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The Existence of Whiteness and White People

- Sat, 19 Aug 2017 01:46:29 EST UIYk/9cB No.208391
File: 1503121589960.png -(210781B / 205.84KB, 354x409) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. The Existence of Whiteness and White People
It should be obvious here that this is relevant to the events that occurred in Charlottesville, VA. I'm also assuming that the majority of people here consider themselves white, so it's also relevant in that regard. Also, it might be obvious that I'm not writing from the perspective of a white person. But I think it's worth asking anyway.

My questions are thus: in what way(s) do white people exist? And why does an ethnonationalist project (like the Nazi's, KKK, perhaps the alt-right) depend on a white identity?

Is white a race? An ethnicity? A skin tone? A set of cultural acts?

It seems to me that white people don't really exist for three reasons. One, you can easily substitute a "white" identity with an ethnic one. That is, you can identify yourself as Irish, Scandinavian, German, etc. I think that here, to identify yourself as white is a category mistake.

Second reason is a pragmatic one. Why should we insist on a white identity when so many other identities are better? Why can't you identify as a Starcraft 2 player, a metalhead, a juggalo, a frequent masturbator, etc.? I imagine that telling people that you're white has no reflection as to what you actually do or are. There's no need to hold on to a white identity when there are plenty that more accurately describe your being or group (and ethnicity is included here). Whiteness, in other words, is just an empty signifier.

The third reason is political and relates to the point about whiteness being an empty signifier. I think that it's because whiteness is an empty signifier that groups like the Nazis or the KKK are able to utilize and capitalize on it. Because it is an empty signifier, you can use it to mean whatever you want to mean. You can use the concept of "whiteness" against certain minorities (like the Jews in the case of Nazi Germany, like Mexicans in contemporary US).

This is why, I think, the left and the liberals failed horribly in the last election. The emphasis on the tolerance of minority groups and the fact that there is white privilege and therefore white people need to atone for their sin of being white has produced a political climate where people who identify as white become more radical and more extremist.

Hence it's no wonder that there was the rise of the alt-right and Donald Trump who were able to appeal to those who identified as white, since it was liberals are quick to demand that white people repent for their whiteness. Whiteness here is a trap that you can't get out of, because there's literally nothing you can do about being white except be guilty about it. And those who don't want to feel guilty about it are going to find ways to redeem that identity, such as the case in the alt-right. Now I'm not saying that a project toward greater equality should be abandoned, but I think that in order to get out of the liberal guilt trap of being white, it would be necessary to abandon a white identity.

tl;dr white people don't really exist and reinforcing this identity will only garner more extremist groups like the alt-right
Esther Pobberhood - Sun, 20 Aug 2017 03:24:41 EST 4FAq+MEK No.208393 Reply
Only the government can help minorities, though laws and infrastructure. But dealing with them requires patience and new knowledge about bureacracy etc. Also, it requires people to get together, organize, get to know each other...

A lot of effort, for something that doesn't even affect a white person, who only joined the bandwagon of equality in order to get pussy or reputation anyway.

You know what requires much less effort? Attacking random bigots from behind a screen.
Caroline Hibblepet - Sun, 20 Aug 2017 15:05:10 EST cc26aplb No.208395 Reply
I agree with all you have said, but you must realize that "black people and white people" is just a forced and false dichotomy perpetrated by the media and The Powers That Be in order to cause more strife, chaos, etc in the world. The more you have the peons fighting over stuff that basically doesn't exist, the less they can actually get stuff done for good in the world.
Beatrice Greenfuck - Thu, 24 Aug 2017 13:56:06 EST CXveGuus No.208400 Reply
gotta have that sweet neanderthal DNA
Phyllis Bunbury - Sun, 27 Aug 2017 21:35:39 EST dujyWqP+ No.208407 Reply
"White" person here. I put that in quotations for a few reasons. I do find it much easier to say that I'm white rather than saying that I'm German on my maternal grandfather's side, Swedish on my maternal grandmother's side, this weird Native American/Irish/French mix on my paternal grandfather's side and French/English on my maternal grandmother's side. I can't really claim to have an ethnic tradition as a result.

Additionally, I live in San Antonio, Texas which is predominantly Mexican/Latino (another catch-all term similar to white). Growing up here, Mexican culture has had a waaaaaay bigger influence on me than Swedish culture. So am I more Mexican than Swedish?

Black (at least in America) is another example. African-American is more precise but most people, many black people included, don't seem to feel the need to waste time on the extra syllables. Most are decendants from people imported from central Africa as a part of the slave trade. Are they ethnically Congolese? Nigerian? It's impossible to say because their ancestors had their traditions and history stripped away from them and subsequent generations intermingled with other "black" people as well as native Americans, whites, etc to the point where it's almost it's own ethnicity now.

People crave identity, a group to belong to. I do agree that concepts like white guilt and white privilege wind up hurting more than helping. It's funny too, I've only ever been accused of white privilege by lighter-skinned people with European ancestry.

No real point beyond agreeing with OP and maybe throwing in some context.
Thomas Cronderwine - Mon, 28 Aug 2017 17:50:28 EST UlJWXZvY No.208409 Reply
Zuckerberg is Jewish. He's only white when it suits him to be. Alt Right anti-semites hate him.
This thread is dildos
Hedda Fanbury - Tue, 29 Aug 2017 19:11:25 EST hAlFpoKZ No.208410 Reply

African-American is a completely pants-on-head retarded term. What about black americans who are... NOT from africa? What about indians with "black" skin?
Nigel Mabberlig - Tue, 29 Aug 2017 22:11:28 EST dujyWqP+ No.208412 Reply
They aren't considered "black" because they don't comprise a significant minority in the states. Also black is more of a cultural identity than an ethnicity. Indian people aren't protesting getting shot and assaulted by police and wanting people to recognize their lives matter.

Never really thought about it but it is weird how there are light-skinned black people but a darker-skinned Indian wouldn't be considered "black". Language and its little quirks, eh?

If you want to be really specific, you could say "People-of-predominantly-African-decent-living-in-America" but from an anthropology standpoint, that's technically everyone in America.
Fanny Himmlegold - Wed, 30 Aug 2017 13:45:04 EST C55TPusg No.208413 Reply
>Never really thought about it but it is weird how there are light-skinned black people but a darker-skinned Indian wouldn't be considered "black"

Yeah and what about the words themselves now that we're at it? They're not fucking black, they're brown. And we're pink. And asian people aren't yellow, they're fucking pale. Is this a Reservoir Dogs kind of deal? Black people don't want to be associated with shit and white people don't want to be associated with femininity?

But imagine if we stuck to actual fact, and used the correct words. We would have to learn the name of all the different shades of brown and pink, it would be an artistic revolution, and no one would get offended by being pointed out with chromatic precision.. I mean that takes effort, some kind of care, way more than just saying black like a slobbering dichromatic retard.

Plus, racists would be confused as fuck. Oh you hate brown people? Yeah fuck them.. Wait do you mean seal brown or burnt umber? Fuck you, you burnt umber lover! Only seal brown allowed here! Ah what the fuck did I expect from a champagne pink motherfucker. Sieg heil for baby pinks and seal browns! Fuck every other shade!
Jack Semmerway - Sat, 02 Sep 2017 22:26:38 EST 8gq7GAVV No.208415 Reply
Actually, white people are just pale brown. Sit in the sun long enough and any white person will turn brown eventually.

Even Kirt.
Reuben Lightman - Mon, 18 Sep 2017 17:46:34 EST +oDzYIVl No.208421 Reply
this is an issue that has been plaguing me lately.

Spent about two weeks in a psychiatric hospital. The second day there was a massive rift over racism that had been going on since before i was there and a big fight. The whole thing eventually led to me publicly crying for the rest of the day.

Was made even more ironic when i overheard slashed guess the white guy who shared my first name as a spanish speaker and it turns out he did speak spanish. I sort of assumed the casual informality he may have employed using the n word from his spanish expertise and internet ethos leading to an open conflict that basically led to a two week moment to moment suspense of racism, after i had already been struggling with it since 2016 when another friend tried to call a black friend the n word in a role play excercise for a movie we were filming in character and then got slapped in character.

So aside from affecting the safe explorative space of the creative rainbow it's entered into my mental health recovery as well.

We don't get race in america if were calling something the dreamer act that advocates deporting parents of kids who grew up in america.

White people never get how perception is actually there and act like politics and the world we see in the news and on screen is a million miles away and we can't apply ourselves or have it apply to us.
Martin Chicklebodging - Wed, 20 Sep 2017 18:53:01 EST OXdy4bB0 No.208423 Reply
I' m trying to understand your post, but it's so incoherent. What does "slashed guess" mean?

> We don't get race in america if were calling something the dreamer act that advocates deporting parents of kids who grew up in america.

The DREAMer Act isn't advocating deporting children of illegals; it was an act Obama instated to prevent that very occurrence. Pay better attention to politics if you're going to post about it.

> White people never get how perception is actually there and act like politics and the world we see in the news and on screen is a million miles away and we can't apply ourselves or have it apply to us.

I'm glad you speak for ALL white people...
Doris Debblebock - Thu, 21 Sep 2017 17:06:16 EST +oDzYIVl No.208426 Reply
it's discussing deporting the parents as of last week. Which is why i'm dealing with it this week.

It's quite possible that i can refer to any thing with people and be excluded from discussion even if i am white.

This is what i would refer to as the problem of losing perception.

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