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Harm Reduction Notes for the COVID-19 Pandemic

The Fabled Thumprint Dose

- Sat, 22 Feb 2020 16:08:15 EST pC2cOyEY No.901706
File: 1582405695685.jpg -(91398B / 89.26KB, 720x720) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. The Fabled Thumprint Dose
Are any of you crazy bastards crazy enough to embark on such a journey? I've read reports of it being basically the ultimate act of submission to the psychedelic state, and that people trip for like a week at a time and that they never truly come back down from it.

I can't remember who said it, but I remember a quote from someone saying something along the lines of "it's like a taindrop falling toward a lake. The raindrops entire life leads up to dropping into the lake, and once it does, there's no more drop. Only lake". That sounds like an absolutely transcendental experience to me. One I'm not sure I could ever commit to. You basically have to completely submit your life to the universe and totally surrender to the will of causality. Some pretty profound shit. I'm sure you'd have some pretty gnarly HPPD afterward too, akin to being on two hits all the time.

Anyway, what say you? Have any of you here done it? Any heroic doses close to a thumbprint or similar? Is it worth it to any of you? Why do it?

>pic kinda related
Terror Incognito - Sat, 22 Feb 2020 16:56:28 EST LyEK70KW No.901709 Reply
1582408588904.jpg -(50895B / 49.70KB, 720x546) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.

LSD. I probably should have included that in my OP but I figured most people here would know what I was talking about.
Awe' !!Bwteoy2D - Sat, 22 Feb 2020 17:02:28 EST EVGq6g0p No.901710 Reply
Welcome to psy, a place where people have barely ever tripped.
Terror Incognito - Sat, 22 Feb 2020 17:06:06 EST LyEK70KW No.901712 Reply
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You'd think most people on this board would be more experienced with psychedelics.
Augustus Drodgedock - Sat, 22 Feb 2020 19:47:45 EST CqAPKyBE No.901713 Reply

Every online hub dedicated to psychedelics is full of people who don't seem to have ever tripped bickering over nonsense


Imprecise dosing is inherently frightening IMO
Mr_Shawmeen - Sat, 22 Feb 2020 20:10:11 EST O61PecZf No.901716 Reply
I think in the case of a thumbprint it wouldn't matter. Also I don't think it would be all its cracked up to be. When you consider that tolerance takes only one dose to build and it has an elimination half life of 175 minutes even if you took more than usual for something like that it would still eventually level out. At the peak I imagine it's probably more of a catatonic state or blackout and really only the comedown would be interesting. I was listening to the story of a guy who accidentally to about 90 hits at once and it was mostly a catatonic state then coming to for a while as he tripped his balls off.

From personal experience with things like very VERY hugh doses of ayahuasca or similarly high doses of potent mushrooms I can tell you up to a point its almost just a blackout and bits of coming to with periods of trippyness. I vividly remember finding a mirror and touching my face on the come down not really recognizing "me" anymore and crying for finally being home again. Anything up to a point or past that point will be enough to just put you out for a while.
Terror Incognito - Sat, 22 Feb 2020 20:19:59 EST 4IMrH9Bc No.901717 Reply
1582420799145.jpg -(29630B / 28.94KB, 720x960) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.

Damn, 90 hits? Assuming each hit is 100 micrograms, that dude took 9 mg. I bet he was a pretty changed person after that. I can't even imagine taking a dose like that, let alone a thumnprint
Mr_Shawmeen - Sat, 22 Feb 2020 23:22:09 EST O61PecZf No.901720 Reply
Knowing them it was probably more like 150ug or more per hit. As for whether or not he was changed I doubt it impacted him in the least. He said he saw god and described it as a geometric figure and then there was other basic trip land nonsense. He had in the past abused just about every drug you can imagine whith a penchant for psychedelics, dissociatives, and coke/crack.
Terror Incognito - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 07:30:14 EST EPbpJmPQ No.901721 Reply

Well either way, it sounds like a pretty nuts experience. Personally, I've never gone over 400 micrograms of LSD and even that was almost too intense for me. That being said, I've taken upwards of 7 grams of mushrooms before and been fine. I've done up to 100 mg of DMT as well as tons of 1200 mg DXM trips. For some reason, LSD just hits me harder than any drug.
Mr_Shawmeen - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 10:16:41 EST O61PecZf No.901722 Reply
With the mushrooms it depends. Everyone thinks that penis envy is super strong but that's only true for cyanescens. I have read if cubes are picked right before the veil fully breaks or very shortly thereafter that they're at their most potent then. I have noticed that the intensity goes up a lot at doses like 12g. With juremahuasca I've ingested anywhere from 1.5g of root bark up to 45ish and it was good and potent as well.

So when you did that amount of DXM did you use any potentiaters? When I did 1350mg I downed 6 cups of grapefruit juice and took a benadryl and it was more intense than my 1200, 1400, and 1450 doses by a good fair bit.
Terror Incognito - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 11:06:56 EST EPbpJmPQ No.901723 Reply

No potentiators, but I did stagger my dosage because of DXM being a self potentiator and all. I did have a tolerance though, so I was only ever able to reach a high third plateau. Fourth plateau has always been pretty elusive to me because I've always had a tolerance to DXM since I was like 17 years old. I wanna hit fourth plateau sometime. I've read trip reports about it and they've made it so enticing.
Fiend !!1C9jE+w+ - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 11:15:30 EST d5qCJ4uT No.901724 Reply
Highest I've ever gone with a lysergamide was 100mg Memantine + 5oz Delsym (888mg DXM polistirex) + 1200µg ETH-LAD. Definitely worth it for me. I'd say I was pretty much lake, but the lake was math. And I don't exactly have HPPD from that, I came down, but I never came back. You can't unsee that shit. And then it's always just in the background. I can live but every now and then, especially if I trip again (at any dose) it's like "hey remember the functions?"

I don't think I'll ever come across crystal LSD but I'd like to one day buy a vial and drink the whole thing.
Terror Incognito - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 11:48:43 EST EPbpJmPQ No.901725 Reply
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Jesus, man. That sounds absolutely insane. Care to type up a report about it? Or maybe just go into a little more detail? I'm really really curious how immense doses of lysergamides go. How were the visuals? What were you thinking the whole time.

As for drinking an entire vial of LSD... boy that would he bonkers. I can't even imagine how absolutely mind shattering that would be. I know for sure you'd be gone for at least 3 or 4 days doing that. I don't think you'd ever come back from that either.

You could always try buying a vial from the darknet or go to a Grateful Dead show and score some good acid there. It would be super worth it either way.

As for finding crystal LSD.. it's possible. But really difficult to find. I've read that you have to be immersed in the "rainbow family" or whatever and the only way they'll let you handle crystal LSD is if you do a thumbprint yourself.
Fiend !!1C9jE+w+ - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 13:14:56 EST d5qCJ4uT No.901726 Reply
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The connect for the vial is not the problem. It's spending hundreds of dollars on a single trip. I've met people who handle multiple grams of crystal and lay blotter, but most of them wouldn't let anyone in the room with that shit unless you're family. Of the people I've talked to nobody has done a thumbprint as the rite of passage that is often described in the stories. Several have described drinking large amounts of liquid though.

As for my story, here's the TR I wrote at the time:
Consider the universe like this spiral. I would follow the spiral inward until I was the tiniest particle, then beyond that I was the singularity; and in turn I’d explode back to life as the entire world.

I saw the entire universe as 6 dimensional graph, with the origin being the singularity. All 6 dimensions spiraled all the way in, and all the way out to infinity.

As this repeated I realized the circular nature of it. Sliding down the line to the singularity leads right around to the all encompassing. And vis versa, as one slides away into space one inevitably comes to the smallest of points. Even the seemingly infinite spiral loops back upon itself, our universe, completely self contained.

I’ve explored the concept of the multiverse (and what it means for free will) on psychs before and this was a fabulous continuation of that despite not truly breaking through. I would be sitting in my bed, and be aware, but then suddenly I’d become re-aware of myself from 3 different directions, none of them part of our 3 dimensions. The awareness that I have no free will, and am just part of this massive ball of geometry/topology. Multiple versions of me were having the same realization during the same trip in other timelines and I could feel them collide as we became part of each other, which was part of everything else that was just part of the self contained spiral.

But if the singularity exists,I thought, it must exist everywhere. Any point in the universe is capable of creating a new spiral within itself. Consciousness gives us that ability, to train our focus, and find nuggets of truth hidden in anything and everything. We can spiral into the pages of a book or around a kitchen full of hot food and loved ones, go mad spiraling in on the tiniest fracture in the narrative, or fade so far off trying to grasp the grandest concepts. Either way brings one the edge of their conceivable universe.

At one point I split between timelines to ones that were far away from mine (because at this point I was pretty consistently living in at least 3 timelines at once), and briefly heard alien language echoing through the crack in the timeline. Despite barely being a language, almost a world with no sound, I could understand some of it. It came all garbled as something that was neither sound nor text but something in between; a thing which we have no name for in this world because it doesn't exist. The closest thing would be synesthesia. It didn't seem important though. It was simply beyond me. There were still some “words” I couldn't understand, as if there was something I wasn't supposed to know.

I thought of how people always say “why didn't I think of this before?” And the answer is “you already always will have thought of it.” It seemed extremely comical at the time. I examined how this spiral phenomenon applies to culture; how ideas resurface as the renaissance, the retro, but applicable once again. And the media, becoming more self aware to the point where TV commercials are trying to be meta with some “This is a cheeseburger– and this is an advertisement for one,” type horseshit.

Again the idea of free will came up, and the lack thereof paralyzed me. If I was nothing but geometry what good is anything? And in that moment with my eyes closed, while I was busy following every conceivable spiral, all perfectly recursive and predictable, a pink light exploded in my vision and shot from behind my eye sockets out into space. It was like lightning that created a gap in all the recursive spirals. The light was pure chaos, disrupting all natural order in its path. For a moment there was a wake behind it, a gap, and that’s where the hope was. As little free will as I think we have, I know that there is in fact something called magic, and we will never understand it. And that's the point.
Fiend !!1C9jE+w+ - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 13:21:24 EST Hiy3nwkK No.901727 Reply
I wrote that I didn't break through, but I think when I wrote that I had a more specific, tryptamine sense of what "breaking through" entails. This was more like "breaking out."
Awe' !!Bwteoy2D - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 14:43:35 EST EVGq6g0p No.901728 Reply
What was the effect of memantine in this combo. I find your description very interesting. Do you think you would have gotten the same math effect without the memantine?
Clara Hinnerwitch - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 18:12:37 EST o/OnKyOL No.901733 Reply
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Great report, I enjoy reading about your experience. I noticed many parallels to some of my own experiences and the realizations and visions I had. I just can't help but think it sounds relatively mild for the insane combination you took. Like, the fact that you were still able to relatively clearly think about "worldly" concepts like the media and culture is weird to me, but maybe that's just because I get overwhelmed by the chaos of the experience and am only able to perceive the "bigger picture" while many of the details are lost.

I've had a similar realization about the circular nature of the universe, how there are infinite versions of me going through the same experience and how the entire history of the universe has already happened, is happening, and is about to happen again, and again. I felt like a part of a huge chain of big bangs that start new universes, which then contract down to singularities again and rebound back into universes basically at the very moment they are crushed down to singularities. The singularity exists for an infinitesimally small amount of time, it's simply a rebound point. Maybe this is stupid but I made a little illustration in paint, pic related. I saw the universe as this never-ending chain of expansions and contractions and each point of maximum contraction and the beginning of a new expansion was a singularity. With every expansion the many parallel versions of the universe would branch off but then the contraction would pull them all back together again. I also felt like each of these parallel versions of the universe had a "frequency" assigned to them. These frequencies would make the universes go in and out of phase with each other. Like if you play 2 sounds at very slightly different frequencies (like 120 Hz and 120.1 Hz), the two sounds will slowly drift apart from each other and then come back together as their waves either cancel each other out or reinforce each other. This is as close of a metaphor I can find, but I felt like the parallel universes are able to interfere with each other when their phases are aligned, however with the drift between them being so slow, this would happen at time scales that are huge from the perspective of humans and these "intersections" of the universes would happen trillions of years apart.

But back to what I was saying, I've had similar experiences to yours, though probably less intense, on LSD alone, and a lot less than 1200ug of it. I haven't had experiences beyond the ~500ug range and that was enough to bring me to the states of mind described above, when combined with weed and lack of sleep, which I believe played a role.. I've read that there's a plateau of the effects you can experience and after a certain point taking more doesn't intensify the experience much but prologues it, though without experiences above 500ug, I can't say for myself. It's worth noting that I've generally had a much stronger reaction to the same doses than the friends I was taking them with, so perhaps I'm lucky enough to be more sensitive to psychedelics than the average person. I also never built much of a physical tolerance because I always spaced my trip at least a month or so apart, usually more.
Awe' !!Bwteoy2D - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 18:27:44 EST EVGq6g0p No.901736 Reply
I wouldn't bet on hitting psychedelic plateaus, not only because IME there is more and more [and I've gone pretty far], but also because you are kind of playing with the most valuable things you may not even know you have or that they can change their state. Your life, your sanity call it whatever you want but some such that we may take for granted and that really goes to the core of our beings. You don't bet on that, because you've never gone beyond a particular plateau or because someone told you that there are plateaus that cannot be gone beyond.. I subscribe to the idea that this is some mystical shit from the human life to existence itself, so if anything I assume the attitude of humble carefulness and respect.
Fiend !!1C9jE+w+ - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 19:52:54 EST Hiy3nwkK No.901743 Reply
Memantine is what I call a "springboard." At low-moderate doses it potentiates everything. I took the Memantine early, and when it peaked took the DXM so that it springs that much higher. Then when that was coming up I added the ETH-LAD so the whole thing fucking launched./i] Memantine has its own magic for sure, that absolutely sets the tone for the trip to come (I've done lots of Memantine /psy/ combos and several Memantine + DXM poli + /psy/ trips) and they are pretty reliably some of the most "mystical" experiences I've had, but I feel like the Memantine is just opening a channel, so to speak, that makes it easier for everything that comes after to blast that much harder.

I have a hard head for /psy/s and have a long built tolerance to /dis/. But still, at doses like that I was basically catatonic for a few hours, but every now and then, in those moments where everything would realign around me I would be back. And for a few seconds or a minute I would be able to think in words before getting whisked away. The media thought came near the end of the peak when those clear moments were coming more often and lasting longer. And that paragraph makes perfect sense. I could yellow text the whole thing, but basically– yeah.

I think the biggest plateau is memory. The higher you dose the more you'll forget. From the people I've talked to it seems like the higher the dose those moments of clarity in the catatonic state just get fewer and further between. IDK though. I'll get back to you when I have a 2+mg trip.
Terror Incognito - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 21:06:20 EST ApFsmew8 No.901745 Reply
I absolutely love the direction this thread is going in. I was hoping to view a deep discussion about these sort of experiences.


It's hard for me to properly articulate how much I love this trip report. I've always had a deep yearning to understand the innerworkings of the mathematical aspects of the universe, and it seems like you have a deep, though somewhat esoteric understanding of how it works. To a certain extent. It's really amazing that taking ludacris doses of hallucinogens can just fill you with that knowledge
Fiend !!1C9jE+w+ - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 21:15:24 EST Hiy3nwkK No.901746 Reply
> somewhat esoteric
That's an understatement. Lol.
> taking ludacris doses of hallucinogens can just fill you with that knowledge
It's not knowledge. It's myth. It's up to the user to decide if those are the same thing or not.
Terror Incognito - Sun, 23 Feb 2020 21:31:36 EST pdXwTEdW No.901747 Reply

Yeah you're right about that. I guess sometimes I take these sort of experiences a little too literally. I need to work on that lmao It's just such interesting stuff.
Awe' !!Bwteoy2D - Mon, 24 Feb 2020 07:05:55 EST EVGq6g0p No.901756 Reply
Well IME we are able to remember things so much further than I could have imagined is the limit of our memory, before I actually had those experiences and remembered them. When I came down to Earth after one of my biggest trips, the most astonishing thing for me was that I was just in the fucking core of the universe and what seemed like a moment later I am here as a human being again, as myself... This blew my mind the most when I came to. Not that those astonishing things exist, but the contrast... and the idea that I could somehow find my way home after that. Was a wild night. But yeah, it really astonishes me what kind of experiences can be contained in a human mind and then remembered. There was copious amounts of juremahuasca and cannabis in the mix, so maybe that's some part of the reason why even though I've had strong trips before, that one was particularly memorable. The cannabis works strongly on the hippocampus.

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