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I have pinpoinnted the exact card whose design started MTGs descent into power creep bullshit

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- Tue, 28 Apr 2020 11:56:58 EST 8l2jKlXA No.29506
File: 1588089418725.png -(174925B / 170.83KB, 265x370) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. I have pinpoinnted the exact card whose design started MTGs descent into power creep bullshit
It all starts with watchwolf. A 3/3 for 2 now seems like trash, but in 9th edition this was fucking unheard of. Creatures with more power than converted mana cost always had some drawback. Cant block, can only attack under certain circumstances, has to attack every round, upkeep, is removed at the end of round, always something.

This motherfucker is the exact point where the game broke and turned into bullshit.
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Jack Croddlechore - Tue, 28 Apr 2020 14:45:39 EST 6LUU3Ig1 No.29507 Reply
>>29506
It has a drawback, being 2 colors, and those colors not being particularly synergistic. It would be strong if it were monocolor requiring 2 colored or if it were blackgreen instead of whitegreen.
The color requirement gates you. if you play that on turn 2, then you cant play a WWW or a GGG on turn 3. Unless you forfeited your turn 1 by playing a dual land. Then your gotta onstruct your deck around that or burn cards throughmulligans until you cannhit your "overpowered" 2drop.
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David Tootworth - Thu, 30 Apr 2020 10:39:58 EST R5cdZOyx No.29510 Reply
>>29507
I dunno white and green have a lot of synergy with each other's primary strat. One has strong creatures and lots of them. One has creatures that work well with other creatures and the best auras. Maybe not a top tier combo but good enough that if you're playing current and not modern that it could easy be one depending what rotates in and out/

I played MTG years ago and then again for a spell and I don't feel it's power creep as much as creatures are stronger and other spells are less so.

I remember 1 red mana getting you 3 instant damage. 2 blue mana getting a counter on any spell. blue + x forcing your opponent to tap until they met X, and if they couldn't meet X they'd both tap out and you'd counter the spell. That kind of thing would get silly whenever you had a land advantage.

However new sets will always add a few new strong cards, legacy and modern cannot avoid power creep. Rotating standards it doesn't matter because old cards become obsolete by design.
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Eliza Bardwell - Tue, 05 May 2020 07:49:50 EST MVcGU3+H No.29515 Reply
>>29506
>the exact point where the game broke and turned into bullshit
Planeswalker are worse.
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Isabella Blomblecocke - Tue, 12 May 2020 15:10:36 EST UDLXqGBp No.29520 Reply
>creatures are stronger and other spells are less so.

This has gotten so incredibly stupid in the last few sets. Adventures in particular come to mind. There was a time when if a card did 2 things it was more expensive to compensate for that, not just "oh, it's a spell and a creature and you can cast both!" (often for cheaper than either would be individually.

Also the mentality that every creature should have abilities is nonsensical. All the 1/1 for 1 with 2 abilities creatures are so incredibly dumb.

Don't even get me started on color theory, that shit went out the window ages ago (except for Red for some reason).

Oh yeah, and this companion bullshit. If I wanted to play Commander I'd be playing Commander, we don't need a baby version in Standard (and that's not even the worst mechanic this set).
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Phineas Penderforth - Sat, 16 May 2020 11:38:30 EST kHFm3y/Z No.29521 Reply
>>29515
I kind of have to agree with this guy, if only because I played with some Planeswalkers that absolutely fucked over opponents by chewing away their decks and hands.
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Shit Somblebanks - Mon, 29 Jun 2020 07:41:56 EST e2017v1y No.29551 Reply
1593430916878.jpg -(664103B / 648.54KB, 2150x3035) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>29521
Planeswalker feel its own minigame. Why would it *not* use mana for activated abilities? What's with using hit points (loyalty counters) to use abilities?
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Clara Modgewell - Tue, 30 Jun 2020 10:13:05 EST R5cdZOyx No.29554 Reply
>>29551
Well it should be obvious.
>they need to ramp up to use their game winning abilities
Meaning you can't play one and hey, I've got 7 lands, win next turn.

>your opponent can deprive you of resources more directly
Players can attack and target with spells. This creates choice for them because they then have to work out if it's the best play.

>their life recovers slower than a creature but lifegain decks aside, faster than a player
To eliminate a planewalker your opponent needs to either sustain pressure or be able to afford a big push.

This combines to mean that if properly balanced might be the issue sometimes a planeswalker can't carry you. Some will help your strategy and some will allow you to win. However the latter require you be in a dominant position long enough to have the loyalty they need to use their game winning ability. Meaning you have to have the upper hand and be stable in that position because you need to be able to protect the planeswalker and have enough resources to capitalise on it. A lot of the time if your opponent isn't totally on the back foot they can delay or remove the offending planeswalker in which case all that ability does is force them to take pressure of your other threats.

I think they end up most OP when they are both cheap to summon and quick to fire their game enders. Or cheap to summon with really good passives/good loyalty gain abilities.

War of the spark added lower rarity planewalkers, these couldn't recover loyalty which made them much more limited. Also they balanced better because they were not high rarity. One of the things which makes planewalkers seem more OP is they are usually very rare and so overtuned as per most cards of their value.
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Ernest Shittingham - Tue, 14 Jul 2020 13:49:05 EST R5cdZOyx No.29563 Reply
>>29562
Planeswalkers as a mechanic are fine. The problem is that WOTC can't resist overtuning them because they're big lore characters and high value cards have to break the game because fuck fun when there's money to make. There are some pretty well balanced and manageable planewalkers. That one however is not one.

The is absolutely a case of
>Or cheap to summon with really good passives/good loyalty gain abilities.

This card is however currently sitting as a lynchpin in the most meta deck right now. One which costs an average of $10/card.
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Charles Nicklespear - Fri, 18 Sep 2020 19:48:01 EST GYRok82q No.29602 Reply
>>29601
Rosewater is an idiot. His design philosophy includes "I can do nothing wrong."

Colors at this point are meaningless, outside of red enchantment kill every color does everything, it's boring and lame.

>>29563
That Teferi is the perfect example of why planeswalkers as a mechanic are bad. Everything about it is wrong, and you're trying to explain it away with "but rarity." Cards that function as an ongoing sorceries (and you even get to pick which effect fires) are obnoxious enough, giving them a static ability on top of that is absurd, and in this particular case 3 mana is way too cheap (two colors in the casting cost doesn't offset this at all with how easy it is to get multiple/different colors).
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George Lightcocke - Mon, 21 Sep 2020 03:29:53 EST R5cdZOyx No.29603 Reply
>>29602
>and you're trying to explain it away with "but rarity."
Nah, I'm saying Teferi is completely broken but that doesn't mean every planeswalker is. War of the spark had a lot of balanced planeswalkers, but some were broken. I'm saying that it proved planeswalkers could work but that WOTC were prone to overtuning a lot of the rare ones (even for rare cards) and that's the real problem.
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Sophie Gadgetack - Wed, 23 Sep 2020 23:02:54 EST ghnZVLIB No.29606 Reply
>>29601
>White card draw.
Damn I play white in standard.
Revitalize is the only playable way now that dawn of hope rotates.
Bounty agent rotates too and that’s gotta be the best 25 cent card ever printed.
Lox is gone along with unbreakable formation.
Standards gonna probably suck with the new omnath and uro decks.
Darn
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Jenny Soffinghun - Fri, 25 Sep 2020 19:55:12 EST CFDbaCR8 No.29608 Reply
1601078112454.jpg -(1331008B / 1.27MB, 1478x2000) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>29554
>War of the spark added lower rarity planewalkers, these couldn't recover loyalty
Remember when rarity wasn't always a indication of power level? Now you have mythic rare burn spells that are clearly better than the lower rarity burn...
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Esther Fosslegold - Sat, 26 Sep 2020 06:45:59 EST R5cdZOyx No.29610 Reply
>>29608
>Remember when rarity wasn't always a indication of power level?
I remember rarity has correlated with power for ages, but it used to be that it was a trend whereas now it's prescribed. The variation of power relative to mana cost at a given rarity is much narrower. Overall rares were better and commons weaker but you're right, a few uncommons broke the game (power sink fucking lol), a few rares were underwhelming. I am not sure how much of this is intentional or if it was always the goal but wizards have gotten better at understanding their own game.

Doesn't have anything to do with the planeswalker mechanic though does it? There are plenty of reasons not to like MTG's model and thats why my last stretch playing was on the free game. But it sounds like you're just angry at wizards model.

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