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420chan is Getting Overhauled - Changelog/Bug Report/Request Thread (Updated July 10)
Codeine Ignore Report Reply
Phyllis Barrycocke - Wed, 15 May 2019 14:02:48 EST ID:WNfYgYWS No.605911
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>decide to give codiene a try only evet had it at 60mg as prescribed for pain
>take 270mg for the first time
>an hour later i just feel a bit heavy, annoyingly itch and my ears are rining

Is this it?
>>
Lydia Gongerford - Wed, 15 May 2019 14:18:14 EST ID:IQRwaK87 No.605912 Ignore Report Reply
>>605911

Take double and smoke weed
>>
Frederick Firringwell - Wed, 15 May 2019 14:58:40 EST ID:FSIIOS20 No.605914 Ignore Report Reply
>>605912
And scratch yourself till you bleed. Codeine can cause really bad histamine reaction so just buy some antihistamines OP. Some are also a bit sedating so they may add.that to your high.
>>
Phyllis Barrycocke - Wed, 15 May 2019 16:01:30 EST ID:WNfYgYWS No.605920 Ignore Report Reply
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>>605914
Yeh, i got some chlorphenamine and combined it with loratadine, kinda helped thanks


>>605911
So I sholuld take what 540mg? Is doubling it really safe/going to make the high that much better, i thought the ceiling was like 400mg? (from what i've read about online)

not trying to shit talk codeine for those who do enjoy it btw
Also, not th at i've taken 270mg today, should I wait like a week?

I'll probably combine it with some weed tho nex titme tbh
>>
Frederick Firringwell - Wed, 15 May 2019 16:47:29 EST ID:FSIIOS20 No.605922 Ignore Report Reply
>>605920
Ceilling dose is different for everyone, I can still feel more effects going as high as 600, but I know people that don't feel any difference from 450 up. You can wait how long you want, a week should be enough to get your tolerance back to baselinr if you are a new user. Just keep in mind that redosing in the same day is pretty pointless for most people.
>>
Phyllis Barrycocke - Wed, 15 May 2019 17:23:52 EST ID:WNfYgYWS No.605924 Ignore Report Reply
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>>605922
Thank
I will wait, i only got codeine because i can buy it legally online in my country, onlinr pharmacies are legal but very weakly reguøated, however only for certain drugs.

I personally adore benzos more as a form of self medicating, i know benzos and opiods are not the same but man benzos feel so much more relxing, though the strongest opiod ive had is dihydrocodeine and i appreciate that its possible morphine, oxycodone and heroin are possibly more wonderful than k know right now.

Is this a stupid question but, if i tried heroin would i definately become addicted? Pethaps a lot of it has to do with the context it has in ones life,im wondering if itll make a difference if someone tries it foe the first time to escape reality or enjoy it(maybe with friends maybe not)
>>
Phyllis Barrycocke - Wed, 15 May 2019 17:30:15 EST ID:WNfYgYWS No.605925 Ignore Report Reply
To be fair i found codeine bettrr than dihydracodeine, dhc made me feel sick and lmost delerious and i had the worst poop ive ever.
>>
Phyllis Barrycocke - Wed, 15 May 2019 17:32:37 EST ID:WNfYgYWS No.605926 Ignore Report Reply
>>605922
If the worst that overdoing it on codeine can do is respiratory arrest and death what are otger potential bad things from taking too much?

Anyone care to share experiences?
>>
Lydia Gongerford - Wed, 15 May 2019 17:48:52 EST ID:IQRwaK87 No.605928 Ignore Report Reply
OP theres a gov paper debunking codeine ceiling dose I cant be arsed to search, take intl account that 500 mgs of codeine are equipotent to 50 mgs of morph, depending on your metabolism that's JACK SHIT! (from the 0 tolerance perspective)
>>
Lydia Gongerford - Wed, 15 May 2019 17:50:24 EST ID:IQRwaK87 No.605929 Ignore Report Reply
>>605928

Just sayin I did the equivalent of 1000> of codeine completely naive and I was no where near dying, dont kys tho
>>
Doris Fuckingfuck - Thu, 16 May 2019 05:23:19 EST ID:8N957kdV No.605940 Ignore Report Reply
>>605924
Regarding your question with Heroin, man just dont go there. I remember feeling like you once, asking questions, perhaps just dabbling with the idea in my mind - like planting the seed almost you know? Anyway, codeine one day wasnt enough and I wanted to see what all the fuss was about 'stronger' opiates. Jumped onto DHC for a bit, then got an Oxy habit. Eventually Heroin followed. I'm now clean btw - but you know what I realise looking back at it all - these 'stronger' opiates just come with a shit load of life changing consequences in exchange for a high which is not that much better than what I started with on Codeine...
>>
David Fibberforth - Thu, 16 May 2019 06:03:10 EST ID:utnW7eFm No.605941 Ignore Report Reply
>>605926
Not being able to shit for few days. Seriously.
>>
Edward Sittingcocke - Thu, 16 May 2019 07:38:32 EST ID:tEnLQJBI No.605944 Ignore Report Reply
>>605940
This. It starts out so good, and then your life falls apart. Been clean for 2-3 years now. Got a job interview today too.
>>
David Fanhood - Thu, 16 May 2019 08:44:40 EST ID:MA2/NYmi No.605948 Ignore Report Reply
>>605928
No, the same studies that disprove the ceiling dose theory also showed that a lot of codeine's activity was due to the codeine-6-glucoronide metabolite and not solely due to conversion to morphine, so the 10% figure is unlikely to be accurate. Also keep in mind that morphine metabolised from codeine would not suffer from the poor oral BA of morphine. 50mg of morphine IV with no tolerance is considerable
>>
Edward Buddlelet - Thu, 16 May 2019 09:25:24 EST ID:IQRwaK87 No.605949 Ignore Report Reply
>>605948

Yeye I was speaking strictly about oral dose, should have made that clear.
I always had the suspicion that 100 mg of codeine were more than 10 mg of morph but the equianalgesic charts say otherwise so go figure.
>>
David Fibberforth - Thu, 16 May 2019 09:51:13 EST ID:utnW7eFm No.605950 Ignore Report Reply
>>605949
Yeah, keep in mind that pain relieving effect that these charts compare doesn't always translate directly to recreational effect.
>>
Jarvis Benderfuck - Sun, 19 May 2019 21:10:11 EST ID:WNfYgYWS No.606158 Ignore Report Reply
>>605940
Appreciate the perspective. I dont want to inject myself anyway but id be more inclined towards anything smoked or swallowed so maybe thstll act as a prevention anyway


>>605944
Thats a really long time m8 well dont hope your interview went well and you can chill
>>
Augustus Fancocke - Sun, 19 May 2019 23:48:16 EST ID:eneL3LFK No.606165 Ignore Report Reply
>>605940
>but you know what I realise looking back at it all - these 'stronger' opiates just come with a shit load of life changing consequences in exchange for a high which is not that much better than what I started with on Codeine...

NA shill plz go
>>
Albert Wemmlepidge - Mon, 20 May 2019 04:22:03 EST ID:8N957kdV No.606179 Ignore Report Reply
>>606165
Or go learn the hard way then dick. Guarantee you will be in that headspace one day, or dead before you realise. Either way, I'm entitled to try and tell someone not to go there - it landed me in a shit load of pain, and if I see someone going down that same road, you expect me to keep quiet?? Go fuck yourself! For info, I've never been to NA btw - I just figured out that there's more to life than taking opiates. Fuck me! What is wrong with this world?? Good luck junkie...
>>
Phoebe Sinkinspear - Mon, 20 May 2019 06:35:12 EST ID:yj30xQV5 No.606181 Ignore Report Reply
>>606165
i never got awesome euphoria from codine but otherwise its the whole opi exp. i'd rather maintain on codeine than subutex...
>>
hsn - Mon, 20 May 2019 11:09:47 EST ID:cA+802PK No.606192 Ignore Report Reply
>>606165
man, you're dense. dudes giving a genuine warning and you call him a shill of all things. are you the asshole who pressures your friends into splitting your grandmas percocet script with you so you arent alone in your degeneracy? in case you didnt notice, opioids are a terrible addiction to get started on and for the majority of people it changes their life for the worse if they're using it recreationally (which is what the post you replied to is referring to).
>>
Albert Wemmlepidge - Mon, 20 May 2019 14:48:01 EST ID:8N957kdV No.606195 Ignore Report Reply
>>606192
I'm glad someone else gets where I was coming from with that post! Cheers man
>>
Augustus Fancocke - Mon, 20 May 2019 17:21:36 EST ID:eneL3LFK No.606205 Ignore Report Reply
>>606192
lol and you can fuck off too.
>>
Charlotte Goodfoot - Mon, 20 May 2019 18:09:52 EST ID:OGQhYIAH No.606213 Ignore Report Reply
>>606165
I wasted more money on codeine in 5-6 months than I did on all other opiates I used in last 6 years. This shit will fucking destroy your finances and the high lasts so short.
>>
hsn - Mon, 20 May 2019 18:49:05 EST ID:H9Woo64l No.606215 Ignore Report Reply
>>606205
nah, I wont
>>
Angus Genkinwater - Tue, 21 May 2019 09:10:52 EST ID:T7KsJraj No.606233 Ignore Report Reply
>>606213
>>606213
I get 100 x 30/500 co cods for roughly $25, why do you buy syrup? I know its cheaper here in uk but cant you try to find some pills to cwe and circumvent the costly lean stigma
>>
Clara Cleffingkod - Tue, 21 May 2019 10:43:00 EST ID:m2bB6u3O No.606238 Ignore Report Reply
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>>605911
codeine relies on enzymatic conversion to produce analgesia/euphoria.
some people get very little effect
>>
Nathaniel Cenderben - Tue, 21 May 2019 12:34:10 EST ID:hbgZe37J No.606240 Ignore Report Reply
>>606238

That has been debunked, other metabolites like norcodeine or gluoco 6 codeine or something like that also exert their effects and contribute to the high.
>>
hsn - Tue, 21 May 2019 14:59:50 EST ID:cA+802PK No.606242 Ignore Report Reply
>>606240

>The genetic polymorphism of CYP2D6 is responsible for the variable response to the medication. Patients with the genotype CYP2D6 PM (poor metabolizers) do not achieve adequate analgesia with codeine. In addition, certain medications that inhibit CYP2D6, such as quinidine, paroxetine, fluoxetine, and bupropion, can alter the phenotype of normal patients with normal genetics and thus decrease the therapeutic analgesic effect of codeine.76

I wouldnt say debunked but people who are poor cyp 2d6 metabolizers have reported not having adequate analgesia from codeine which can be for a number of reasons. what you were referring to is codeine 6-glucuronide which is not metabolized through cyp 2d6 but through the enzyme ugt2b7 via glucoronidation. codeine 6-glucoronide makes for up to 60% of the analgesia but this can vary from person to person. this doesnt mean people cant be deficient in this as well and at the same time not be cyp 2d6 deficient. or maybe even deficient in both enzymes at the same time and this would also mean morphine would probably be ineffective as well. also norcodeine has very little opioid activity and doesn't add anything helpful. ultrarapid metabolizers are a thing and it can cause an increase of concentrations of morphine to up to 50% (opposite of cyp 2d6 deficient). after looking it up this is apparently not common in caucasians (1-2%) but up to 29% of Ethiopians and Saudis.

tl;dr this shit effects everybody differently and there are a lot of factors that can determine why someone isn't feeling the desired effects. it sounds like OP feels it fine he just doesnt enjoy it, its not supposed to be a powerful opioid. maybe the people who nod from it and get plastered are ultrarapid metabolizers or always use it in combo with other depressants. or they're hypebeast bitch boys pouring up crushed cocodamol purple dyed Karo that exaggerate the effects. idk man.
>>
Martin Femblechurk - Tue, 21 May 2019 18:48:07 EST ID:476z/lkM No.606248 Ignore Report Reply
>>606242

Good to know goolge's an ass lately and I couldnt find anything myself 👍👍
>>
>>
Ramble - Tue, 21 May 2019 18:51:12 EST ID:476z/lkM No.606249 Ignore Report Reply
>>606242

I always found it preposterous that 60mg of morph (oral) would equal 600mgs of codeine, I woulnt get high for shiiiiit with that dose of morph but 600 of codeine would have me pretty shitfaced nb
>>
Ernest Nassledock - Wed, 22 May 2019 10:00:07 EST ID:iwPQzXLg No.606262 Ignore Report Reply
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>>606242
Yes, though some studies say 80% not 60%. That's pretty unlikely scenario being deficient in both enzymes. Some people get reduced effects, sure.

I've taken several medications that inhibit CYP 2d6 and used codeine while on them. They do that reduce the effects but I could still get high on 600-800mg of codeine phosphate.
I also found codeine and DXM to be a great combo even though in theory the DXM should complete for the same enzyme and reduce conversion to morphine.

On summary, more is more.
More is also pretty fucking itchy
>>
Jack Nasslespear - Wed, 22 May 2019 12:03:44 EST ID:J11Ow30A No.606263 Ignore Report Reply
>>606262

The whole equianalgesic chart is probably very old and measured with unrealistic parameters, maybe only accounting for pain analgesia, I also refuse to believe that oxy is only 1.5 times as strong as oral morphine, no fucking way in hell nb
>>
hsn - Wed, 22 May 2019 12:39:08 EST ID:cA+802PK No.606264 Ignore Report Reply
>>606263
analgesia doesnt equate to recreational potential. its measured as the effectiveness of reducing pain. this is why buprenorphine is being prescribed for pain relief more often now with the current stigma of opioids. its great at killing pain but the recreational effects, when compared to its equalanalgesia ratio of say hydromorphome or oxycodone, arent even comparable. its also a huge generalization as peoples metabolic processes can have a big effects of whether x works or y works even if they are exactly the same effectiveness when referring to the equalanalgesia chart. it shouldnt be used to think 'oh well I can take this much of x, so this much of y should give me the same effects' its just to give a starting point thats safe when switching opioids. another reason why it blows my mind that people take the in vitro information about very powerful opioid RC's to heart and base their starting dose off of it. for example if say 14-methoxymetapon which from wikipedia states: "It is a highly potent analgesic drug that is around 500x stronger than morphine when administered systemically; however, when given spinally or supraspinally, it exhibits analgesic activity up to a million fold greater than morphine.[2]". so 500x versus 1 million. does this mean you will get 2000 times higher if you have this shit squirted into your spine? you can see what I'm getting at. this is why its dangerous to base these numbers, especially when they are not done in vivo, off what you plan as your starting dose. I see this bullshit all the time on leddit where people see this potent new fentalog come up and use these analgesia numbers as a literal starting point for their dosages when it should be caried out like the method below but even more conservative since they arent even tested in animals yet:

>There are a variety of sources of information providing data on equianalgesic doses for opioids. This information can be used to help plan an opioid switch or rotation if there is a clinical indication to change. In clinical practice it is not advised to use these data as direct dose targets but as the starting point for a calculation. The dose of a substitute opioid needs to take into account a number of factors pertinent to patient co-morbidity and medication, and in practice it is normally advised to target a reduction in the equianalgesic dose of around 30–50%. This is because studies used to derive equianalgesic dose data show wide variability between individuals in opioid analgesic efficacy and incomplete cross-tolerance. Tables and diagrams are often constructed using information from studies of different quality and the data quoted may have been derived from a different clinical context. Any changes in strong opioid prescribing need to be undertaken in a safe environment for the patient with access to breakthrough medication and a fallback plan. Changes involving high doses of strong opioids or methadone are recommended to be undertaken for inpatients.
>>
hsn - Wed, 22 May 2019 12:49:55 EST ID:cA+802PK No.606265 Ignore Report Reply
>>606263
I was just tagging onto your point, not correcting you btw. didnt want to come off like a pedantic fag. what you said is accurate. nb
>>
Emma Blatherham - Wed, 22 May 2019 15:51:35 EST ID:T7KsJraj No.606268 Ignore Report Reply
>>605911
Take antihistamines n more opi
>>
Eugene Chegglehall - Wed, 22 May 2019 19:13:08 EST ID:476z/lkM No.606274 Ignore Report Reply
>>606264

Damn intraspinal opioids, is that the future of hardcore junkies? Getting a friend to inject your remaining 150mg of dope straight into the spinal cord?


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