Leave these fields empty (spam trap):
Name
You can leave this blank to post anonymously, or you can create a Tripcode by using the format Name#Password
Comment
[i]Italic Text[/i]
[b]Bold Text[/b]
[spoiler]Spoiler Text[/spoiler]
>Highlight/Quote Text
[pre]Preformatted & Monospace Text[/pre]
[super]Superset Text[/super]
[sub]Subset Text[/sub]
1. Numbered lists become ordered lists
* Bulleted lists become unordered lists
File

Sandwich


420chan is Getting Overhauled - Changelog/Bug Report/Request Thread (Updated July 26)

High stats yay or nay?

Reply
- Sun, 04 Aug 2019 17:26:50 EST 3lnuw7+U No.29240
File: 1564954010676.jpg -(111546B / 108.93KB, 600x838) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. High stats yay or nay?
high stats dont always matter when your dice are rolling low all night.
>>
Ernest Gurringville - Mon, 05 Aug 2019 06:49:43 EST 6LUU3Ig1 No.29241 Reply
>>29240
You probably have unbalanced dice, then. Different systems have ways around bad rolls, though. The simplest one is for the DM to just ignore the dice. Then there are skills that permit rerolls, or you get to choose dice out of a pool, or use fate/story points which allow a player to basically be the DM for a short time and guide the story.
>>
Beatrice Honningkot - Mon, 05 Aug 2019 09:11:09 EST /UFA0j8/ No.29242 Reply
>>29241
So many players forget about fate points. I give them out like candy because I want my players who are having bad luck to be able to reroll. Also, in 5e, you get to add a d6 to the reroll as well.
>>
Fuck Crabberfuck - Mon, 05 Aug 2019 13:51:02 EST 3lnuw7+U No.29247 Reply
>>29240
I had a couple high stats and people (not the other playerrs) claimed my character was overpowered. Unbalanced dice or not a +4 wont matter much if I roll a 5 for a concentration check ( for an example).
>>
Fuck Crabberfuck - Mon, 05 Aug 2019 13:52:54 EST 3lnuw7+U No.29248 Reply
DM also hands out Inspiration like snack cakes and we just forget to use them.
Our fault honestly.
Used my Inspiraton last session to make my first attack roll hit with Scorching Ray.
>>
Angus Pockfield - Mon, 05 Aug 2019 15:40:35 EST kHFm3y/Z No.29249 Reply
1565034035015.jpg -(30878B / 30.15KB, 468x468) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
Would it help to represent the fate/inspiration points with shiny tokens? Something that makes players actually feel like they've got something to spend, and providing that whole 'pretend economical interaction' reward feeling that's been integrated into our brains since we were tiny kids playing pretend.
>>
Archie Duckbury - Mon, 05 Aug 2019 18:30:35 EST POjTtIrc No.29250 Reply
>>29247
There is a certain amount of not fun when the other players secondary skills are better than what you focused in. This is particularly pronounced in 5th because of bounded accuracy but I played a game of 3.5 where one player had to give up on his concept while 2 of the people on the table were (to start with) better at things we specialised despite being focused on other stats. I've used arrays or the like in every campaign though I'm considering having the next one be rolled but we all have the same array. That sounds like the best of both worlds.

If you can't avoid this imbalance then if you roll stupid stats then play a support class. People won't bitch if your starting 20 just means your bard has all the inspiration to use on saving them with cutting words or boosting their rolls or whatever and then your second talent (first being con durability obviously) being inspiring leader means they all get stronger instead of you pulling further ahead while they're just investing to stay on the curve. Then you cast buff spells on them or debuff the enemy. Cleric, Diviner wizard also do this well but can also lay down whupass if need be. Diviner also gets around the shitty rolls problem because if your portents are garbage you make enemy fail saves and if they're good you pass checks with them (or give your paladin, barbarian, half orc or rogue allies crits).

Too late now but this is your karma for rolling high stats and then not using them to glorify your allies.

Also to be honest bard is so much fun. Lore bard at level 5 with cutting words turning enemy hits into misses and recharging on short rest is glorious. I'm the most underwhelming low damage person on every adventure I come on with that character but everyone fucking loves me. I also stack cooking tools proficiency (+1 on health recovered per hit dice used if I cook a meal) with songs of rest so they barely need to spend any hit dice to get a fuckload of HP back. I don't have to do shit all. No one has ever failed a dissonant whispers save yet. Ever though but it's fine because I have healing word, bane and I can use my instrument of the bards for protection from good/evil. I have just hit 5 so I am also able to fuck shit up with hyponotic pattern but that is my only power play and it still requires my allies murder everything

As far as dice go, dice can be weighted. People will tell you about testing for weighted dice and recommend brands but I just bought a shitload of dice sets and every session I pick 2 or 3 out and use them. Over time I imagine they're random. There's definitely a couple of sets where the D20 rolls 20 a lot. One of my players stole the door from an adamantite bunker and carried it 200 miles to have it forged into armour so he took normal damage on a crit and if I'm honest I think it was a very sound tactical decision.
>>
Fuck Crabberfuck - Mon, 05 Aug 2019 18:45:17 EST 3lnuw7+U No.29251 Reply
>>29250
We just hit 7th level and were being run through Tomb of Annihilation.
I'm a High Elf Light Domain Cleric. Pretty fun even with some lopsided stats. I rolled well but as it is I have to swap dice out. Right now I'm breaking in the dice that came with the Essentials Kit.
>>
Fuck Crabberfuck - Mon, 05 Aug 2019 18:47:28 EST 3lnuw7+U No.29252 Reply
>>29251
We have a Rogue/Lore Bard or is it a Lore Bard/Rogue?
Not sure what he took first but he's pretty beefy.
>>
Ernest Gurringville - Mon, 05 Aug 2019 19:28:08 EST 6LUU3Ig1 No.29253 Reply
>>29249
A token would probably be good, but it should be something larger than a player model, and maybe be something to covet. Try to have a symbolic element to it, you know?

A small hourglass (30 seconds or a minute)- you get to auto-succeed while the timer ticks down; you start the timer on your turn, and it continues to run. Maybe you get an extra turn of auto success if every one else is quick with their turns and you still have some sand going. Hell, make it a 2 minute timer, the whole team auto-succeeds while it ticks down, and you'll see turn times plummet.

Character props- a variety of class related hats, tools, or weapons- DM sets a bible in front of the cleric to count as his fate point, cleric cashes it in to the DM to use it. A prop aids the roleplay by giving a visual element, and is a weighty, tangible token, hard to ignore or forget. Some players might be motivated to roleplay better to earn their token back, if they like the token. "What do I have to do to get my XYZ back?"
>>
Fuck Crabberfuck - Mon, 05 Aug 2019 19:45:51 EST 3lnuw7+U No.29254 Reply
>>29253
our Pathfinder DM gave us sea shells to represent our Fate points.
>>
Henry Hondlechick - Tue, 06 Aug 2019 12:02:39 EST kHFm3y/Z No.29256 Reply
>>29253
>Use puppies as fate point tokens
>No one uses their fate points any more
>On the upside, everyone has a puppy to pet now
>>
Betsy Brockledale - Mon, 12 Aug 2019 00:04:04 EST WlJcaDHb No.29267 Reply
>>29249
i like making them pay with ability damage for free rerolls
>>
Doris Horringridge - Mon, 12 Aug 2019 10:23:06 EST 6LUU3Ig1 No.29268 Reply
>>29267
Permanent, or temporary? Like "you can reroll that strength check to strain as you lift. -2 to strength for a month while your torn muscle heals, though"?
>>
Edwin Piffingmure - Mon, 12 Aug 2019 12:30:12 EST kHFm3y/Z No.29269 Reply
>>29268
Temporary would be too logical and doesn't hurt the players' feelings enough, though.
>>
Polly Drockleworth - Mon, 12 Aug 2019 20:02:46 EST 6LUU3Ig1 No.29270 Reply
>>29269
If we're talking DnD permanent isn't permanent, though. Greater Restoration undoes "permanent" stat damage. You need a level 9 cleric to cast it, but it's significantly easier than coming across a wish.
>>
Beatrice Buzzhall - Wed, 14 Aug 2019 00:50:45 EST kHFm3y/Z No.29271 Reply
>>29270
>"Alright guys, change of plans. We're not going to rescue the noble's daughter until we've found a high level cleric."
>DM makes a for-fucks-sake expression. "OH HEY THE HIGH PRIEST OF THIS LAND HAPPENS TO BE GRACING THE NEARBY TOWN WITH A VISIT!"
>>
Shit Dablingwill - Wed, 14 Aug 2019 14:14:32 EST 6LUU3Ig1 No.29272 Reply
>>29271
It's perfectly reasonable, especially if you have been debilitated. As far as stats go, the average person is a 10, and a peak Olympic athlete might be a 12. PCs are basically demigods, and if I had the power to crush boulders bare handed, then suddenly became as weak as a mundane, I would stop adventuring at least until that shit was fixed. Maybe the lawful good paladin or the chaotic stupid fighter will continue the quest while gimped to prove their worth through skill or righteousness instead of might, but anyone reasonable will bail.

It's also something to keep in mind. Your level 3 party will be affected a lot more by a stat decrease than your level 10 party. Level 3s will need a side quest and find help; level 10s just need to spend a spell slot.

Also, a reasonable adventurer would be straining himself for a reason, you know, during the course of the quest in order to succeed. If he's trying to juggle horses at the inn before embarking on the quest and fucks himself up, then dips on the quest, he wasn't much of a hero to begin with.
>>
Cedric Gabberson - Fri, 16 Aug 2019 12:53:31 EST IB8IU88l No.29273 Reply
>>29272
I think if a level 1 can be 16 and olympic athletes are the most phenominally talented people who have spent years training that maybe you're compressing it a bit. A peak olympic athlete does not have a carrying capacity of 10 pounds more than a commoner unencumbered.
>>
Archie Winkinbury - Fri, 16 Aug 2019 20:09:10 EST O8WkDvSK No.29274 Reply
>>29273
PCs are freaks, did you forget that? Class levels are for freaks only. Only a freak can take levels in fighter, cleric, or wizard. Commoners get levels in soldier, acolyte, and adept. Only a freak can be 6 standard deviations from the mean. Each stat point is roughly equivalent to a standard deviation.

Let's take IQ and map it to intelligence for example. The average is 10 int or 100 iq. The PHB and monster manuals require an int of 6 in order to speak and understand a language. A 60 IQ person can maybe tell you they are hungry, or distinguish a cat from a dog. An 8 int character is dumb, and an 80 IQ person is the same; they probably were in the slow and remedial classes, or barely scraped by with low Cs and Ds in every class. A 110 IQ person is smart, and a 120 IQ person is a genius. Less than 2% of all people have >120 iq

Following the same mapping, strongmen and top athletes would be physical geniuses, 6 strength would be anorexics and cripples. And carry weight/encumberence is completely different from raw strength. Anyone who climbs mountains, or hikes, or runs marathons can tell you that a single pound is significant. 10 extra pounds in your rucksack as you march 20 miles is a nightmare. Climbers and hikers look to reduce GRAMS on their gear, because every bit matters. Soldiers argue about who will carry the machine gun, which is ~15lbs heavier than a standard rifle, and is considered to be a massive burden, so much so that machine guns are a 2man crew: one strong as fuck guy to carry the 15lb gun, and another strong guy to carry the ammo.

Also look at the effect of encumberence: fatigue. If you sit at a weight bench, you might be able to pump out infinite reps at weight Y, which will be lower than your maximum lift X, but at Y+10 you'll start slowing down eventually and then won't be able to continue. In order to be able to do infinite reps at Y+10, you will need to become much stronger than X+10.
>>
Hedda Worthingworth - Sat, 17 Aug 2019 20:39:23 EST IB8IU88l No.29278 Reply
>>29274
>A 110 IQ person is smart, and a 120 IQ person is a genius. Less than 2% of all people have
no. 15 IQ is one standard deviation. The IQ to int mapping works pretty well.Slap a 0 on the end and it works well. But then you realise that actually 120 is actually where you start to notice "this guy is kind of smart". And 12 is where the person is discernably smarter to the point where it makes a measurable difference. If you were right then someone mechanically no different (10 and 11) are obviously measurable in real life. Someone with an INT of 19 is 6 standard deviations above the norm.

Physical stats are the same. An olympic athlete is several standard deviations out. A pound might be the difference for a marathon runner but combat isn't marathon running and they aren't strength characters. Top long distance runners aren't just lean, they have little elastic bands on their arms. But melee combat isn't that. It's short (1 minute usually) bursts of action with lots of walking 3mph in between.

Veterans have 14 strength and the guards of cities have units of them. You need 15 strength to wear plate without your combat effectiveness reduced. So you're saying that basically no one ever wore plate? Firefighters wear 60lbs of gear. Soldiers carry body armour, rations and stuff. By core rules each point of str increases your unencumbered carry by 5 pounds so that machine gunner is 3 points higher. Lifting weights is very different from encumbrance too. Being able to lift 10 pounds more doesn't mean carrying 10 pounds more. It makes a little difference.

Report Post
Reason
Note
Please be descriptive with report notes,
this helps staff resolve issues quicker.