs, they never invent anything...they just fuck shit up, might make a good artist but that's about it.) running around when he should have been killed 7 years ago on the scene.
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Doris Cricklehall - Tue, 21 Feb 2017 04:47:15 EST ID:cbhMfSls No.156002 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156001
> Africa, China, Brazil, Russia, non-pussy nations..

Why don't you fuck off and move to a third world nation then, you fucking sissy faggot?
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Walter Besslematch - Tue, 21 Feb 2017 05:35:37 EST ID:aIivaRsS No.156008 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156001
This website is 18+ only kid.
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Alice Chushsat - Tue, 21 Feb 2017 06:45:35 EST ID:kOO0oq2A No.156009 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156001

I'm glad I'm not the only one who recognizes the need to crack down on sorcerers
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Jarvis Lightcocke - Tue, 21 Feb 2017 18:16:11 EST ID:nO4g22iY No.156025 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156009
fuckin' right. wizards or gtfo.
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Jenny Lightwell - Wed, 22 Feb 2017 05:20:38 EST ID:knFhJQjN No.156048 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>155961

No need to get pissy, I'm just saying that Vince Li should either:

a) Be exectued
B) Never see the light of day again
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Nathaniel Barryfield - Wed, 22 Feb 2017 13:32:23 EST ID:cbhMfSls No.156059 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156048
And I'm saying you should go kill yourself.
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Jenny Lightwell - Wed, 22 Feb 2017 15:06:27 EST ID:knFhJQjN No.156063 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156059

Did the end of Old Yeller offend you?

Sometimes you have to put down a rabid dog.
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Jenny Lightwell - Wed, 22 Feb 2017 15:09:17 EST ID:knFhJQjN No.156065 Ignore Report Quick Reply
If a dog mauls a person, you must kill the dog or else you risk the dog mauling another person.
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Shitting Buzzfuck - Wed, 22 Feb 2017 15:27:26 EST ID:kOO0oq2A No.156066 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156063

You can treat a schizophrenic human to make them sane and not a danger to anyone around them, you can't do the same with a rabid dog, as absurd as it is that anyone even has to entertain this braindead analogy

>>156065

Humans aren't dogs, numbnuts. Aside from that, there are treatments for schizophrenia, there is no treatment for rabies. Aside from THAT, utilizing the death penalty for murder guarantees that innocent people are going to be executed sooner or later, because the justice system is far from omniscient and omnibenevolent. Having the state become murderous itself isn't a good situation.

>People whom it is inherently unreasonable to take capital punitive action against due to their lack of sanity at the time of their crimes should be killed, because ME ANGRY

Bunch of retarded cavemen. Thank god we have a better justice system than that at least.
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Caroline Shakebanks - Wed, 22 Feb 2017 15:43:46 EST ID:L1VWkTBK No.156067 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156066
Hey numbnuts, No you fucking can't. Schizophrenia can never be cured, only treated...forever. It's not the disease you dipshit, it's what he DID. Nobody is saying kill all schizophrenics, so quit getting your panties in a bunch just because you or your sister/brother/cousin/parent/friend is schitz. Nobody is saying they're a bad person. We're saying this piece of fucking shit took a human life, and "muh brain had a fart" is not a valid excuse in this situation. If he freaked out and hid in the corner and shit himself, ok, that's sad, he needs help. I'm 100% saying that. But when you CUT. ANOTHER. HUMANS. HEAD. OFF. I don't care if you had proven 100% MK ultra mind control, you're getting put down, because you might do it again. Also psychology is one of the WEAKEST FUCKING SCIENCES out there BUB so quit acting like anything a psych says about this sack of shit matters.

He cut someones head off and ate it.
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Nicholas Grandwill - Wed, 22 Feb 2017 15:54:55 EST ID:0hiLuBpD No.156068 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156066
>This level of naivety
Why don't you go share a room with him while he's "rehabilitating" if you're so sure of your theory bud.
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Nathaniel Barryfield - Wed, 22 Feb 2017 16:32:25 EST ID:cbhMfSls No.156073 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156067
>>156068
>waaaaaaah y dun da peple bulive in jeebus an da flood???? y du sadan lie to all da peple?
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Shitting Buzzfuck - Wed, 22 Feb 2017 17:34:21 EST ID:kOO0oq2A No.156076 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156067

Yeah they have to keep taking their medication. So do diabetics. You don't say there's no treatment for diabetes because there is. Treatment is different from cure, but if the result is a reversion to normal nonviolent behavior then the problem is solved.

>It's not the disease you dipshit, it's what he DID.

He didn't do anything. His mental illness took over and someone died, but he didn't craft some plan to murder someone and then do it. That's why the law makes distinctions regarding intent. I already explained this.

>We're saying this piece of fucking shit took a human life, and "muh brain had a fart" is not a valid excuse in this situation.

Uh...yes it is. He wasn't in control. You want to punish a person for something they didn't willfully do. That's asinine, not to mention needless cruel.

>I don't care if you had proven 100% MK ultra mind control, you're getting put down, because you might do it again.

Not if he's medicated....................

>Also psychology is one of the WEAKEST FUCKING SCIENCES out there BUB so quit acting like anything a psych says about this sack of shit matters.

First of all, fucking relax. Secondly, regardless of how real science happens in psychology, this is more of a neuroscience and psychiatry thing, and research has been done, as I and other people have said.

>He cut someones head off and ate it.

You're thinking emotionally and are caught up in the legitimate horror of the act and thus disregard the circumstances. Not a good idea when you're deciding someone's fate in a legal context.
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Caroline Shakebanks - Wed, 22 Feb 2017 18:01:26 EST ID:L1VWkTBK No.156082 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>156076
>He didn't do anything. His mental illness took over and someone died, but he didn't craft some plan to murder someone and then do it. That's why the law makes distinctions regarding intent. I already explained this.

This man endorses pedophilia so long as the molester has a brain tumor!
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Shitting Buzzfuck - Wed, 22 Feb 2017 18:07:03 EST ID:kOO0oq2A No.156084 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156082

This man makes ridiculous comparisons between scenarios that aren't related that he thinks are related and then thinks it's clever
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Nathaniel Barryfield - Wed, 22 Feb 2017 18:08:37 EST ID:cbhMfSls No.156085 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156082
You're getting to some Ken Ham level retardation mate. You better get your brain checked out for abnormalities.
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Basil Mottinghick - Fri, 24 Feb 2017 12:07:51 EST ID:mM9fZu54 No.156184 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156082
Understanding that punishment for an act caused by severe mental illness is in no way justified or necessary is not the same thing as approving of the act itself, dum dum.
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Wesley Bronnerfuck - Fri, 24 Feb 2017 14:21:14 EST ID:ZHHMC0O8 No.156190 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Rabid dogs need be put down.

If I was that mother, I'd have hunted down the fucker after he got out. I'd have zero guilt killing someone I knew had the capability to not only kill others, but get away with it, as well as historic records of doing so.

Do the right thing. Put down the bad people.
It's not their fault. They're born broken. But that's no excuse to let them live.
Live is unfair. People deserve to die for being born broken. That's just how it is.

I work in agriculture. When I watch thousands of animals/crops get 'purged' because there's an outbreak, I watch all the living/dead get thrown into a pile and buried alive, and I wish that same sort of thing could be accomplished with humans. We'd be such a better world.
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James Dockledidge - Fri, 24 Feb 2017 15:35:47 EST ID:qWIzAOm+ No.156195 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>156190
Or send them to an island beyond ability to leave but within ability to live.
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Edwin Pockridge - Fri, 24 Feb 2017 15:53:40 EST ID:aIivaRsS No.156198 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156190
Board is 18+ edgelord.
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Charlotte Gushdale - Fri, 24 Feb 2017 16:18:33 EST ID:+Qo84CkH No.156199 Ignore Report Quick Reply
The argument boils down to this:

The welfare of the group vs the welfare of the individual.

If keeping Vince Li away from society helps to prevent the murder/mutilation/cannibalism of another person, in the event he "casually forgets" to take this amazing DRUG to curb his natural insanity, his naturally violent insanity inherent to his nature, then I am for it.

A pitbull is aggressive and violent in its natural state. The same argument applies; not all pitbulls are dangerous! But when a pitbull maims and/or kills a person, the care the pitbull was in was wrong/inadequate.

You want to house a dangerous animal? Don't be surprised when something get's maimed/killed.

I guess that's just an acceptable risk, right?
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Albert Fanhood - Fri, 24 Feb 2017 18:10:55 EST ID:cbhMfSls No.156200 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156190
While we're at it, let's murder all potential murderers too. Let's get the cans of Zyklon B, because you're going for a shower too.
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Nicholas Fuckingdock - Fri, 24 Feb 2017 19:14:38 EST ID:+5q0zMgm No.156205 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>>156198
Honestly, that's not even nearly as edgy as beheading someone and eating their brains in public. Or defending that person.
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Hedda Napperfield - Fri, 24 Feb 2017 19:23:48 EST ID:mix/hX5e No.156206 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156205
at the very least the dude should spend his life in an asylum. for any other person it would be life in prison. crazy or not, his base personality is clearly malevolent..
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William Backlenatch - Fri, 24 Feb 2017 22:42:24 EST ID:kOO0oq2A No.156215 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156199

>The welfare of the group vs the welfare of the individual.

No, it doesn't come down to that, because you can have both by keeping him medicated and treated.

>>156205

True, assuming it was a willful act and not something done by someone who was not in their right mind.

>>156206

>his base personality is clearly malevolent..

You have no reason to believe that at all, so this is baseless speculation. You don't know anything about his personality, only that he has a mental illness, which is something else.
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Augustus Panninghock - Fri, 24 Feb 2017 23:12:56 EST ID:CCSzoLbq No.156216 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156215

Lets say that Charles Manson was medicated to the point where he was deemed a non threat to society. Would you be okay with him roaming free?
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Lydia Clankinbag - Fri, 24 Feb 2017 23:59:17 EST ID:EjFN0ri2 No.156217 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156216
Charles Manson never harmed a fly.
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Graham Pockstock - Sat, 25 Feb 2017 03:56:39 EST ID:pJR6Gnc+ No.156222 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156216
...yup.
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Phineas Crashwell - Sat, 25 Feb 2017 05:50:57 EST ID:mM9fZu54 No.156226 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156216
And here you demonstrate the root of your inability to understand this. In your mind, its not just about public safety, its not just about the greater wellbeing of humanity in general, its about someone being punished. Something bad happened, and to make it feel right to you, someone else has to suffer. You cannot accept the idea that a person could commit a horrifying act and not be held morally accountable, even if science, reason and the law say that said person was not responsible for the act they commited. Keep coming up with ridiculous hypothetical scenarios; you're avoiding the root of the issue, which is the fact of diminished responsibility.

Since you're into fantasy, try this one out; imagine that you had an illness that prevented you from seeing the world as it really was. Imagine that unable to tell what was real, you killed someone. Imagine that you were apprehended, the illness treated, and that only then did you learn, to your horror, the reality of what you had done.

How do you think you should be treated if that were to happen to you?
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Matilda Heckleworth - Sat, 25 Feb 2017 06:29:04 EST ID:cbhMfSls No.156228 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156206
But it isn't his base personality. People with schizophrenia have alterations in their brain chemistry that override their base personality. The problem isn't their base personality. It is that their base personality is suppressed by their schizophrenia.
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Edward Bommerwill - Sat, 25 Feb 2017 06:44:39 EST ID:L1VWkTBK No.156229 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156217
This. Only leftfags think they can shit on Charlies chest like he's christ and they're the Romans. Charles manson never did what they say he did. Worst I know of, is he cut someones ear off in a fight. Whether or not he initiated it, is unknown.
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Charles Goddlefoot - Sat, 25 Feb 2017 09:34:55 EST ID:2/loQQHm No.156230 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>>156217

When he was in some troubled youth home he threatened a kid with a knife and raped him.


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