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Im motherfucking james randi

- Sun, 28 Dec 2014 23:23:45 EST o0w4X9KP No.66946
File: 1419827025939.jpg -(564500B / 551.27KB, 1099x1237) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. Im motherfucking james randi
There is no such things as ghosts, spirits, sorcery, magic, shadow people, psychics, wizards, witches, demons, specters, etc etc etc.

Albert Pockridge - Mon, 29 Dec 2014 01:41:43 EST AyahE28W No.66947 Reply
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You're goddamn right
Eliza Donderdadging - Mon, 29 Dec 2014 14:42:32 EST O1ovx4VS No.66951 Reply
I agree with you but James Randi is full of crap.
Shitting Bripperforth - Tue, 30 Dec 2014 06:59:25 EST rEg5t3ye No.66954 Reply
Don't need to. You'll figure it out eventually, probably long after you've died if you're that stubborn about it. Ghosts that won't accept their own death are the worst.
Augustus Huvinghall - Tue, 30 Dec 2014 10:10:04 EST o0w4X9KP No.66956 Reply
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So far no one has tried to prove me wrong.
Rebecca Smallhood - Tue, 30 Dec 2014 20:12:46 EST BCGdGCxE No.66960 Reply

Shhh it's okay, sleep, sleep. Only dreams now.
Betsy Bickleville - Sun, 04 Jan 2015 19:20:16 EST 8E/hPYt8 No.66981 Reply
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mfw OP is right
Lillian Sessletine - Mon, 05 Jan 2015 23:47:53 EST 6ZZRO0M/ No.66991 Reply
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Not knowing what shadow people are.
kek. Why would 3 dimension shadows even exist? hue hue
John Blatherwill - Thu, 08 Jan 2015 13:41:50 EST zyyk3s2S No.67020 Reply
The million dollar challenge is rigged. At first glance the rules of the test seem fair, until you realize that these rules are not shared by the preliminary test. In order to be officially tested, one must pass the preliminary test. That is where this magician's trick comes into play.

Randi has the ability to fail anybody in the preliminary tests, even if they are genuine. He reserves the right to change the agreed upon rules of the preliminary test mid-test. If he wishes, he can raise the bar until any applicant fails. Randi makes applicants agree to not sue him before the test.

The whole test is a pseudoskeptical circle jerk.
James Febberbudge - Thu, 08 Jan 2015 15:45:42 EST VPZF4uEP No.67021 Reply
Really? I've never seen that happen in any of the tests I've seen. Infact I don't think Randi even attended the tests I saw at the JREF. I think you're making that up.
Reuben Binkinsare - Thu, 08 Jan 2015 23:05:19 EST jV29qTby No.67025 Reply
>>66946 why are you so bothered by these things, opie? if they are so clearly fictious to you, who are you trying to convince in actuality? yeah, the answer is: you.
Fuck Crippersetch - Fri, 09 Jan 2015 02:54:12 EST raIJB3EI No.67026 Reply
Magick is the manipulation of consciousness though magical practices. It becomes a question of what real magick is not if magick is real.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Fri, 09 Jan 2015 14:47:10 EST o0w4X9KP No.67030 Reply
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Is you serious nigga? There is no such thing as magic.

It may seem rigged to plebs who believe in magic and then are shocked to see they can't get past the first level of the challenge.

>Magic still isn't real

Cornelius Banningcocke - Fri, 09 Jan 2015 21:56:12 EST B6MRFKVx No.67036 Reply
Maybe people are just having a little bit of fun...
Lydia Dunderville - Sat, 10 Jan 2015 00:31:10 EST BCGdGCxE No.67037 Reply

For someone who is convinced magic doesn't real Randi sure has a wizardly visage.

In before he is actually a level 500 warlock.
Lydia Dunderville - Sat, 10 Jan 2015 00:40:46 EST BCGdGCxE No.67038 Reply
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And by level 500 warlock I mean he is luring noobish neophytes who barely into magic onto his astral hunting ground where he harvests souls without pity.

James Randi casts Proof on Uri Geller
Uri Geller takes 1 million dollars I mean damage.
Uri Geller faints.
James Randi looted [Pathetic Spoon Shaped Soul of Uri Geller]
James Randi gained 9,000 reputation with [Skeptics Guild]
James Randi brushes up against Gary Spivey and farts loudly
Alice Murringdone - Sat, 10 Jan 2015 07:51:32 EST AvV5KjT3 No.67040 Reply
Well he was once the most famous stage magician in the world, this guy was Penn & Teller before Penn and Teller.
Matilda Murdstock - Sat, 10 Jan 2015 12:25:11 EST zq1lgzd0 No.67041 Reply
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>most famous stage magician in the world
>Not Houdini Poutine

You better watch your back
Hugh Sollybig - Sat, 10 Jan 2015 14:54:50 EST 3n5079ZW No.67043 Reply
Noumenon isn't real, prove me wrong.
David Dartwell - Sat, 10 Jan 2015 16:58:37 EST EgCoVGYv No.67044 Reply
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Samuel Panninghall - Fri, 16 Jan 2015 06:12:13 EST XcImaLSt No.67082 Reply
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No, he means magick with a k.
Magick is nothing compared to magycke.
Hugh Gubbleson - Sat, 17 Jan 2015 14:03:22 EST E8CLBUE/ No.67108 Reply
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Dear James Randi,

Big fan, bigger skeptic. But have you ever thought to yourself, "maybe these people are just having fun?" I'm sure some of them are truly delusional, but I bet a majority of people playing with magic and spells are just fool'n around. Sure it's dumb, but it just adds so much spice to people's lives, and maybe results in genuine happiness, I think that's a good thing.

yours truly,
Macaulay Culkin
Martha Ganderstock - Mon, 19 Jan 2015 12:23:51 EST MJODVKCH No.67130 Reply
I love how the home alone kid turned into The Dude
james randi - Mon, 19 Jan 2015 17:15:28 EST o0w4X9KP No.67132 Reply
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It leads to and encourages dangerous magical thinking.
Henry Drittingchare - Wed, 21 Jan 2015 09:20:46 EST cv8SV4qW No.67151 Reply
I never believed in shit until I watched some episodes of MTV Fear that I was too fuckin scared to watch as a kid

There's one episode about a haunted ship. They pick up some shit on thermal vision, and at one point a bunch of balls were rolling around on the ground by themselves. I think they were placed there to be creepy, but the way the moved, I can't come up with a logical explanation.

There was also a behind the scenes thing made about the show, and there was one episode they did in a prison, and in the episode they don't actually do any fucked up shit or even go to the most supposedly haunted parts of the jail, or stay overnight, which is the opposite of every other episode. Normally they go to a place where everyone died and perform a seance or stay there in silence for 10 hours or something. In the behind the scene show, the crew challenges one of the crew members to stay overnight before they do the real show. He agrees and does some fucked up shit, he went to death row and shouted haha you're all gonna die. Then shit started slamming. I don't remember if they got it on camera but he said the cell doors were slamming on their own. He said he was pushed, and that's when he ran the fuck out of there and didn't stay the night. Someone also got pushed when they were first setting stuff up, so they took a picture with the guy standing right where he got pushed and there was some shit behind him.

There was also another episode where a door got stuck, and I don't quite remember why but it didn't make sense. I think it just wasn't locked. But it was not moving at all, which is typical ghost shenanigans.

I suppose most of that could be faked one way or another but the one I can't explain is the balls moving around on the floor on their own. There was also a lot of other creepy shit they didn't get but was creepy as fuck. One episode a chick was hardly out the door before she said she saw a floating head in the woods and quit on the spot.

I think the idea of ghosts is pretty fucking stupid but I still get scared shitless a lot, however I've never seen or heard anything even remotely supernatural. I think someone needs to investigate those balls though.
Matilda Femmerman - Wed, 21 Jan 2015 09:48:42 EST RMvE/68e No.67152 Reply
isn't the burden of proof on the one making the claim, doesn't he have to prove that there are, without a shred of doubt, no ghosts?
james randi - Wed, 21 Jan 2015 20:18:27 EST o0w4X9KP No.67155 Reply
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>I watched some episodes of MTV Fear
Mtv is not a credible or reliable source of information on this topic.
There are lots of exposes out there on those ghost hunter type tv shows. They are all staged for the benefit of bringing viewers.

The short of this whole thread is that if you apply the scientific method to any claims of the supernatural you will see that none of the claims about any thing supernatural are true.
james randi - Wed, 21 Jan 2015 20:21:32 EST o0w4X9KP No.67156 Reply
sorry for the weird phrasing at the end. I'm drunk
Cedric Sunningcheck - Tue, 10 Feb 2015 14:43:25 EST epQV4WYD No.67331 Reply
Dont worry about it OP. This board is full of lunatics loosing their mind too weed and hallucinogens.
Isabella Siffingworth - Tue, 10 Feb 2015 22:12:34 EST zxbLVK7p No.67334 Reply

narrow-minded faggot with a narrow consciousness detected
Archie Mandlebon - Wed, 11 Feb 2015 08:52:09 EST yBnagp0S No.67336 Reply
Yeah, everyone knows you have to accept dubious bullshit without evidence to be truly open minded. And if you accept when it's proven wrong you're a quitter. Testimonials are the only truly valid scientific evidence.
Evil Weevil - Wed, 11 Feb 2015 15:20:06 EST bI9B93LP No.67341 Reply
>if you apply the scientific method to any claims of the supernatural

Have you ever considered that the scientific method can't explain everything?
Emma Gommlehall - Wed, 11 Feb 2015 16:00:07 EST rpFSlSpv No.67342 Reply
It has explained more in the past 100 years than anything else has in the whole of human history.
Evil Weevil - Wed, 11 Feb 2015 21:07:13 EST bI9B93LP No.67348 Reply
I'm finding it hard to respond to the pure ignorance of your statement.

So you were around for the entirety of human history to know that to be true? That's like a Christian thinking the bible has explained more in the last 2000 years than anything before or since. Is it not just telling of someone who's been around within the last hundred years that would think that way? I guess it's easy to think you know better than our ancestors since they can't prove otherwise because theyre, you know, dead.

I get the impression that you know a decent amount about modern scientific discoveries but relatively fuck all about ancient discoveries. Knowledge goes in cycles, things are learned and then forgotten, and usually what is accepted as a good explanation today will be regarded as inadequate tomorrow, as I'm pretty sure current mainstream scientific thought will be thought of in the future.

Go and read some ancient literature, you might be surprised at how much they knew. People in the past weren't stupid, they had the capacity to know as much as we do now (if anything I would say that now we have even less capacity to explain things clearly thanks to all the bullshit that's developed in the last 100 years).
George Secklespear - Wed, 11 Feb 2015 21:38:46 EST rpFSlSpv No.67349 Reply
>I guess it's easy to think you know better than our ancestors since they can't prove otherwise because theyre, you know, dead.
Well I was actually thinking of the fact that our ancestors left things behind which told us how they thought and how they lived. Pictures, writings, buildings, artefacts, tapestries, inscriptions, etc. All just left for hundreds or sometimes thousands of years.

If you honestly did not know this, here is a link to get you started on the subject:

>Knowledge goes in cycles
I am most interested in how you think you can support this statement.

>things are learned and then forgotten
As far as scientific progress goes, only a few things were forgotten and these things were later rediscovered.

>usually what is accepted as a good explanation today will be regarded as inadequate tomorrow, as I'm pretty sure current mainstream scientific thought will be thought of in the future
A lot of what we believe now will be replaced with superior, more accurate beliefs in the future. That is an argument FOR science, not against it.

>Go and read some ancient literature, you might be surprised at how much they knew
How about you find me an ancient text that explains calculus, or how electricity works, or how particle physics works, or how mitosis works?

Why do you think most ancient beliefs are not longer held? Don't you think the fact that the majority of them were proven to be false means something?
If not for the scientific method, how would we have been able to know what was false? What exactly is your alternative?
Evil Weevil - Thu, 12 Feb 2015 10:43:54 EST bI9B93LP No.67356 Reply
Don't patronise me, I studied archaeology at uni, it is my main subject of expertise you know. And one thing that I know about archaeology is that it gives us a very limited picture of the past, most of what people thought or made is completely unknown. Are you seriously saying that archaeology can tell us what people thought throughout all periods of history? Yeah to a certain degree we can see the results of what they wanted to do through what they've left behind, but their personal philosophies are generally a mystery, aside from some information that has survived, but even then it's only a fragment of the full picture. There is also the bias of history (that is, a written record) since we can only see things from the perspective of literate cultures. How can you say that the majority of past philosphies have been proven false when we don't even know what many of them were?

See, you obviously see time as linear, where we gradually progress from a state of ignorance through time and become more enlightened as time goes on. I find this hard to believe since a species that is now destroying the earth at an astonishing rate and has an accelerating population that the planet won't be able to sustain isn't good evidence that we are getting smarter, in fact because of the disconnection of modern humans from nature I would argue that we are generally less intelligent and aware of our surroundings than people have been in the past. I see time as cyclical, as history obviously shows. Civilisations rise and fall, beliefs come and go. This isn't evidence of old beliefs being discarded because they've been proven wrong, this is a to and fro between different ways humans think.

>a few things were forgotten and these things were later rediscovered.

Thanks for proving my point. Knowledge goes in cycles if things have to be rediscovered.


Here is a list of some early technology that was being developed as precursors to modern technology and are some of the most valuable archaeological finds. Modern science has given us the means to fully develop these things, but since the ideas were there in the first place, this hardly means that they knew less than us.

>A lot of what we believe now will be replaced with superior, more accurate beliefs in the future.

I know that this argues for science, but does that not also mean that you can't say for certain that science is always right, since this highlights the limitations of science itself. Let me make it clear than I'm not 'anti-science', the scientific method is a good way of getting an idea of how things work based on observation and one of the best aspects of science is the idea that ideas can be replaced and modified if new evidence comes along. However, I find it hard to take it seriously when people can't see outside of the scientific perspective, it becomes a new infallible truth and anything that works in a different way is dismissed just because it doesn't fit neatly within scientific thought.

>If not for the scientific method, how would we have been able to know what was false?

Are you saying that humans are so inept that without this method we would have no other way of understanding anything? Please. The scientific method is good for explaining material things, that is what is immediate to us and what is tangible. It is notoriously hopeless when it comes to thinking outside of ourselves and explaining supernatural phenomena. So lets say that James Randi is right, does that explain why people believe in these things in the first place? What possible evolutionary advantage does seeing things that aren't real have? My main beef with modern science is the arrogance, the assertion that it can explain everything and that everything else is somehow false. You limit yourself when you only use science, you don't get the full picture. In essence, it's having too much 'faith' in science as the one truth, just like any religious fanatic would claim the same about their faith. Ideally science and spirituality should work together rather than trying to prove each other wrong, but most people aren't willing to do that, so we end up with conflict and people having the audacity to discredit other people's personal experiences just because they can't be tested in a scientific way. Similarly, this bias towards thinking that the modern world is superior to the past is poisonous, and gives us no sense of humility and acknowledgement of limitations. Ancient beliefs are no longer held because people who benefit from material gain (accumulation of wealth, development of technology) are only able to become as rich as they are when everybody believes that the material world is all there is.

"As our circle of knowledge explands, so does the circumferance of darkness surrounding it."

-Albert Einstein
George Secklespear - Thu, 12 Feb 2015 17:17:15 EST rpFSlSpv No.67361 Reply
>Don't patronise me, I studied archaeology at uni
So you were pretending to be wholly ignorant of it? Why?

>How can you say that the majority of past philosphies have been proven false
I guess I thought it was implicit that I was referring to the majority of known ancient philosophies.

>See, you obviously see time as linear
There's certainly nothing indicating that it isn't.

>where we gradually progress from a state of ignorance through time and become more enlightened as time goes on
That appears to be the trend, yes.

>I find this hard to believe since a species that is now destroying the earth at an astonishing rate and has an accelerating population that the planet won't be able to sustain isn't good evidence that we are getting smarter, in fact because of the disconnection of modern humans from nature I would argue that we are generally less intelligent
You have just moved the goalposts. You have shifted the topic from "Is science explaining the world to us" to "Are human beings more intelligent now or not".

Either way, the fact that ancient people were unable to destroy the earth doesn't make them more intelligent. Sheep can't destroy the earth either, we don't call them "wise".

>I see time as cyclical, as history obviously shows. Civilisations rise and fall, beliefs come and go
Human civilisation isn't so old that we can't see roughly what they were building. And the fact is, ancient civilisations did not build advanced infrastuctures, or giant buildings made of steel and glass, or machines that performed nuclear fission. Those things would be simple to find if they had existed.

>Here is a list of some early technology
Yeah, you definitely did not study archeology at a real university if you're throwing up creationist myths to defend your point

>anything that works in a different way is dismissed just because it doesn't fit neatly within scientific thought.
You really have no idea what you're saying. If something can be shown to "work" in a way other than how it is understood to work by scientists, they just adapt that. If they were in the business of "dismissing" as you say, we'd have never discovered the atom.

>Are you saying that humans are so inept that without this method we would have no other way of understanding anything
If humans back then had understood what we know today, why did they ignore all of it?

>It is notoriously hopeless when it comes to thinking outside of ourselves and explaining supernatural phenomena
To be fair so are people who attempt to explain supernatural phenomena. Something that doesn't make sense isn't going to make MORE sense just because you stop trying to make sense.

>What possible evolutionary advantage does seeing things that aren't real have
Not everything we have is an advantage, some things just weren't bad enough to get selected against.

>My main beef with modern science is the arrogance, the assertion that it can explain everything and that everything else is somehow false
So your main beef is something YOU made up? If you go around lying to yourself everyday it's no wonder you're mad. Science isn't a person, it does not have the capacity to be arrogant or to make claims.

>Ideally science and spirituality should work together rather than trying to prove each other wrong
I think you're treading close to what is known as the "middle ground fallacy". Just because something is balanced in your eyes, doesn't make it true or right.

>people having the audacity to discredit other people's personal experiences just because they can't be tested in a scientific way.
Usually what happens is that people make claims that have no evidence going one way or the other, but they expect everybody else to believe their personal interpretation. In other words "This is what I think happened, therefore you all have to think the same way".

>Similarly, this bias towards thinking that the modern world is superior to the past is poisonous
You gladly reap the benefits the modern world gives you, but you still spurn it.

>and gives us no sense of humility and acknowledgement of limitations
I think you're just looking for something to project your own failings onto at this point.

>are only able to become as rich as they are when everybody believes that the material world is all there is.
If that's true then why were people so willing to hand over all their wealth to The Church? If we're talking about hoarding wealth and living in opulence, then it's spiritual practices which enabled this.
Frederick Gullywog - Fri, 13 Feb 2015 23:09:06 EST Lovan+OC No.67372 Reply

This guy here, proof that society couldn't handle Darwinism. They thought it meant we needed to prevent survival of the fittest, and now our gene pool is fucked.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Sun, 15 Feb 2015 00:49:07 EST o0w4X9KP No.67376 Reply
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Giving a blanket response to some of the crazy people who still don't understand.
I have a one million dollar challenge for you to come prove your chakras, ghosts, psy powers, phantasams, ghosts, etc.

The prize remains unclaimed.
Alice Gonkindidge - Sun, 15 Feb 2015 00:55:25 EST BCGdGCxE No.67377 Reply

Anyone who knows of those things doesn't want the funny money lol what don't you understand about that?
Shitting Pittbanks - Sun, 15 Feb 2015 02:50:06 EST o0w4X9KP No.67379 Reply
Also just because we don't know something (yet or it was once known and now forgotten) does not cause it to fall out side of scientific explanation.
Martin Hengerbitch - Sun, 15 Feb 2015 13:01:52 EST mizihnrI No.67387 Reply
But the people who claim to have powers or some kind of extra perception spend their lives taking money from other people. CLEARLY they want money.
Eliza Guckleson - Sun, 15 Feb 2015 23:31:23 EST BCGdGCxE No.67389 Reply



Priscilla Grandway - Thu, 26 Feb 2015 10:37:45 EST 9qYRk67T No.67509 Reply

They claim to have said powers because they want the money. Not because they actually have them.

Those that genuinely do have no desire for $1,000,000
Samuel Besslebune - Thu, 26 Feb 2015 12:09:02 EST pjWd9Flc No.67510 Reply
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So magic people NEVER want money? They don't think they could spend it on charities or helping others? You're trying to paint them as being noble, but in reality you're making them look like assholes.
Archie Fommleson - Thu, 26 Feb 2015 23:37:36 EST lR40rf2l No.67513 Reply

Helping people out?
Spreading so called wisdom?
William Mullymodging - Fri, 27 Feb 2015 01:12:19 EST /FtRbBly No.67514 Reply
worst reply this is so obnoxious, the wikipedia link about archeology is a total joke. Like you just know this guy puts this link to say fuck you to the other guy.

so fuck you, rational retarded fucker who doesnt understand esoteric knowledge
Fuck Goodford - Fri, 27 Feb 2015 02:49:03 EST zxbLVK7p No.67516 Reply

>so fuck you, rational retarded fucker who doesnt understand esoteric knowledge

/spooky/ in a nutshell
Nigel Suttinghood - Fri, 27 Feb 2015 07:06:37 EST 9qYRk67T No.67517 Reply
I didn't say 'never', I'm sure there are bound to be exceptions.
Not wanting money isn't noble at all (Some practitioners are assholes. Some of the nicest people I've ever met practiced some form of magic, however some of the worst have as well). Also, giving money to charity doesn't actually achieve much, if anything. Throwing money at problems doesn't solve them.

Money fucking blows, and spreading it around helps no one in the long run.
But this /spooky/, not some economics board.

Don't get me wrong, I do believe helping others out is important, but just handing out money isn't usually effective long term, and kind of has a lack of compassion.
Phoebe Giffingsock - Fri, 27 Feb 2015 07:28:34 EST pjWd9Flc No.67518 Reply
>so fuck you, rational retarded fucker who doesnt understand esoteric knowledge
I don't think inventing crazy stories about how ancient people lived is "esoteric knowledge"

Confirmed for sheltered kid with no experience of charities or concept of money. Bitch about economics all you like, but the fact is that there are people going hungry tonight who wouldn't have to if somebody gave them a little cash. Trying to make excuses for charlatans by pretending that the money could do no good anyway is fucked up in a big way.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Fri, 27 Feb 2015 13:44:28 EST o0w4X9KP No.67520 Reply
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>Magic still isn't real.
Eugene Buzzstock - Fri, 27 Feb 2015 14:08:48 EST kWhv8Bvp No.67521 Reply
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nigga i sawnt ghosts and felt spirits control me and scare people out of the room during ritual tell me that mahgick aint real nigga fuck you
Esther Curringhag - Fri, 27 Feb 2015 17:03:53 EST 6KUg0Ehf No.67522 Reply
I believe they exist, but I'm not claiming they do.
Rebecca Wummledale - Sat, 28 Feb 2015 09:05:57 EST 3eUWsxZz No.67526 Reply
and how exactly shall i PROVE you anything with words

well fuck you're fuckign arrogance made you make a mistake, i only need to disprove one, to disprove your argument.

I'll just let some ball of light appear on your sighting shortly before you read my answer.

fucking hybridic sceptic
Martin Fanwell - Sat, 28 Feb 2015 09:34:10 EST pjWd9Flc No.67527 Reply
It would have been funnier if you posted a picture of a ball of light with your post
James Mother Fucking Randi - Sat, 28 Feb 2015 10:10:58 EST o0w4X9KP No.67528 Reply
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>Ball Lightning isn't magic either.
William Grimfield - Mon, 02 Mar 2015 02:22:54 EST cmcBTTvp No.67542 Reply
>How about you find me an ancient text that explains calculus

this one's easy
archimedes is non officially the guy that invented calculus and he was born way before scientific method. plus, calculus is not science. take that idiot.
William Grimfield - Mon, 02 Mar 2015 02:24:55 EST cmcBTTvp No.67543 Reply
>Spreading so called wisdom?

if they proved their shit to randi im sure as hell everyone would be interested in what they have to say
Shitting Heckletodging - Mon, 02 Mar 2015 04:43:55 EST 3eUWsxZz No.67544 Reply
Yes, but it would not have convinced him.
Now I am ready for the challenge.
Eliza Pumblehood - Mon, 02 Mar 2015 20:46:06 EST o0w4X9KP No.67551 Reply
What will you demonstrate for The amazing Randi?
Reuben Birringsudging - Mon, 02 Mar 2015 22:38:03 EST t5D+8XVW No.67552 Reply
notice how he cant disprove skeletons....
Cornelius Clupperhall - Tue, 03 Mar 2015 00:26:08 EST Cn/tlwAk No.67554 Reply
Can he disprove the quarter behind the ear magic trick?
James Niggerbury - Tue, 03 Mar 2015 03:45:30 EST RGT5Y5n0 No.67555 Reply

What you called "psy" no doubt proves your ignorance on the subject or parapsychology but a short amount of reading can remedy the issue.

Pick up a copy of Richard S. Broughton's book on the topic.

Better yet, take a college course in Psychology. Your professor might ask you to grab a copy of Atkinson & Hilgard's Introduction to Psychology. A standard textbook for beginning in the field.


This book is written and put together by leaders in their fields. Experts. They include a section near the back of the book on Parapsychology and the evidence for/against psi phenomena.

The evidence for, in the strongest form, is the work of Helmut Schmidt who only recently passed away.


Although critics on wiki purport flaws that were noted by CSICOP members (generally considered unethical in the mainstream scientific community) a poll of 1,000 college professors showed that most of them believe in the existence of psi and generally psychic phenomena.

Schmidt taught physics in American, Germany, and Canada. He was no fool and certainly not being taken in by a magician or sleight of hand.

Feel free to review his works yourself, dont take my word for it!


By the way Schmidt taught physics all over the world, he had a PhD, he was published in multiple journals before his death, and respected by his peers.

Randi on the other hand has no significant education, no published work, and generally trolls whenever he can troll.

Just sayin' if you're a man of science you dont care for James Randi. Only fedora loving arm-chair skeptics who dont really understand the difference between "science" as a noun and the systematic cataloging of knowledge via the scientific method.
John Dusslefoot - Tue, 03 Mar 2015 03:53:39 EST cmcBTTvp No.67556 Reply
>Schmidt's early psychokinesis experiments involved machines with one red and one green light. Subjects would attempt to make one light illuminate more than another. Schmidt has reported success rates of 1–2% above what would be expected at random over a large number of trials

fuck dat
Sophie Churringsid - Tue, 03 Mar 2015 08:44:49 EST pjWd9Flc No.67558 Reply
There's enough to discredit Schmidt in the very article you use to support him! How about somebody replicates his results, then we'll talk.
>Schmidt has reported success rates of 1–2% above what would be expected at random over a large number of trials
So basically he kept doing it until there was a tiny statistical deviation, then he binned the tests that failed. Amazing. Truly.

>Just sayin' if you're a man of science you dont care for James Randi.
Why wouldn't I care for somebody who quite rightly points out frauds, all while remaining open to the possibility they aren't frauds?

>Only fedora loving arm-chair skeptics who dont really understand the difference between "science" as a noun and the systematic cataloging of knowledge via the scientific method.
Randi's work predates this recent stereotype.
Faggy Nisslewell - Tue, 03 Mar 2015 10:21:21 EST Vvps3nnt No.67561 Reply
If quantum physics were held to the standard that parapsychology is held to by skeptics, no one would take it seriously. Prove me wrong.
Faggy Nisslewell - Tue, 03 Mar 2015 10:28:11 EST Vvps3nnt No.67562 Reply
Yeah, and before that, the Bible explained more, and it did so for much longer. What's your point? Read Feyerabend on the topic. You have to be open-minded to a significant degree of bullshit for any scientific progress to be made. Copernicus was heavily influenced by discredited mystics, for example.
Sophie Churringsid - Tue, 03 Mar 2015 11:39:20 EST pjWd9Flc No.67563 Reply
>I don't know anything about quantum mechanics
Hey nor do I, but at least I'll admit it.
Jarvis Tillingforth - Wed, 04 Mar 2015 15:21:17 EST FpMToaNv No.67581 Reply
>There is no such things as ghosts, spirits, sorcery, magic, shadow people, psychics, wizards, witches, demons, specters, etc etc etc.
There's no scientific evidence for these things, sure, but that doesn't mean they conclusively don't exist unless evidence shows it's impossible for these things to exist under our current conditions. However, you can say you don't believe in these things, that there's no convincing proof that the supernatural exists, and that you're agnostic about its existence but you can't rationally say it absolutely doesn't exist either.
Reuben Nushlad - Thu, 05 Mar 2015 00:06:10 EST 2aVzBKDP No.67588 Reply
there's also no evidence disproving the existence of unicorns living in the undeground of mars having brazilian jiu jitsu competitions but i'm sure some idiot will point out that i can't say they don't exist.
Charles Goodham - Wed, 01 Apr 2015 20:30:45 EST 1FBl7qtW No.67905 Reply
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>the prize is rigged so it only pays out if paranormal powers are real
Well yeah, that's sort of the point
Emma Gugglecocke - Tue, 07 Apr 2015 08:13:27 EST xBUEXnU+ No.67948 Reply
That's retarded wank.

The scientific method can explain everything THAT IS REAL!

Of course it can't explain fake things. Because those things are fake and NOT-REAL.
Alice Hebberdidge - Sun, 12 Apr 2015 06:03:55 EST Dwdkhq+4 No.67996 Reply
your reading comprehension is off the charts.

like waaaay below average man you should see a counselor
James Mother Fucking Randi - Tue, 28 Jul 2015 22:22:10 EST sMYpOa68 No.68748 Reply
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Still here and still waiting for one of you fucking wizards to prove me wrong.

>Magic still isn't real.
Reuben Fupperstedging - Wed, 29 Jul 2015 22:25:09 EST KH4df1rX No.68752 Reply
if it's all so fake, why do you care if people believe it? What makes you so clever that you've already figured out the nature of reality and all it's details?
James Mother Fucking Randi - Thu, 30 Jul 2015 03:24:16 EST sMYpOa68 No.68753 Reply
Because people make decisions based on these beliefs. Decisions that could be potentially very harmful to them selves and every one around them in many ways.

it could be something very minor like wasting money on fortune tellers. Or it could be some thing more severe, like when christian scientists let their children die from entirely curable and preventable illness. Or politicians who refuse to acknowledge climate change data.


If we have people like that running around in society making choices based on what feels good rather than whats real then the whole thing falls apart.
Samuel Sivingbanks - Thu, 30 Jul 2015 07:08:03 EST wft2UrU/ No.68754 Reply
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We have people running around society making horrible decisions based on cold, hard logic. You think politicians don't believe in climate change? They know it's real, they just don't care because they are being paid a shitload of money not to care. They aren't religious, they don't believe in God, that is their stage act. That is how they get votes.

You call out magical thinkers on 420chan, and believe all the talking heads on CNN.

Point at him, point at him and laugh.
William Shittingcocke - Thu, 30 Jul 2015 11:32:58 EST VLQLI9Mu No.68755 Reply
Your just as dumb as you sound if you cant even think beyond 3 dimensional logic.

Quantum mechanics.

Honestly no one can prove this just like you cant prove to us that it isnt real, since conciousness cannot be measured and even when it is, you have to take their word for it, so you either have to broaden your horizon and start to think outside of the 3d physical reality and begin trancending yourself to a higher plane of thought.

>thinks understanding 3D reality means anything when he cant even decipher where 3D reality came from.

For all you know, this could be a virtual reality, and the 'laws of physics' could just be the parameters under which the program runs, meaning your entire understanding of logic is flawed.

Prove to me this isnt a virtual reality, and i will agree with you that 3D reality is solid and absolute, until then, broaden your fucking horizons, and come back to us when you reach the singularity.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Thu, 30 Jul 2015 15:59:51 EST sMYpOa68 No.68761 Reply
>Quantum physics isn't magic either, it's physics.

Also the old argument of just because we don't know what it is yet doesn't mean it's magic. God of the gaps style arguments don't work in the lab sonny jim.

While I disagree with your view point I do appreciate that you put it in a concise well though out manner rather than saying a bunch of nonsense like most of the rest of the thread. I never acted though as if this were a big important place to debate this.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Thu, 30 Jul 2015 16:48:26 EST sMYpOa68 No.68762 Reply
Follow up;

The point wasn't to show that the belief in these things is bad, the point of this thread was to try and have one of you wizards prove any of the things you guys post about has any scientific merit or evidence.

So far no one has tried to do that and has mostly resorted to personal attacks and presenting non evidence as fact.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Thu, 30 Jul 2015 20:11:22 EST sMYpOa68 No.68764 Reply
Reaching back in this thread to point out the types of people arguing against science in this debate.

A person who has a clearly demonstrated lack of scientific literacy shows his distrust of knowledge.
This really is the majority arguing for the paranormal.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Thu, 30 Jul 2015 20:17:30 EST sMYpOa68 No.68765 Reply
>distrust of science.
Sorry typod because im high on a marijuana.
Hugh Boddlewodge - Fri, 31 Jul 2015 01:19:49 EST rVdwNrwI No.68767 Reply
I've levitated seen and talked with ghosts dealt with shadow beings haunting my own mother and You're going to tell me none of its real? ..... Maybe considering Magic isn't really Magic when you know how to know things of that' nature
James Mother Fucking Randi - Fri, 31 Jul 2015 04:04:00 EST sMYpOa68 No.68770 Reply
Please film a video of you levitating and post it here for science!

As for the ghosts, if no one else but you can see them then they are all in your mind.
Unless you have some sort of way to demonstrate this ability in a way that can be measured and quantified you are either insane or a liar. Or both.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Fri, 31 Jul 2015 04:06:55 EST sMYpOa68 No.68771 Reply
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This is all science really is when you break it down.

They teach this to children. It's not some big scary (or arrogant thing) that guys think and act like it is.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Fri, 31 Jul 2015 04:35:08 EST sMYpOa68 No.68772 Reply
Raccoon can't don't have a complex reasoning and deduction skills. They can't do math, write, read or any of the other things needed to understand the nature of reality.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Fri, 31 Jul 2015 04:44:17 EST sMYpOa68 No.68773 Reply
Raccoons don't have*

I hit the bong to hard.
Sophie Billingforth - Fri, 31 Jul 2015 06:57:40 EST v3rNY29U No.68775 Reply
And you are a retard, and most likely a faggot because of being a retard.
Your mind is in the universe, your mind IS the universe, therefore 'ghosts' are all in the universe. What is your mind really? Matter. Therefore it does not have some special distinction from the rest of the universe, conciousness itself is a characteristic of the universe, it is a part of it, not some seperate thing.

The best part is how you think your smart, and all of us who have the deeper understanding look at you as if your disabled (which technically you are because your own ego succeeds rational understanding, not realizing your just using a feedback loop to seperate yourself from new knowledge and understanding, because it makes you think you are superior to others, when really you are a defunct retard on the inevitable path of getting himself killed by his own guise because he decides to pretend hes 2 smart for instructions and electrocutes himself out of stupidity on his first job.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Fri, 31 Jul 2015 12:53:31 EST sMYpOa68 No.68781 Reply
You keep talking about ghosts, but offer no evidence for them. Then you insult me for not believing in them.

All I've done is ask for proof and evidence for your claims. All I receive is insults.

You aren't strengthening the case for the paranormal.
Polly Chittingpag - Fri, 31 Jul 2015 17:58:39 EST v6rgdPFx No.68784 Reply
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Why should skeptics be proven to?
Rebecca Tillingdale - Fri, 31 Jul 2015 19:19:39 EST bXwKBtTx No.68785 Reply

He's right. Everything exists. As soon as it becomes a thought.
Betsy Nonderfat - Fri, 31 Jul 2015 22:00:37 EST 45wz3Y7E No.68786 Reply
that's the biggest cop out ever. In my mind's eye I see a thousand of my own dicks entering your mother's asshole. Does this make me your stepdad? the answer is yes. now go get daddy a beer.
Reuben Drongerridge - Sat, 01 Aug 2015 04:16:01 EST jdRuHSoB No.68787 Reply
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I just want to say that the first time I moved and objected wth my mind, I was 12 years old and my father had just beaten me for the second time that day. i made a girl on a live television broadcast fall over on stage and die. i had focused my anger and helplessnesss into a psychedelic funnel of mental energy and struck a target through the television with electricity (the 7th human sense), which then zapped the girl on the stage millions of feet away through shock direction.

i have never forgotten this nor have i ever tried to abuse my powers. i keep them secret to avoid detection. i believe that it is very possible and thus very likely that there are people watching all of us and you may be a target of observation.

people with high sensitivity to mental powers through childhood abuse are rare but not impossible. i was just born... unlucky....
Cedric Nickleway - Sat, 01 Aug 2015 06:13:41 EST 2tN2vHop No.68790 Reply
you didn't answer my question, how do you know for certain that everyone else is wrong and you're right? Who exactly bestowed your infinite knowledge of what is real and what is not and why do you believe that like Christians believe gospel?
Faggy Dangerway - Sat, 01 Aug 2015 20:32:08 EST 0xFVVOOJ No.68796 Reply
I thought of another question for you today. Who the fuck is james randi, i've never heard of him outside this thread
Ernest Fuckingshit - Sat, 01 Aug 2015 23:29:50 EST SzpgvOwR No.68799 Reply
Or you developed a mental illness as a coping mechanism.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Mon, 03 Aug 2015 05:06:34 EST LS4TAOmV No.68811 Reply
So I've had a minute to digest the amount of nonsense in this thread, I feel I can post with out intentionally insulting any one.

So essentially what the majority of people in this thread who are trying to tell me im an idiot because I don't believe in unverifiable/ unsubstantiated claims of ghosts, wizards, magic, crystal healing etc is what is called the "God of the gaps" argument.

Essentially it boils down to there are gaps in knowledge that science has YET to explain, so people tend to fill those gaps with god/ magic.

I just wrote and then deleted a long paragraph furthering my argument then deleted it out of the frustration that I would experience from any of the any of the insane arguments some one could make for such nonsense. So instead here's a wikipedia article on the "god of the gaps".

now excuse me while do drugs to cope with this threads level of stupid.


PS. magic still isn't real. If it were, it would be a property of reality that is quantifiable and measurable and therefore if it actually existed it would be science not magic.
Henry Bepperbed - Mon, 03 Aug 2015 10:34:41 EST WSMfd1sl No.68812 Reply
>if it existed it would be science not magic
Reality isn't made of science. Science is measuring things that can be measured by us. There are things we can't measure yet because they can't be pinned down easily. Not that I am advocating explaining things by 'magic'.

I'm really curious as to why this all gets you so mad. You said you don't like people making decisions based on what you see as flawed logic, but that's literally what everybody is doing all the time. It's just the justification that changes.

Who are you trying to convince? Us? Yourself? What would you have everybody do? Renounce their faith in all things that don't abide by what science knows right now? Make decisions based only on logic pre-approved by you? Can you imagine how utterly buttfuck boring that would be, and how stagnant we would become?

IMO you should spend less time berating what other people believe and invest that time in learning about the things you believe in. Cause all you're doing here is being an angry little boy and making your immaturity very obvious.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Mon, 03 Aug 2015 23:57:49 EST LS4TAOmV No.68816 Reply
>spends entire thread being insulted and berated.
>I finally make a post expressing my frustration
Augustus Godgesut - Tue, 04 Aug 2015 00:01:32 EST ++YfEa2j No.68817 Reply
your entire post boils down to "why u mad tho" and some personal attacks. All it does is make you seem less credible fyi. I recommend trying to address his points rather than just reacting. and why does something need to be unexplainable to be interesting? I've never understood that line of thinking, a lake in the forest is still beautiful even if it isn't enchanted or infested with gnomes. if anything learning whats behind something makes it MORE interesting.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Tue, 04 Aug 2015 02:59:22 EST LS4TAOmV No.68818 Reply
I wrote this post at 5am and was high as fuck. It's rife with grammatical errors. But please don't take that as a sign of stupidity. It's more of a display of sleep deprived frustration.

Let me also ask to the detractors, if the phenomenon you guys describe are in fact real then why can science not detect/ measure them?
John Fisslebury - Tue, 04 Aug 2015 05:21:02 EST EsU/adXP No.68819 Reply
Reality = balance
Science = observation of unbalance
Phineas Pummlefoot - Tue, 04 Aug 2015 07:28:41 EST RNiSWmOW No.68820 Reply
"You can't prove a negative"

Literally one of the dumbest things anyone has ever said.

Did he even take Intro to Philosophy?
Polly Sibblehood - Tue, 04 Aug 2015 09:34:07 EST bXwKBtTx No.68821 Reply

>that's the biggest cop out ever.


Still true jolly african-american.
Martin Sembleherk - Tue, 04 Aug 2015 10:26:10 EST c9fSGb5A No.68822 Reply
because i don't actually care about proving him wrong, there's no point, I genuinely want to know why it makes him so mad. This thread has been up since last year and he's still here and he's still so mad. I find it interesting and kind of amusing
Priscilla Memblestone - Tue, 04 Aug 2015 15:10:46 EST CAR2zJNK No.68823 Reply
lol that dude is presistent....looks like this thread is older then i have been browseing 420chan frequently
William Bimblestit - Tue, 04 Aug 2015 18:46:51 EST HCnpWuyZ No.68826 Reply
My older sister is who pointed out the first ghostbI've seen however my friends have all encounted familiar spirits of mine when in my household and thats for calling me a liar/insane person for having nobody else who saw. This kind of stuff doesnt lend well to explanation im not going to video myself levitating on command it doesnt work like that its a natural thing like riding a surf wave... Im not the moon or the person who responded to you in this shitstorm Above
Reuben Crollyspear - Wed, 05 Aug 2015 00:32:48 EST 6tFt8kKR No.68829 Reply

Can you explain? I don't know how you could prove that something doesn't exist. Could someone explain or at least point me towards an article or a page or something? Legitimately curious, thought it was common knowledge until I saw this post. nb
James Mother Fucking Randi - Wed, 05 Aug 2015 00:46:33 EST LS4TAOmV No.68830 Reply
>Can't levitate on command.

So does it happen on it's own or something? Thats gotta be super inconvenient. Like standing at line at the bank or during sex.

If that's the case then why aren't we seeing more people levitate?

Tantric levitation people claim to be able to levitate on command. Yet not a single one has ever been caught on film doing so.

So either you're insane or a liar sir.
James Honeyfuck - Wed, 05 Aug 2015 05:34:00 EST EsU/adXP No.68831 Reply
It happens in the mind, we all float above our bodies laughing at you for being so incapable, also there are astral rumours going around saying your a massive faggot who takes it up the pooper. BUT HEY THATS JUST A THEORY.
Phoebe Greenspear - Wed, 05 Aug 2015 16:36:59 EST 8Q/byPx1 No.68832 Reply
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This is a highly entertaining thread. I can levitate too! And since it's in my mind IT IS REAL!
Thomas Shittinghood - Thu, 06 Aug 2015 01:42:33 EST v6rgdPFx No.68838 Reply
>Edwards: Why the big secret? People are smart. They can handle it.

>Kay: A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it. Fifteen hundred years ago everybody knew the Earth was the center of the universe. Five hundred years ago, everybody knew the Earth was flat, and fifteen minutes ago, you knew that humans were alone on this planet. Imagine what you'll know tomorrow.

Science, or some groups of scientists can and probably do measure some of these things. This quote is quite apt of an explanation about why things of this nature are not put forth into the general knowledge. Shit's just too whacky, people would freak out.

Oh, and if you want to see ghosts just walk around a supernatural place at night and keep your eyes sharp.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Thu, 06 Aug 2015 02:11:52 EST LS4TAOmV No.68839 Reply
what makes a place supernatural?

And the idea that in the past people believed things that were incorrect like a geocentric universe andno longer think that way is an argument FOR science .
James Mother Fucking Randi - Thu, 06 Aug 2015 02:15:03 EST LS4TAOmV No.68840 Reply
Also people dont spend nearly a decade in school and then equally as long practicing their chosen scientific disciple just to cover things up because its "2spooky4me". I appreciate though that your post wasn't a personal attack and was written in a coherent manner though.
Cedric Clunningpet - Thu, 06 Aug 2015 07:53:50 EST 8Q/byPx1 No.68841 Reply
Why use a quote that is so fucking wrong? The flat earth myth was created in the 19th century by people selling history books.
Isabella Binninghall - Thu, 06 Aug 2015 09:42:15 EST Xa2GyloI No.68842 Reply
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There is no such thing as proving a negative.

Proving somebody wrong is impossible, you have to prove yourself right instead.
Thomas Shittinghood - Thu, 06 Aug 2015 16:24:01 EST v6rgdPFx No.68843 Reply
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>>68839 >>68840 >>68841

I know there are problems with the validity of the movie quote but the point of it was the message of keeping certain things secret in order to not freak out people about things that may or may not exist. Sorry if there was a misunderstanding I wasn't trying to say anything about the flat earth theory.

Anyways I'd say a supernatural place is a place with known activity with spirits. Places which might have a high density of ghost or alien sightings, native american burial grounds, places in which there might have been a lot of conflict and turmoil in that past which would leave souls (pls no debate existence of soul) there which would have a connection to that place. I am not very well educated on matters such as this but there is information out there in certain texts which tell quite a bit about these sorts of things.

Also, I am not saying that this information is talked about by everyone who reaches a certain educational level and then all of those people agree to cover it up. Only that it's my belief that there are certain groups of people in scientific or spiritual fields (holy see) which are involved with paranormal things.
James Mother Fucking Randi - Thu, 06 Aug 2015 17:17:56 EST LS4TAOmV No.68845 Reply
Again while i disagree with you i very much appreciate that you put your argument in a well thought out and non crazy manner. You are a credit to your side of this thread.
Simon Chemmerspear - Fri, 07 Aug 2015 03:57:16 EST EsU/adXP No.68846 Reply
No one cares enough dude, we are too busy philosophizing and shit, perhaps you should read a few interpretations of Aleister Crowley's books
Oliver Drapperstudge - Sat, 08 Aug 2015 15:32:14 EST 0Gy7P9ch No.68854 Reply
We know, we know.. we simply cant convey to you our experiences of the infinity in words... for if such a thing were to be true... why would it? All we get is one word to describe infinite, yet infinite, holds a great deal of our roots, defining all numerical calculationw beneath its reality, think of reality in the way that a video game is created, each 'thing' has a numerical value and is represented on an axis, and for something to happen inside the game, these values would have to change, so in a way, our feelings and emotions can be thought of the same way, which then comes to our choices we make, naturally, people dont make choices which negatively impact them selves, people make choices to secure that, so it would be safe to say that due to the subconcious effect that our emotions have over us, that these would exist for purposes such as mating, food, survival, etc. Why? Because its our conciousness correcting negative imbalances from the outside world, these are needed to survive. Yet, numerical knowledge came far after the composition of the universe, let alone the knowledge of infinite/ the singularity, these things had to already exist in order for us to discover them, and considering that the laws in our universe, are all determined by some sort of numerical significance, it would also make sense that the inevitable, dreaded singularity that is, infinite, would have a great significance, as it obviously represents something! We just dont know what, however, my theory is that the existence of our universe resides outside of balance, a series of numerical equations, created out of chaos, born from the endless possibilities of infinite itself, infinite axis? Now we are just playing with universe breaking ideas? And where does conciousness fall into all of this? Well, I and many others on this board personally believe (yes... i said that dreaded word..... believe) its possible to EXPERIENCE this infinite 'void' either through intense meditation, or psychedelic substances, mostly, consists of a kind of 'free mode' for conciousness, in which experience is melded into one great 'thing' imagine, conciousness without a body, yet for us to already be possible to exist ( we do exist do we not?) Such things as colour, and as i explained before, numerical patterns, must already 'exist' in order to be real percievable things, the universe knows this, but do we? One last point I will make is the golden ratio, this is key to all psychedelic visions, and what else is it key to? Hmm, its only the most important ratio in all of physics, all things from binary code, to the way that plants form, to clouds in the sky to cracks in the ground, a neuron in your head or a galaxy far far away.. The result?

People in this thread have been jerks, and i have too, im sorry, if i am not intelligent enough to convey the message, then i hope you find someone who is, whether im seen as crazy by others, or just plain stupid, it doesnt matter to me, ive figured out a pattern that determines everything, what more could I want? What could be more useful? Whether some want to take the extra leap and participate in magic, or sit at home and be content in ones self, does it really matter, as long as we have some kind of personal truth that holds us grounded in reality? Now i dont know if your trolling or not, but you gotta realise this is important to us people, and if you are looking to expand your ideas, maybe even find some links between scientific reality and 'ultimate reality' it would be far wiser to bear with us, than force us to bear with you, anyone can pick up a book about scientific theory and memorise it, not to say that this is insignificant, because it most certainly is not, however, it is the explorers of conciousness, who face a much more obscure task, how can i experience, 'out there' while I am 'in here'(this body)?
James Mother Fucking Randi - Sat, 08 Aug 2015 18:00:16 EST LS4TAOmV No.68856 Reply
While appreciate the sentiment of your post I think you missed the point of this thread. Just because some thing is vast and complex like "the infinite" as you put it does not make it fall out side the realm of science and reality.

Again, and I really am trying to not come off condescending but you're post is just more god of the gaps argument.

Let me reiterate, you don't have to explain paranormal to me in your words. You could post a video link, articles of other people proving this any thing.
Beatrice Tootstock - Sat, 08 Aug 2015 19:50:41 EST 9DRzj4Y3 No.68857 Reply
If you believe in ghosts and fairies and you 420chan then I hate to break it to you but you've done drugged yourself insane.
Walter Brobbershaw - Sat, 08 Aug 2015 22:27:54 EST IgsdgNIZ No.68858 Reply
If magic was real (it isn't , BTW) we would never know anyway because wizards can't do magic in front of muggles.
Wesley Sedgelug - Sun, 09 Aug 2015 09:48:45 EST C2gn/Vf3 No.68862 Reply

This perhaps, a documenary by Rick Strassman, its quite enjoyable.


Nah, this is our belief system, cant you see? We are all about experience. There are levels to the conciousnesses awareness systen, and there are 7 inner lessons one must learn, in order to achieve a taste of enlightenment, whether you want to live that now or after your death is up to you because the experience itself comes from this higher awareness, infinity, this is literally what we believe, and what we have seen either by meditation means, (can be very quick if one knows how ones own mindset should be) or purposely altered mindset, DMT, LSD and such. this is why shit like all religion was made and the most ancient of successful civilizations have utilized this knowledge in order to control the populace, I mean someone can easily say its all in your head, but what they dont realize is that this is all your human mind can comprehend what its seeing, because percieving infinity makes our conciousness very unstable, so it begins to disintegrate and we are free from the confines of our own body... we believe our 3d dimensional laws can be bypassed through electromagnetic programming, positive intention or negative intention, and this sticks to that person, and changed them, this begins the theory that the universe is comprised of seperate ideas functioning as a kind of 'bacteria' like entity which draws energy to it, or gives energy out to others depending on what sort of ideas one holds, positivity makes others day brighten and our dopamine reacts accirdingly, same with negative situations and cortisol, and adrenaline, in fight or flight situations, people who understand and wish good intention of everyone gain the affection of the universe itself, because we are the universe, just like our environment, just numbers on a grid, with a superficial conciousness which projects upon itself mere illusions to make ones self feel they have inspiration, that they are real, so one feels successful at life, the brain knows whats going on, its simply tricking you as its traits left over from evolution, so whats the point? There is none, the best thing to do is make everyones elses lifes as least shitty as possible, so that once we die, the universe doesnt rape us for the things we've done to it, but hey, as long as its a forgiving universe. (Which it is)
Rebecca Brullerwane - Sun, 09 Aug 2015 13:33:01 EST 71SmxpIz No.68863 Reply
The reason you, and the real Randi get nowhere with this kind of baiting is your definition is circular. First you need to realize that all proponents of what you would call the 'paranormal' are not the same, and are not all saying the same thing. Some things are genuine delusions or psychoses. Some come from misunderstanding of science. But you're making a claim that all paranormal things (i.e. everything outside of accepted scientific models) and supernatural things (i.e. everything which exists outside of the laws of nature, in your mind fully described by scientific models) doesn't exist. But the marrying of certain phenomena on the edge of human understanding (such as ESP, remote viewing, 'ghosts' whatever) to the idea of 'supernatural' which really is a medieval concept from Christianity is creating a strawman argument from the era when the only possibilities were 'heretical science vs. Christian dogma.' Supernatural is a meaningless word, especially when in your definition you take 'natural' to mean 'that which exists' therefore that which is beyond that, by defintion, is not real and cannot be proven, which is a circular argument. All the things you are calling the supernatural or paranormal, if they indeed exist, are governed by natural laws and are thus susceptible to the scientific method; however the scientific establishment refuses to investigate them or integrate their models, probably because they are in the most preliminary stages. Electricity was considered paranormal until a critical mass of study was reached, and on each of the individual things you claim to lump into the paranormal in your OP, there is some corollary in reality with the phenomena described that is susceptible to scientific investigation. It may not be exactly as those who experience it describe, or like the straw men ideas of that phenomena 'skeptics' like you try to cast those ideas as, but they are all 'natural' and thus 'normal' and thus subject to scientific investigation. I challenge you to prove that any of the things described absolutely cannot exist, and, if you claim that they could only exist if something was different about our orthodox accepted scientific models, I defy you to prove that there could not be some missing elements in our physical models which could account for any or all of these phenomena. You're making the claim, you provide the proof.
Ebenezer Wembleshaw - Tue, 11 Aug 2015 00:01:30 EST AePVqH7S No.68883 Reply
OP is a poorfag jealous of his inability to call upon the favors of even low level demons like Surgat. 5/10 you got me to respond. I'm currently communing with Adramelech, and I don't need to prove that to you any more than I expect you to prove to me that the universe simply blinked into existence with no influence. What a dull, colorless life you must lead. I'll burn an offering of fox hair and sage on your behalf. Burger King: Have it Your Way.
Fucking Sapperspear - Tue, 11 Aug 2015 03:59:48 EST ZVU3i+d4 No.68885 Reply
why dont you people just dont let this thread die?
James Mother Fucking RandiI - Tue, 11 Aug 2015 11:40:36 EST LS4TAOmV No.68900 Reply
Because I wont let it. This thread is my magnum opus. It's one of the oldest threads on the whole site.
Hedda Gepperhall - Tue, 11 Aug 2015 19:09:34 EST hOkLL7xl No.68910 Reply
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>Magnum Opus
>Among the oldest threads

Never change, /x/
James Mother Fucking Randi !lwriJ94kMg - Tue, 11 Aug 2015 23:08:01 EST LS4TAOmV No.68916 Reply
I have become tripfag, destroyer of threads.
Emma Packlehit - Wed, 12 Aug 2015 04:25:04 EST b1FvvFa+ No.68923 Reply
Nobody is talkin to you OP whitout people this thread is nothing although i partaly agree whit you THESE POEPLE SHOULD BE TAKING THIERE MEDICATION AND NOT BE POSTING ON HERE
Reuben Brookwill - Fri, 14 Aug 2015 16:36:44 EST ++YfEa2j No.68942 Reply
swamp gas. or a weather balloon. weather balloon inflated with swamp gas.
James Mother Fucking Randi !lwriJ94kMg - Sun, 24 Jan 2016 12:00:26 EST G5nhzP/c No.70225 Reply
Still waiting for some video or something of a wizard casting some spell.
A Wizard - Sun, 24 Jan 2016 14:35:50 EST ZytO/IIL No.70227 Reply

Too bad. Come to America and I'll show you in person. I'll also smoke up some pig for you too, you're probably malnourished after all that busking in Europe.
James Mother Fucking Randi !lwriJ94kMg - Sun, 24 Jan 2016 14:58:44 EST G5nhzP/c No.70228 Reply
I was in america for months and months. Come to europe.
Oliver Pickman - Sun, 24 Jan 2016 16:00:50 EST 5k5Q4E1B No.70229 Reply
>Come to America and I'll show you in person
No you won't
Clara Dullerham - Sun, 24 Jan 2016 17:29:01 EST PklPUrG/ No.70230 Reply
This guy is so close to death. Whenever you hear him in an interview it's clear his mind is going. I feel bad for him... it's like the skeptic community is playing weekend at bernie's with his husk.
A Wizard - Sun, 24 Jan 2016 20:16:51 EST ZytO/IIL No.70232 Reply

... I am not going to be a fucking refugee in europe. Hail Fuhrer Trump! Free hair for all Americans!
David Sullyworth - Mon, 25 Jan 2016 01:16:12 EST W0mMBHRe No.70233 Reply
Wowww big suprise your a Donald Dump supporter, stop the fucking presses
A Wizard - Mon, 25 Jan 2016 01:17:06 EST ZytO/IIL No.70234 Reply

He's the right kind of asshole to lead a country like the USA. Can ANYONE deny that?
James Mother Fucking Randi !lwriJ94kMg - Mon, 25 Jan 2016 06:33:10 EST G5nhzP/c No.70235 Reply
Keep it in /pol/ please
A Wizard - Mon, 25 Jan 2016 13:25:28 EST ZytO/IIL No.70236 Reply

You're the one necro-bumping your own dead thread. There's nothing left to say here.
Nigel Wimmerridge - Tue, 26 Jan 2016 05:16:43 EST xBUEXnU+ No.70242 Reply
>implying that matters on the fucking shittiest board of all 420chan

Go kill yourself A Wizard.

Go fucking kill yourself. End your fucking life. Slit your throat. Cut your wrists. Grab a kitchen knive and disembowel yourself. Get a screwdriver and ram it deep in your lungs.

Go fucking kill yourself.
James Mother Fucking Randi !lwriJ94kMg - Tue, 26 Jan 2016 10:47:59 EST pX+SyAOL No.70243 Reply
Is that a form of blood majyikz?
Whitey Summlekotch - Fri, 29 Jan 2016 02:21:41 EST f5IrBgJB No.70267 Reply
you're playing right into his plans. next week you'll notice someone named "A Lich" posting nonsense on every slow board.
Charles Winningbat - Sun, 07 Feb 2016 03:05:29 EST 4QkKtBI5 No.70332 Reply
Listen felow life form leave this board if you do no agree whit its views
Jarvis Dengerkine - Wed, 10 Feb 2016 09:48:36 EST JcHbSj18 No.70363 Reply
that's actually kinda genius and i would welcome it. liches b4 bitches amirite
Graham Gibberway - Thu, 25 Aug 2016 10:55:55 EST Xm1ZfRH8 No.71517 Reply
Oh aye iguana a? Other out some new friends with you guys should make the playoffs? Don't be afraid of losing my voice and I don't think that I have a great way of the day after a long day?
Felchie Felcher - Mon, 29 Aug 2016 07:33:54 EST rIjX5OQd No.71558 Reply
The first challenge was denied to you, due to your doubt.
Where was the courage to act?
Magic was welcome to you and gandalf is now disappointed.
If you dont believe magic is real, try to get possessed.
Charlotte Bunshit - Mon, 29 Aug 2016 20:14:11 EST 6H3OrTbn No.71565 Reply
I possessed a George Foreman once, if that helps.

But what does it mean to be possessed? Could we say that corporations and the American government possess us by way of the fear we all have from the underwater missile silos in the Great Lakes that are targeted at our own people?
Charlotte Bunshit - Mon, 29 Aug 2016 20:22:35 EST 6H3OrTbn No.71569 Reply
Literally what??? Fuck off back to netjester you scheming douchebag fuck!
Felchie Felcher - Wed, 31 Aug 2016 02:52:33 EST rIjX5OQd No.71587 Reply
I'm honestly quite innacurate on the possession part; usually you are not aware of possession unless someone with the wisdom points it out with proof.
I swear this dude just needs to start evocating and invocating off the wazooh so he can actually see it to believe it.
Wesley Clublingshit - Wed, 31 Aug 2016 10:07:51 EST dm6+7Q14 No.71591 Reply
Well then you are a blind idiot piece of shit for being presumptuous enough to post that faggot
Cedric Driblingforth - Fri, 02 Sep 2016 13:25:09 EST LUhQtnRK No.71645 Reply
You idiots that actually believe this crap for real could, I don't know, prove something at some point, just a fucking suggestion
Priscilla Clayhood - Fri, 02 Sep 2016 13:56:39 EST tOe00xch No.71650 Reply
Nope, being wrong is not a democracy
Nigel Pongerfed - Fri, 02 Sep 2016 15:44:11 EST wjicpzUM No.71654 Reply
Good troll.
Augustus Hundernidge - Fri, 02 Sep 2016 21:04:36 EST 7lOg5upo No.71660 Reply
>Why should I have to?
ok, Why should I have to?

you are cognizant that this same feed back loop has been played out on every forum / board ever, right?
Isabella Hengerladge - Fri, 02 Sep 2016 23:52:12 EST ClXd/BJm No.71662 Reply

i have a foggy memory of >prove me wrong threads being against the rules on some boards, am i crazy or was that a thing at one point
Hannah Duckham - Sat, 03 Sep 2016 00:29:36 EST WG17l9XG No.71663 Reply
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yes I've seen those rules to, because it just becomes

A: burden of proof lies on the accuser
B: no you're retarded, burden of proof lyes on the accused

basically I imagine two Charlie Kelly's that think they have court knowledge just from the zingiest arguing over who should actually provided the proof, It is just a feed back loop of biblical proportions
Matilda Tootforth - Fri, 09 Sep 2016 20:25:01 EST 1a+vncBY No.71893 Reply
I don't know where most of you got your fucking definitions for this word, but the Chode has nothing to do with a short or fat penis. It is a synonym of "taint" and "gooch". It is the area between your sac and your asshole. Why would you create a definition for something that doesn't exist, you morons?

"Last night, you mom tongued my chode."
A Esoteric Hitlerist - Sat, 01 Apr 2017 21:01:15 EST kzNMuDLN No.73103 Reply
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We used magic to put Trump in power! Praise Kek, Sieg Hiel! Pwned you again randi!
>And between implementation and execution of my melody, of the Melody of
this Hyperborean Family, there will be the rests and balances of Valhalla, after
which everything will be repeated. And while I am here, like today for example,
among those around me, with whom I live this adventure, this combat, I can never
know if they truly are them, if they also feel themselves "I," if they really are an
"I," a "Thou," or if they are nothing more than an illusory projection, a mirage,
dream. And if I die, this "I," if I should die, (something inconceivable to the "I")
they will continue to exist. The only solution is reached in WE, in the expansion
of the I, in the Absolute I. HE-SHE and SHE-HE, with Faces. Because when one
has arrived, won the battle, sounded the Note of the Family in its most pristine
purity, in the highest tone of the soul, then the Drama of that House of the
Hyperborean Family is plentiful.
David Baffinghall - Sun, 21 Jan 2018 10:50:33 EST 0AYwBv0Y No.74082 Reply
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>there is no such thing as spiders, robots, magnets, etc
Simon Lightwill - Wed, 31 Jan 2018 09:43:30 EST 0aIPKJuL No.74104 Reply
truth is, op, nobody likes to admit that they are wrong. it feels good, it feels special, to be the chosen one, to understand how the world works, to have some sacred knowledge and laugh at all the other sheep. that is the only reason fucktards here are going to keep posting their retarded occultist sources and try to insult you and demean you. because it would hurt for them to accept the truth, and the truth is, there has never been any shred of evidence about the supernatural. we , as a society, hold EVIDENCE in high regard. there is a reason why sentences in court are not passed based on feelings. have we not respected evidence, we would still lynch people today. so yeah
Clara Hiffingpodge - Wed, 31 Jan 2018 19:15:56 EST xC2Sb0WB No.74106 Reply
lol what a forced and delusional post
> we hold EVIDENCE in high regard
Not true fool, your petty “”””society”””” holds Logic in high regard
And Logic is overrated af, and also holds no place in the spiritual discussions
Any ignorant fucktard attempting to scale the intuitive realm of spiritual knowledge is done for from the git-go and will fail every time. Defying all logic just upsets the petty knew raised in this society of logical fact based “proof or spoof” nonsense.
Have you even read aliester crowleys work pleb? I’ll be back later to educate you
Augustus Clayshit - Wed, 31 Jan 2018 23:00:47 EST TV8ERTjO No.74107 Reply
Okay so your point holds validity in the sense of judgment, but thats about it, and being that you clearly lack actual experience of anything supernatural, you’re the type to only know how to use judgement against spiritual phenomena. Hilarious lack of intelligence really considering the fucking CIA themselves you know the Central INTELLIGENCE agency have even come to accept the validity in spiritual phenomena enough to have some people with such ability in their own workforce.
Yeah, there’s an invasion of egotistical narcissistic sociopaths taking over the psy communities and using it for their own advantage via falsity, but they don’t represent actual gifted individuals who are naturally connected to that realm without a stupid need for LSD or DMT etc.I mean fuck, dude, maybe read a book sometime and you wont be so ignorant and idiotic towards matter larger than the typical and feeble human mind.
Jack Cradgehot - Thu, 01 Feb 2018 00:39:23 EST B+e9SzRY No.74108 Reply
i psychically communicated with like 20 people last night
Charlotte Grandlock - Tue, 20 Feb 2018 01:31:43 EST oaYBWSik No.74190 Reply
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>logic... has no place in spiritual discussions
Thomas Wibblefit - Tue, 20 Feb 2018 09:12:06 EST tIMUAt1r No.74191 Reply
Yeah, it doesn’t, ya fucking ignorant lard. You literally have no fucking idea what your even trying to pretend to discuss if you actually think Logic the most overrated of all thoughtforms has even the slightest use or value in the spiritual planes.
> durrrrr if ya cant see it or prove it or use fact based evidence its just dumb and logic reigns supreme adurrrrrr
Fuckin read a book sometime you idiot
Basil Pobberchack - Tue, 20 Feb 2018 21:36:38 EST d1IQXkQs No.74192 Reply
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quantum mechanics. Nothing is real man deal with it. The universe runs on a set of rules humans have barely any understanding of. Claiming anything exists or doesn't exist is pretty stupid.
Basil Pobberchack - Tue, 20 Feb 2018 21:57:30 EST d1IQXkQs No.74193 Reply
this shit is from 2014

Basil Mettingspear - Thu, 22 Feb 2018 09:04:03 EST tIMUAt1r No.74196 Reply
Yeah DECEMBER 2014 so basically 2015 realistically
Plus its a fuckin based OP and deserves eternal bumping on this board
Archie Pushwork - Fri, 23 Feb 2018 03:50:45 EST NRUZzrBR No.74199 Reply
Why are you on this board if you don't believe in ghosts? If you want a philosophical argument you could try refuting my point that nothing exists >>74192
A_Wizard !cMZsY.BCnU!!vVWR8L52 - Tue, 06 Mar 2018 00:47:21 EST E+xhxU97 No.74240 Reply
Randy, will you return?
Priscilla Cummlesot - Mon, 26 Mar 2018 23:48:02 EST duJfX4rP No.74339 Reply
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>asking for a scientific explanation of something that can't be explained with science
Molly Pummerwell - Sat, 21 Apr 2018 04:48:06 EST 4FvZVLPs No.74417 Reply

Still nobody has proven OP wrong you mongoloids
Sidney Breckleweck - Sun, 22 Apr 2018 14:59:04 EST +LEgl5As No.74425 Reply
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look a gast....
Priscilla Babblefedging - Sun, 22 Apr 2018 21:32:23 EST +p5K53x4 No.74426 Reply
Prove to me dolphins don't exist
Lydia Dummerwill - Mon, 23 Apr 2018 19:11:35 EST n8cB6aPo No.74430 Reply
Jesus christ this thread is still around?

This is taking me back. Every single memory attached to the time in my life that I browsed this board back in 2014. Those were better days...
Polly Wablingpatch - Sun, 29 Apr 2018 18:38:20 EST R1nY4fkH No.74453 Reply
I have video evidence that spirits exist and have personally seen them and interacted with them. How in the hell are they not real when I've personally experienced them? I've also experienced many other paranormal examples of magic and psychic activity.
Cyril Pedgemadge - Tue, 01 May 2018 04:00:03 EST Oc29pJWt No.74454 Reply
I made a sigil for you to never see magic until you're dead.
Phineas Gimblenid - Mon, 03 Sep 2018 02:15:27 EST pqNwj69v No.74883 Reply
James Randi is a nobody. Why would a being with supernatural abilities waste their time with a skeptic? His mind is closed off and simply cannot comprehend the supernatural.
Archie Crossletirk - Mon, 03 Sep 2018 17:20:16 EST hbGjJd0p No.74888 Reply
>>There is no
This whole thread is bullshit because James Randi before anybody should know that it is impossible to prove a negative.
Matilda Mungerlatch - Mon, 10 Sep 2018 14:05:22 EST A1WngM+f No.74925 Reply
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Heres a picture of Thomas Hobbes with a bullet in his head (which goes against his stroke death.
He's a "Zombie Scientist" as he agreed to his terms working in the Hospitals of Hell to switch body parts on people as blessings for the next life. Get past his filter to speak to him and he may give you something then as well. There are other surgeons down there, but most of them are Nazi Scientists that have no sleight of hand and ruin peoples bodies in their field of work since they dump them out in the diseased rivers of Hell when they get ruined. Though some people get switched between doctors when they go over the pain limit
Matilda Mungerlatch - Mon, 10 Sep 2018 14:22:39 EST A1WngM+f No.74926 Reply
"You.. I thought you always knew, We don't kill people. We release them from their bindings."
A_Wizard !cMZsY.BCnU!!vVWR8L52 - Thu, 18 Apr 2019 23:22:13 EST E+xhxU97 No.75347 Reply
All hail A Wizard
Cyril Pimmerfield - Fri, 19 Apr 2019 20:19:55 EST 4f0PthPa No.75348 Reply
Hello. I am a wiserd. What should we do taday.
Cyril Pimmerfield - Fri, 19 Apr 2019 22:34:18 EST 4f0PthPa No.75350 Reply
Also I fed the cats a whole chicken tonight.
Thomas Trotdock - Sun, 21 Apr 2019 12:50:58 EST E+xhxU97 No.75355 Reply
Or maybe you just suck and rely on freud instead of Jung.
Hedda Bevingford - Mon, 22 Apr 2019 12:15:43 EST hbGjJd0p No.75358 Reply
How can you be so woke and have no idea what you're talking about at the same time? Your later paragraphs contradict your early paragraphs, I think you need to be a bit clearer about your own beliefs before you start calling bullshit on things. In particular:
>> tarot, check spirit attachments, astral project, read people remotely, charge objects
All of these things are in principle untestable by empirical methods, so if you know what they really are you should know that you're begging your own question. There's lots of scientific facts that are also in principle unable to be tested by double-blind empirical tests, but it doesn't make them any less real. Every branch of science has its own rules specific to its field, and magic is no different.
>>And I invite anybody that claims they can do this woo woo garbage to prove it to me otherwise.
No one who seriously follows any of those practices would ever waste their time doing such a fruitless thing (which is why randi's premise is so flawed.) Anyone who has the capacity to do those things must necessarily understand that belief is part of the equation. Modern 'skeptics' have lost all ability to suspend their pre-conceived notions (ironically, considering what it really means to be skeptical) and refuse to accept the fundamental premise that that very disbelief is a variable in such a test. There will never be the kind of test you're looking for, not only because the greater part of what you would be testing lies completely beyond the empirical domain, but because the 'debunkers' aren't engaging the theory they're trying to disprove in good faith. They always take the simplest, most easily disproven interpretation, and pat themselves on the back without ever really hearing the other side. As long as it is part of the agenda of followers of scientism to eradicate their ancestors, the occult, then the broader sciences will not be able to benefit from the knowledge unique to occultism. This is society's loss, but it doesn't affect occultism itself much. It has always been the lonely purview of the very few, and its occasional bursts of popularity don't disturb its waters much.
Hedda Bevingford - Mon, 22 Apr 2019 12:22:43 EST hbGjJd0p No.75359 Reply
Thought about it some more, and just to cover my ass, want to add that out of that set, remote reading is the only one that you could, potentially, empirically test, but it would still be highly fraught with difficulty. That being said, it is the one out of those that has undergone the most empirical scrutiny, and also the one for which the finding of some degree of effect (usually fairly slight, between 5-15%) is found. The electromagnetic sense of the human body is a well documented scientific fact, though, so this one is the least 'mystical' to begin with. Tarots, spirit attachments, astral projection, and the charge of objects are all fundamentally metaphysical though, and so while there are lots of false and easily debunkable claims made about them, none of those contradict their essence.
A_Wizard !cMZsY.BCnU!!vVWR8L52 - Thu, 25 Apr 2019 13:23:00 EST E+xhxU97 No.75362 Reply
>muh belief
No, the truth is what remains even when you disbelieve it. Newbs and fools tend to get caught up in belief as if it was part of this directly, rarely realising that it wasn't an issue of belief, but their own personal lack of confidence.
>magnetic fields aren't mystical
Holy fucking shit. You do know that magnetism was a core aspect of training in these practices, long before aristotle separated the physics, don't you? There is only one force in nature, and until we stop seeing the fractured beams from the prism and start seeing what went into it, we're just dumb fucking monkeys at best, NPCs at worst.
Angus Crablingmire - Fri, 26 Apr 2019 00:51:59 EST HGPeiFQi No.75363 Reply
>if you know what they really are you should know that you're begging your own question.
Sorry if something below doesn't make sense or if I repeat myself. I'm having a hard time explaining it.

I'll admit I probably concluded too strongly about those practices, but I'm not really begging the question. Used in application many of these propose to serve a function that blatantly cannot be completely local in nature. But in practice, the results are non-specific enough to not disprove the practices as being completely local, and/or require belief of an expected result by the subject/observer. And in my experience, much of the occult fails under scrutiny of a premise of being non-local. There's also a lot of overlap between most occult paradigms, but there's also a lot of contradiction, the most blatant of such being the beliefs and approaches in Chaos Magick. Therefore I don't think we should work under assumption that any of these are true, and instead seek to answer fundamental questions, such as if an observed phenomenon can exist outside the knowledge, belief, and personal ability of the parties involved.

I'll admit pulling off a double-blind study would be hard for much of this, but it's a helluva hard sale to say it's impossible. Surely you've heard the following instances: the healers that claim they can remove entity attachments; Those who can energetically charge cards, shuffle them, then set them in order; the many online psychics who can read aspects of a person or do tarot readings of which are accurate towards details they are not previously aware of; the host whose companion demons, tulpas, and/or servitors are able to astrally travel to another's body, or be seen and interacted with another receptive individual...

It doesn't take a lot of thought to come up with at least a standard or blind test for any of these. I could provide examples, but for the sake of brevity I won't. I have personally interacted with many of these things as an observer or the subject, and while many of my experiences pass the IF EXISTS test (often profoundly so), they don't exactly pass the WHAT and HOW EXISTS proposed. And that's me. If I'm wrong, that can have severe consequences, but if I'm right, I avoid those consequences and can go on practicing safer, more capable, and wiser. I want to prove the fundamental what and how to myself beyond a shadow of a doubt so I can approach the practice correctly. Yet, I almost always meet severe and identical backlash when I call into question the nature of this phenomenon. The community is too dogmatic, I says!

I guess the point of all of this is local phenomenon is no less important. We don't require any non-local interaction for our senses, perception, and experience to be bent to the most extreme. The breadth of the affect local phenomenon can have is enough to fool even the most stringent non-spiritual individuals that have experienced it.

Also worth pointing out this local vs non-local question is of particular importance to me, because of this maybe-demon attachment I have (details of tl;dr), and I have experienced a lot of unexpected phenomenon because of it. Approaching it as completely local phenomenon has worked well for me so far, and I haven't found any compelling contradiction towards that conclusion. I don't hold my current beliefs as the case-closed truth, though, hence why I challenge those that believe this phenomenon to be non-local.

I don't disregard non-local phenomenon completely, though. There's tons of documented cases of it out there that truly defy any local capability or explanation. Can we really all just go and experience that reliably, and count on that our experience is what we identify it as? At risk of being presumptuous, it's mighty rare when for any of us to gecko-style climb up walls speaking foreign tongues or are spontaneously catching on fire and get scratch marks (referring to some more infamous possession cases and the ongoing haunting phenomenon that previous tenants of the Sallie house experience).

Well at least this is my point of view. I'm really not going to debate who's wrong or right beyond that.

Hail. Your thoughts on my perspective?
Phineas Duckhall - Fri, 26 Apr 2019 11:52:19 EST hbGjJd0p No.75364 Reply
Wow, it's A Wizard, completely missing the point of the post. Who would have thought?
>>No, the truth is what remains even when you disbelieve it.
Yeah, okay. It's still what you believe, or don't. If you claim something as true but don't believe it, everyone will assume you do, no one knows for certain what's true, everyone just has beliefs.
>>>magnetic fields aren't mystical
I didn't say that. Don't come at me talking about prisms like I'm some basic bitch dualist. I said remote reading is the least mystical, (with 'to test' being, I thought, implied.) Testing it involves knowing what shape is on a card, or which room someone is in, etc. I implied this could be explained with just EM. I didn't say that's how I would explain it, but the post is trying to counter someone who is already coming at it as 'woo woo garbage', so one can only push so far.

Ah, I see now a bit more clearly where you're at with them. I had assumed you had gotten a little farther with those practices and understood the fundamental theory of divination, which is where you're getting hung up on the 'non-local' bit. I see now you weren't begging the question, but rather you still don't quite understand the true purpose of these practices. You gave me a lot to unpack here so I'm going to present as much of a case for my 'side' as I can while recognizing you'll have to reach your own conclusions as this is an inherently personal thing.

Essentially, I think you have the majority of the information, you just have missed the point. You're looking for a disunity between the local and non-local interpretation. That's important for testing purposes, but its also why I said divination (as the general class of the types of things you listed) in general cannot be empirically tested. The fundamental theory of divination is that there is a perfect correspondence between the random unfolding of local circumstances and the order of the universe. There is no division between the local and non-local, as its premise. That's unfalsifiable, because any results of any test could be said to be arranged by that very order. Any correct result could just be luck, and any false result could just be a flaw in the execution of the diviner, or the intentional revelation of a seemingly false answer for some further ends.

So, the scientist hears that and says 'well, that proves it's fake! It's just an idea that no matter how you turn it around says the same thing!'
And the magickian hears that and says 'well, that proves it's real! It's an idea that no matter how you turn it around it says the same thing.'
It's a fundamental difference in attitude. Divination is totally useless for doing science, which is about knowing what is testable -- its about answering the questions 'what' and 'how.' Divination however is very helpful for doing magick, which is about changing the world to be the way we want it to be -- it answers the question 'why?' I'm sure you're familiar with the concept that you can't derive an ought from an is. Science is about discovering what is. Magick is about creating what ought to be. If you take information about 'should I do this?' and use it to answer the question 'did you do this?' you'll get nowhere, and vice versa. They're simply different domains.

Now, the second order problem is that this is a highly nuanced understanding that is only held by a small subset of people who claim to practice divination. Most of them do claim outrageous and easily disprovable things, like they can tell you where your car keys are. When they do make hits on such specific things, its easy to see that it's not within the specific signs of that form of divination doing the heavy lifting, as they're not specific enough, but in some additional ability of the diviner. But you could run that test a million times and it would almost assuredly prove from a scientific standpoint that divination didn't work; but at that very moment someone else who is using that form of divination as its actually intended will get a meaningful result. So a test set up in such a way shows a misunderstanding of the field, or at least a pandering to the most low-brow definition of it. I think the corresponding test from a high magick standpoint would be (rather than find the car keys) 'find the best change in direction' in the subject's life. I think such a test would actually have very favorable results, but would be fantastically hard to design, outrageously expensive, and would never be able to show causation, only correlation.

Boiled down to its essence, the methods of high magick aren't amenable to scientific test because the way they are self-referential to the experimental apparatus itself isn't very compatible with the current conception of the scientific method. Within occultism, when the scientific method is employed, modifications are used to account for this fact, but by and large, skeptics investigate practitioners of low magic, which often make foolish claims or are just flat out scam artists. Again, disproving every one of them doesn't invalidate the essence of the forms they are abusing, just proves that they individually can't do it.

I think you just need to let go of the tension between your scientific and mystical minds. (A good reason being that the conflict between them is largely an engineered one.) Both sets of facts can be true at the same time, and it is the mark of intelligence to hold different ideas in mind at once without needing to commit to either of them. When you see the demon, what you are seeing is a pattern of neuronal activation. It exists by self propagating patterns within your cortices, which are interpreted as higher level phenomena by more complex neuronal regions. That fully defines the way it exists in material reality; there is no real smoke or flame, and no one else would see anything. But that doesn't make it any less a demon, or any of its demonic properties any less acute, because it is native to the spiritual plane. If it is a demon of greed and you ask it for gold, the way it works is through neuronal patterns in the real world, and that's local, but the reason it works is because that is its symbolic nature on the spiritual plane, because of the ritual connection you made with it, all of that is non-local. If you didn't believe it had that nature, it wouldn't work. If it suits you to treat the demon as local, then that becomes part of the reality of the demon. There's no test you could make to suss out which is which; because either way it is a part of you. And again, the reaction you have to that fact, whether that makes you suddenly dismiss it or realize the power that represents, will determine whether you're meant to be involved in magick or not. It's really a matter of perspective, and if you're hearing that a lot it's not so much a dogma, because a lot of different traditions came to this conclusion independently. It's that that really is the reality of the situation, there's only so many ways to explain it and at a certain point 'you either get it or you don't.'

One last thing about non-locality that I kept thinking of but didn't know where to fit in; everything is essentially non-local. All phenomena are interconnected in a very real way, and the occult definitely exploits this fact to an extreme degree. By mapping one set of inter-related things onto completely different sets, you're able to put order on the endless chaos of reality. You turn the unlimited alien Otherness of the Universe into the unified familiarity of the Self. Science can't do anything like that, nor does or should it try, but people need that, and without it often suffer greatly. So even if you don't find utility in such a thing yourself, doesn't mean others don't. All empirical evidence shows that most really do, and that's a fact that should be kept in mind.
James Worthingdock - Sat, 27 Apr 2019 14:50:59 EST HGPeiFQi No.75365 Reply
Well my man, thank you for the fantatstic explanation.

I do feel like there may be fundamental problems with the explanation you've given me, but not so much where it couldn't be due to the fact it hasn't yet sythesized with my current framework. So, I don't really want to divulge in the issues I have about it because I'm pretty sure I can sort many of those out with some reflection, and honestly I'll freaking ramble if I try to hash it out now (er, and I did, just decided to go with this in the end). It stems down to if the non-discretion between local and non-local just *seems* that way because of singular perspective... not that that theory works so cleanly, either.

Is there any literature you can recommend that further dives into this discretion, and divination in general?
Ernest Seddlenare - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 15:43:26 EST hbGjJd0p No.75366 Reply
Thanks, I appreciate it. Definitely the sort of thing one has to mull over for a long time, which is sort of the goal of the whole practice. It's also, by nature, very personal, so your interpretation of the same facts when integrated will necessarily be different. I'm really just encouraging you not to dismiss a whole field because of its most stupid adherents. That would be like dismissing science because of the non-religious flat-earthers. is that something you can say safely on /spooky/ nowadays? This is also definitely just a taste of these subjects, I'm glossing over a lot of stuff that inherently takes a long time to learn and digest.

I will say, on the subject of seeming due to singular perspective, that something seeming to be is itself meaningful, and that all perspectives are singular. Then the question becomes; if some thing x invariably seems to be so under certain conditions, and by the nature of x we cannot answer whether or not it is 'real' or merely 'seems to be', then what use can x be for us? The answer is usually 'quite a lot.' We don't have any idea, for example, why quantum mechanics 'works,' but just by understanding it in a very rule-of-thumb manner all sorts of advanced technology become possible; in the same way magick is the 'technology' to spirituality's 'science.'

As for books, there's some OK suggestions in the book thread on the front page here. You said you were sort of familiar with chaos magick, some of the founding books are similar to the concept I suggested here. 'Prometheus Rising' by Robert Anton Wilson is the ideal jumping off point if you want that angle, its funny, friendly, reasonably modern, and is perfect for druggies as I assume you also are being on this chan.

However, this specific strain of merging occultism with the techniques of the
scientific method was pioneered and popularized by Crowley, so I think his 'Book 4' (and particularly the opening part of the 'Theory & Practice' section, starting with: https://www.sacred-texts.com/oto/aba/defs.htm and then later the section on divination: https://www.sacred-texts.com/oto/aba/chap18.htm ) is a good place to start if you have an analytical/skeptical bent, a strong foundation in ancient/modern philosophy and literature, and an affinity/tolerance for purple prose and megalomania. His Book of Thoth is the master class for tarot in particular. But that avenue requires quite a large time investment.

I will say that it will be difficult to develop a complete understanding of divination without developing a broad based esoteric education, and that you have to get your hands dirty, you can't just study it from the outside. In general (this applies to pretty much any study) look for original sources rather than re-interpretations or summaries with whatever specific practice interests you. You'll also need to develop your own 'bullshit detector' for learning to tell the scammy and genuine side of any of these practices/practitioners. They're largely separate communities with separate lingos and norms, but that kinda hang out on each other's fringes and often get into fights as they drift over each other's turf from time to time. It's altogether a hard row to hoe, being a skeptical occultist, but you largely get to reap the benefits of both sides (of science/magick, not scammy/genuine, to be clear) while being somewhat inoculated against each of their worst tendencies.
John Billingman - Wed, 05 Jun 2019 18:33:24 EST l8WoDbh8 No.75467 Reply

There's a common theory that James Randi is a legit occultist, and he does all this shit to weed out the frauds and charlatans. Apparently some professor attended one of his Randi's lectures where he was demonstrating various sleight-of-hand techniques. During the demonstrations, the professor yelled out something along the lines of:
"You're a fraud! You're deceiving all these people!"

To which Randi replied: "Of course it is. I'm just doing stage magic."

And the professor said, "That's not what I mean. You're doing real magic and trying to convince everyone it's just a trick."

I have no source for that. Just read it somewhere.
John Billingman - Wed, 05 Jun 2019 18:35:54 EST l8WoDbh8 No.75468 Reply
Holy fuck, I butchered all of that.

Professor (to Randi): "You're a fraud! You're deceiving all of these people!"

Randi: "Of course I am. I'm just doing stage magic."

Professor: "That's not what I mean. You're doing real magic and telling all of these people it's just a trick."
A_Wizard !cMZsY.BCnU!!vVWR8L52 - Thu, 06 Jun 2019 15:55:35 EST E+xhxU97 No.75470 Reply
Wasn't he just an atheist jew trying to disprove other paradigms? The most magics he would do then, is larp around a satanic temple for a tax writeoff.
Charlotte Sabblehood - Sat, 08 Jun 2019 23:23:51 EST 78vEgG5F No.75494 Reply
can you just go back to /pol/ you fat fucking faggot?
Phoebe Fuckinghood - Sat, 08 Jun 2019 23:44:12 EST 78znkxLf No.75497 Reply
You sure do like dragging the word "jew" into these discussions
Thomas Dandleford - Sun, 09 Jun 2019 14:21:30 EST l8WoDbh8 No.75500 Reply
Probably because the Jews are the fucking worst
Nathaniel Sittingville - Sun, 09 Jun 2019 14:33:36 EST W2nKA3JI No.75503 Reply

I aplaud you for standing up for your beleifs. Most people are scared to name them but yeh thats anti semetic I am afriad. you are too woke no one will belive you anyway
A_Wizard !cMZsY.BCnU!!vVWR8L52 - Sun, 09 Jun 2019 22:33:47 EST E+xhxU97 No.75505 Reply
So stating that the person had a ideological purpose for his actions isn't allowed now? Hmmm, and what's this about semitic people? Last I checked, the only one going around genociding and oppressing simitic peoples other than their own governments and religious leaders are the jews of Israel and their proxy soldiers from the USA and the UK (may as well just say NATO). The Palestinians are semitic. Half of the so called jewish population of israel, is not... and those that are, such as the "asiatic" jewish populations like the Yemenis, who actually are semitic, are treated like shit. Look up how many babies were stolen by Hadassah "doctors" from yemeni mothers during the sixties, as prart of israeli eugenics and social programs. So no, I'm not anti-semitic, but I am quite against political atheism and israeli "jewish" supremacy movements that seek to oppress others based on religion and genetics, while proclaiming themselves the victims, while putting down everyone else for having the slightest pride in their own people, history, and culture. Perhaps it wasn't in good taste, but fuck you, I am A Wizard. I reserve my good taste for my choice in food and drugs.
Satan Himself - Mon, 10 Jun 2019 02:35:35 EST vT4bvZXf No.75508 Reply
Who the fuck is James Randi?
Frederick Micklewater - Mon, 10 Jun 2019 06:05:56 EST W2nKA3JI No.75510 Reply

It's funny, you acuse someone of anti-semitism and you get the most hilarious replies. I'm NOT I SWEAR, HONEST ON ME MUM M8
A_Wizard !cMZsY.BCnU!!vVWR8L52 - Mon, 10 Jun 2019 12:36:01 EST E+xhxU97 No.75512 Reply
Or you could have just been forthcoming and asked if I disliked jews and atheists. You know, zionists, atheists, christians of all denominations,muslims (exception for sufis, they're cool and dress like spinning mushrooms and dance like deadheads.) and all related abrahamic traditions. Why not make it about something real, instead of a people claiming to be a race that they are anything but.
Frederick Micklewater - Mon, 10 Jun 2019 14:57:57 EST W2nKA3JI No.75513 Reply
well they aint gods chosen people thats for sure
Charlotte Crellyspear - Tue, 11 Jun 2019 22:26:59 EST 78vEgG5F No.75514 Reply
is your name a wizard because of wizchan?

because it sure seems like you are a wizard of that caliber.
A_Wizard !cMZsY.BCnU!!vVWR8L52 - Wed, 12 Jun 2019 03:32:36 EST E+xhxU97 No.75515 Reply
No, I never posted there... it honestly weirded me out when I looked at it...
It was just the most generic magical sounding name I could come up with at the moment. It seemed like a good counter to randi, so I went with it, without any intention of holding onto it... though shortly after namefagging here, I was doing some runework downtown and someone asked "what are you maaan?" right as the lsd kicked in, and I slurred out "I'm aaaaa wiiiizard!" and then the name fucking stuck both offline and on...
Charlotte Crellyspear - Wed, 12 Jun 2019 15:41:37 EST 78vEgG5F No.75520 Reply
if you’re so damn magical why can’t you go outside, stop posting and stop being insufferable?
A_Wizard !cMZsY.BCnU!!vVWR8L52 - Wed, 12 Jun 2019 18:15:49 EST E+xhxU97 No.75521 Reply
I have a magical tablet that allows me to shitpost without the need of being attached to leylines via wires, pleb.
Henry Saddleshit - Wed, 12 Jun 2019 21:39:33 EST 78vEgG5F No.75523 Reply
you didn’t answer why you can’t be insufferable tho
John Pockhall - Thu, 13 Jun 2019 07:59:53 EST W2nKA3JI No.75524 Reply

you are insufferable. Most people are when you have the Tism. say things that are correct logically, fucking hell. half the shit you people post is hur dur not funny. I hope everyone one day has tism and it's the default and people like you are the ones who get rejected from society and made to feel weird and out of place. FUCK OFF
Phyllis Hondernock - Thu, 13 Jun 2019 08:11:33 EST PetoACgc No.75526 Reply
>I put on my robe and wizard's IP
Nice try wizard
A_Wizard !cMZsY.BCnU!!vVWR8L52 - Fri, 14 Jun 2019 13:21:59 EST E+xhxU97 No.75540 Reply
No, the only linguistic match they had with me was saying "the tism" and that's still not how I say it.
Anyone care to correct them?
Fucking Fassletot - Tue, 27 Aug 2019 11:15:11 EST 1f06n2MY No.75854 Reply
do you even know what the word deception, means?
Clara Worthinghood - Fri, 16 Oct 2020 01:13:17 EST CRZwUGds No.76983 Reply
reminder nobody proved him wrong yet
Lydia Clobblefirk - Thu, 22 Oct 2020 10:43:37 EST zpzOsir5 No.77002 Reply
rest in piss you old bitch
Archie Blackbanks - Thu, 22 Oct 2020 16:24:32 EST debTUwkz No.77003 Reply
Was about to say

James Mother Fucking Randi has died (RIP)

William Beffingforth - Mon, 26 Oct 2020 13:29:39 EST nUJTorEk No.77010 Reply
nigga's dead, yo
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