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Harm Reduction Notes for the COVID-19 Pandemic

Always a good time.

- Thu, 20 Feb 2020 04:47:54 EST q3iN/lcG No.901678
File: 1582192074944.jpg -(158986B / 155.26KB, 1080x1080) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. Always a good time.
Is there any experienced users here who have never had a bad trip?

I've used psychedelics somewhere close to 100 times now and have never had a bad trip. Is this unusual?
Mr_Shawmeen - Thu, 20 Feb 2020 08:44:20 EST Q2AneLZx No.901679 Reply
I'm in the "there's no bad trips, just occasional difficult ones" cause after enough high doses you'll eventually hit a wall of sorts. It's after that collision when you're putting yourself back together is what's really telling. Good, bad, neutral, beautiful, hideous and everything inbetween are perspectives and likely all states of being you'll experience through a good hard trip.
Fiend !!1C9jE+w+ - Thu, 20 Feb 2020 11:54:59 EST QCTrk9lH No.901680 Reply
I tend to be of this mindset. I've had plenty trips that put me through the intergalactic wringer, and usually come out of it pretty stoked on life. But having seen someone have a psychotic break and talking to them about it afterwards, it's hard for me and was impossible for them, to spin that as anything but a "bad trip." It comes down to the user. If I can come away from the trip with something valuable I consider it time well spent, but others might not find the value that I do.

It's like pain tolerance. Different people have levels of pain tolerance, but it also depends on the type of pain. Skateboarders get used to the specific type of pain that comes from a board to the shins. It still hurts but it becomes part of the process, and after 100 times it's not surprising. A rough trip is like a board to the shins. It hurts, but if you want to kickflip the universe it's gonna happen. If you're not trying to kickflip the universe though I can see why that pain would be a real turn off.
George Cimmerstat - Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:58:43 EST c3gflUrd No.901682 Reply
Where there's angels there's demons. Where there's demon's there's angels. They're just not always as easy to spot
Awe' !!Bwteoy2D - Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:23:33 EST EVGq6g0p No.901693 Reply
1582316613621.jpg -(73401B / 71.68KB, 960x720) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
Yeah, after particularly strong trips it is usually very obvious that they are so out there that whatever positive or negative feelings you assign to them is just trying to stuff a 3d object into 2d. Even if for example your life turns to shit after such a trip and the trip itself is eerily dark, when those trips hit a high enough note it's like it doesn't matter whether you label it negatively or positively, cause the trip itself is so much more than whatever meaning you may assign to it form the earthly perspective that even if you label it as a bad trip your label is so arbitrary compared to the actual thing that even if it was actually a bad trip your stupid ass reasons to label it as such make the label itself equally trivial. After such trips you usually don't rush to label them neither, but at least I tend to marvel at the mind blowing awe for as long as I still have the traces in my mind... Seriously I've had one trip that was by most people's standards probably a catastrophic one and when I came back, first of all I couldn't believe that normal reality is still possible, but after that I was so shocked about what happened that I didn't have time to consider whether it was good or bad. It was be all end all and it was powerful, so powerful that it almost didn't matter if it was a good time or a bad time, so enchanting it was, that the more important thought was "whoa, I can't believe such things exist, moreover I can't believe I am still aware of the journey while simultaneously aware of human life as well" instead of "ok here are some things, I wonder if they are good or bad..." Kind of beyond good and evil after a certain level, or maybe they aren't beyond that, but nevertheless they are so beyond in other ways, that it becomes difficult to categorize them in that way as well. But really it's not categorizing it in those terms that immediately occupies your mind, rather it's the mind blowing contrasts and possibilities.

And anyway, I've never had a bad or difficult trip which didn't have positivity in it and it's your choice to decide which parts are the major and the important ones.

Tl;dr I really think it's purely your choice to label an experience as positive or negative regardless if it was preferred or not. Same experience has many angles to be looked upon, always.
Awe' !!Bwteoy2D - Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:29:51 EST EVGq6g0p No.901694 Reply
>It's like pain tolerance. Different people have levels of pain tolerance, but it also depends on the type of pain. Skateboarders get used to the specific type of pain that comes from a board to the shins. It still hurts but it becomes part of the process, and after 100 times it's not surprising. A rough trip is like a board to the shins. It hurts, but if you want to kickflip the universe it's gonna happen. If you're not trying to kickflip the universe though I can see why that pain would be a real turn off.
Haha, that's a great way to put it. I suppose I do sugar coat my bad trips, but I'm also not bothered by them apart from the difficulties in the moment which one may regard as some sort of mental fortitude training or something. I'm pretty sure even that torment that happens sometimes on the trippers playlist has positive effects. ESPECIALLY if you label it as positive. Like for example giving the valuable perspective to realize how trivial most problems in daily life actually are... I honestly think it's all good. I just tell myself something like "Oh it's the wise mushrooms giving me some sweet sweet tough love of theirs". Diff folks diff strokes, it's all good.
Sidney Naggleworth - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 16:09:36 EST ec3bJ1cB No.901730 Reply
I've read many lsd 'bad' trip reports and i dont mean to sound patronizing but they are not genuinely bad trips or not what i experienced and consider a bad trip.
On my 2nd ever lsd trip i took 1 tab and my friend had the same tab and was ok, after about 6 hours into the trip it all went wrong. Why? I do not know.

First sign something wasn't right was seeing evil faced 'men' when i closed my eyes. I tried to eat some bread and chewed and my swallowing reflex was gone
Then it just hit me, bam. It was pure fucking terrifying horror. I did not realise i could feel like it it was nothing like i'd experienced before. And it was physical also not just mental. I felt such a rush of adrenaline to my head or something i could not stop running around and my heart rate went ballistic and i pissed myself. Everything in my vision went on a 45 degree angle. I thought car headlights were eyes judging me as they knew i was on drugs i got ultra paranoid.

This went on for a few hours until i went to bed at about 8am. As soon as i woke up i went into the same state but only about 25% as bad but bad enough. I ended up having doctor prescribed therapy to learn relaxation techniques which normalized me after about 4 weeks of it

I wouldn't take lsd again if you offered me a hundred thousand dollars.
Clara Hinnerwitch - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 17:31:02 EST o/OnKyOL No.901732 Reply
I was once one of you "no such thing as a bad trip" folks. I used to have challenging trips and say how they were actually good because they were learning experiences and showed me something valuable despite not being positive in the classical meaning of the word. And I meant it, too.

However, a trip I had around 3 years ago filled me with such terror and dread and was so devoid of meaning that I understood the term bad trip for the first time. It wasn't like the trips I had before, where I was forced to face a harsh truth about myself or the nature of the universe or was having flashbacks of traumatizing moments from my life. This went so much deeper yet at the same time the experience felt very void, empty. Like myself and the things around me didn't actually exist. It was pure, unadulterated terror for terror's sake. Not a result of some obvious source, just a sudden overload of terror with no cause, which ironically made it worse because at least knowing the cause of your terror eliminates the fear of the unknown. Things were looking menacing, quite literally everything had a malign, sinister intelligence to it, but there was never a concrete source of danger. I felt I was being toyed with by forces far beyond my comprehension. Like a rug being pulled from under me and evil, unheard voices laughing at my naivety for believing the 20 odd years of my life were actually real. I was a puppet under the control of a force that can only be felt but not seen or heard. The laughs were metaphorical in nature but I understood I was being ridiculed. The forces had absolute, omnipotent control to the point of being able to implant thoughts and memories in my brain and as hard as I fought it, I was forced to think thoughts and remember memories that were not mine, but I felt them as if they were mine.

Truly without a doubt the worst moments in my life. I was in actual life-threatening situations before and the terror came nowhere near the terror felt during this trip. The grief of losing loved ones, the pain of breaking up after years of a loving relationship, I have felt these things and I would rather go through those experiences again than return to the state of mind I was in during my bad trip even for mere minutes. I was shaken to the core and still think about the experience nearly every day. The ability of the human mind to even experience these sort of states is deeply frightening. Seeing as I've gone through extreme physical pain, life threatening situations, grief and heartbreak and never felt anything close to these levels of the worst emotions, it's gotten me thinking that the human brain has evolved to feel much, much worse things than can be caused by external sources. This is what I imagine hell to be. Your brain's capacity to feel every negative emotion turned to 11.
Awe' !!Bwteoy2D - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 18:20:36 EST EVGq6g0p No.901734 Reply
What you are saying is that in your opinion there exist things in the universe that have no inherent value to them which is quite unintuitive IMO. First of all everything is made of the same clay which gives everything the same two polarities as everything else and if you look at the ying yang there are the dots in the centers of those two of the other polarity which to me says that one is a gateway to the other. Anyway again it's just a choice to believe what you believe about it and the results you reap from it shall be reflective of your choice of perspective on it. You will scratch your head for eternity "how could I have been so utterly blind and ignorant to see such a massive benefit in plain sight" when you finally discover it in regards to this situation. I've had some unpleasant and unsettling things happen to me as well and even though I may not like to dwell on it, I know pretty well how valuable the experience was and how lucky I am to have had it.

Don't you think that a certain amount of darkness gives birth simultaneously to an equal amount of light? Do you think a request can exist without the thing that is requested? Do you think there are crests without troughs? up without down? tall without short?

Nigga please, you just believe what you do because your belief system tells you that you are better off believing that way, never mind that it's your choice to do so, never mind that you shall reap as you sow.
Hamilton Goodfoot - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 19:11:15 EST o/OnKyOL No.901740 Reply
>Don't you think that a certain amount of darkness gives birth simultaneously to an equal amount of light?

No I know what you're saying, I know the good can't exist without the bad, you wouldn't be aware of the ups without the downs, the polarity and contrast is what gives everything meaning, it's an age old concept and looking at life this way has helped my general outlook on life. However, with particular experiences, the only good thing about them is them ending. Sure, the experience I just talked about made me appreciate my normal state of mind and regaining my sanity after a few hours of total madness was a beautiful moment. But I didn't necessarily need that reminder. I knew that my normal life was pretty great without having to experience hell first in order to see the contrast, if that makes sense.

Like I said, I've already had plenty of experiences that some would deem bad trips that I considered ultimately positive because they made me face some of my problems and relive moments that I had pushed into my subconscious and that I needed some closure on. These experiences were unpleasant but ultimately positive. Then there's the other kind of trip which I've had only once, where there is no lesson to be learned, nothing constructive to start practicing as part of your life after the experience. The way you seem to think of things, any negative experience can be spun into a positive one with some mental gymnastics, therefore negative experiences don't even exist, apparently. People who claim to have negative experiences are just people who are too blind to see that their experience wasn't actually negative. The problem with that though, is that you don't get to decide if someone had a negative experience or not. If someone claims a certain experience was bad and they would not want to repeat it, clearly they know better than you that the experience was negative for them.

Analogies are flawed by nature, but here's a movie analogy for you - there are movies that deal with extremely unpleasant topics and that are difficult to watch because of their heavy subject matter, but watching it is a valuable experience because it provokes thought and discussion about the presented themes. And then there's just shit movies. Movies with no message, no entertainment value, no merit whatsoever that are a complete waste of 2 hours. Now perhaps in your way of thinking, there's no such thing as a shitty movie and the fact that I would call a movie shitty is just a result of the powers that be programming my belief systems into what they are or whatever. But if that's what you think there's simply a fundamental disagreement in the way we see things. There are many experiences that I would rather not go through. In fact, being unconscious is a better alternative to many experiences I can think up right now, bad trips included.
Nathaniel Shittingway - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 20:47:04 EST Pup/ATI8 No.901744 Reply

I've had that trip before, in addition to the laughs it sounded like three or four phones were ringing all at the same time.

I sometimes get reminded of it when I'm driving and someone swerves into my lane and I get real to close to crashing. For that brief moment there is this sudden brief spike in terror/panic - that's what the trip was like. That intense panic but it lasted for a lonnnng time.
Hannah Hibberfodge - Mon, 24 Feb 2020 05:38:01 EST c+ot2hXd No.901752 Reply
I have had an experience very similar to this. I think it's really important to understand that if you present the mind with stimulation that it is not use to dealing with or understand that it can just jump immidiatly into terror/fear.
Augustus Feffingwater - Mon, 24 Feb 2020 06:05:10 EST IvOInNBn No.901755 Reply
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My first few trips were really bad times, because I realized oh shit I'm almost 30 with no degree, no friends, no girlfriend, little career direction, I jerk off 3 times a day and I'm addicted to video games and sugar and potato chips etc. WEW that was a bad time! Tripping even on low doses really helped me see this stuff, a single trip was more useful than dozens of psychotherapist sessions.
Fanny Trotham - Mon, 24 Feb 2020 08:21:33 EST LywZUfmH No.901757 Reply
Did homegrown shrooms on average monthly/bimonthly for about 7 years, along with occasional some 2C-B or LSA in there.

Never a bad trip. Only a handful of difficult trips. And most of that difficulty came from confusion (I really hate it when I'm dipping in heavy doses and I see no difference between CEV's and OEV's) or physical uncomfort (when I'm too lazy to make tea and just eat a fuckton of shrooms).

A difficult trip that stood out was seeing myself as an mathematical equation, and being unable to solve myself. Also my accidental consumption of a shroom tea made with an unknown amount of shrooms (between 10-20g possibly more, due to messing up with the tare weight), the trip itself was a breeze for something so heavy, but it was pretty tricky to stay calm during the comeup, because I was already experiencing timeloops at 15 minutes in the comeup.

At the beginning of my shroom tripping I did have a few scares with "salvia land" encroaching on my shroomy hallucinations. A harsh jagged orange angled light creeping in, very reminicent to the visual aspects of the salvia trip. That took me a few months to get over it. But it'd be a scare, and then sink away.
Phineas Pockson - Mon, 24 Feb 2020 21:05:22 EST o/OnKyOL No.901779 Reply
>For that brief moment there is this sudden brief spike in terror/panic - that's what the trip was like. That intense panic but it lasted for a lonnnng time.

This is exactly it. I had this thought while writing that post but forgot to include it. It's like that one extremely intense moment of panic you get in dangerous situations that usually lasts for a fraction of a second before your brain goes into a fight or flight response, but prolonged over hours. It felt like I had just slipped into insanity and would keep falling deeper and deeper into it, but every moment was the moment of realization that this has just happened. It's like certain aspects of time itself stopped but others kept moving.

I agree, and this helped me when I mustered the courage to go back into high dose experiences again. Even though things were getting out of control in very similar ways as when my bad trip happened, I was able to remind myself that I had actually lived through it before and that the sense of danger was in my head. It wasn't completely unfamiliar territory anymore. This doesn't eliminate the mindfuck but it keeps it at a level where it is not only manageable, but even enjoyable. The sense of being at the edge of madness but not slipping over it is amazing, and it is at this edge that some of my most amazing psychedelic experiences have happened.

An interesting thing to note was that I had very brief moments of clarity during my bad trip where I would realize that everything was actually alright, but this would last for mere seconds before I would collapse back into a terrified, panicked state. I actually completely forgot these moments after the trip but my friends told me I had mumbled about "checkpoints". I would only remember what this meant when I took LSD again months after the bad trip. The "checkpoints" were a way for me to try and anchor myself in reality because I could feel the waves of insanity and terror pulling me back in. The checkpoints were my attempt to remind myself that I was looping between this semi-sane state and madness without actually being physically harmed. It eventually helped after an hour or two in a sort of limbo state. But when it really helped was during subsequent trips when I would again find myself at the verge of insanity and would remember my checkpoints. It's a way for me to tell myself that I can safely let go and that I will (most likely) come out fine the other side. In a sense it felt like past me looking out for present me by setting up this whole checkpoint thing and letting me enjoy subsequent trips. It gave my individual trips a feeling of interconnections and continuity, like there's an overarching trip which my trips are just small parts of. I guess Awe is now gonna say how this is proof that the trip was actually positive in the long run if he reads this, but I would have much preferred it if I never had to go through that.

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