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- Wed, 07 Dec 2016 16:09:37 EST mswwHH6I No.78386
File: 1481144977392.jpg -(169265B / 165.30KB, 1000x744) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. Salt
in a context of conducting a synthesis, does it matter whether a reagent is in a form of a salt or not? can you even make such a general statement?

i'm asking because im interested in the chemistry behind converting codeine phosphate to morphine. does it matter whether someone uses codeine phosphate or codeine freebase?

pic unrelated
>>
Fanny Fibblelut - Thu, 08 Dec 2016 21:26:40 EST fcvYqiwy No.78390 Reply
>>78386
Well if there's a step to initially convert the codeine salt -> base, then you could skip that step if it's already freebase codeine.

I think even if you start with the wrong type and follow the instructions, it'll turn out okay.
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Ebenezer Sabbermeck - Sat, 10 Dec 2016 18:24:51 EST mswwHH6I No.78393 Reply
>>78390
actually it's the other way around, i can't be bothered to convert the salt to the freebase. I'll obviously do it if I have to but I was interested if there is some kind of rule of thumb for this
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Lillian Debblehuck - Sun, 11 Dec 2016 18:22:47 EST mswwHH6I No.78395 Reply
>>78394
Codeine. I got it in Phosphate form.

But since you are asking: I guess it does matter?
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Bombastus !uYErosQbLM!!Mybq1UbK - Sun, 11 Dec 2016 18:43:11 EST iZfP1j72 No.78396 Reply
>>78395
Ah, I see. I thought you were doing a reaction with the codeine phosphate and wanted to know what you were doing with it.

In most reactions, you'll have to only calculate the moles in the weight as 30mg of codeine does not mean 30mg of pure codeine. Rather, they include the phosphate weight as well. 30mg of codeine anhydrate has 30mg of codeine in it. 30mg of codeine phosphate has 20 something mg of codeine and like 7 or so mg of phosphate (too lazy to do that math - you figure it out).

It will matter in some water sensitive reactions and depending on the ion exchange, it could matter. But in most cases involving a base, the phosphate would be generated anyway.
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James Lightspear - Sun, 11 Dec 2016 23:56:05 EST 9Opqdgsf No.78397 Reply
Depends on the solvent your going to carry out your reaction in. In most cases i can think of the freebase is required. Careful, codeine is easily destroyed by strong acids and bases. Hell, even heat and a little too much ammonia will do it. Also too much water and it will stay in the aqueous layer. Work as small as you can because 9 times of of 10 you will have failures.

codeine 300g/mol
codeine phos 397g/mol
ammonia 17g/mol
sodium carbonate 106g/mol

0.001mol 1mmol codeine phosphate = 397mg
add 1mmol ammonia = 17mg or 170mg 10% ammonia
or add 0.5mmol carbonate because there are 2 sodiums = 53mg
and you should be left with 300mg codeine

In reality you will likely need a little more base in many cases, but it gives you a general idea how much to start with.
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Schepperschop - Wed, 14 Dec 2016 18:16:13 EST xTIigKo1 No.78404 Reply
Want morphine?
Ask Papaver!
That difficult?
Not really.

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