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Why do customers tolerate this?

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- Sat, 27 Apr 2019 19:14:05 EST NzFXXqPm No.735812
File: 1556406845124.jpg -(76719B / 74.92KB, 750x750) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size. Why do customers tolerate this?
Full price game + microtransactions + subscription-based membership + pre order exclusive + in-game ads
>>
thread portfolio - Sat, 27 Apr 2019 19:44:13 EST 55eMmJGB No.735814 Reply
The development of AAA games is getting more and more expensive and inflation is rising and rising. It's actually impressive that they manage to keep new games at 60 bucks. Microtransactions are actually great.
>>
Cecil Harvey - Sat, 27 Apr 2019 20:11:59 EST 5LYJws1L No.735817 Reply
>>735814
Games have always been sixty bucks young padawan. I remember buying my first NES game with my bro, which was dirt harry. It was 60 bones
>>
thread portfolio - Sat, 27 Apr 2019 20:21:22 EST 55eMmJGB No.735818 Reply
>>735817
yes, but the dollar is worth literally half of what it used to be worth in the 90's. If they accounted for inflation in full priced games today they'd cost 120 bucks. That's why they have microtransactions in modern games. People today are too entitled
>>
Cain Highwind - Sat, 27 Apr 2019 21:25:44 EST qtSFEQvF No.735820 Reply
>>735814
As an adult with a job I would happily spend double on a well made complete game with a lot of single player content, if it was guaranteed it was the last I'd have to spend on it.

The reality is these games are trying to make the most money they possibly can.

To do that they will spend as little as possible to make it, charge as much as they can to get it in the hands of enough people who will watch the ads and buy the micro fees.
>>
honk - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 00:27:11 EST hRfsG87y No.735825 Reply
1556425631000.jpg -(189979B / 185.53KB, 879x670) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>735820
>I would happily spend double
Well that's silly. I'm all for spending an extra couple bucks for a better product, but spending double seems entirely unnecessary. I'll spend $60 or less on a video game or not spend anything at all.
>>
Dr. Yang - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 01:32:23 EST ixzXtY/u No.735833 Reply
>>735825
This is why games are designed like OP’s. It has it’s ups and downs. Microtransactions allow the companies to make money. And no one wants to pay $120 every time they get a new game. $60 games keep them accessible.

Microtransactions for cosmetics are whatever, but for fear/loot boxes I say boooo.
>>
AC !QqL8nX9URE - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 07:28:13 EST gNBJa0Vj No.735845 Reply
>>735814
>The development of AAA games is getting more and more expensive

This is actually incorrect garbage posted by the publishers themselves.

As the tech gets better its getting cheaper and cheaper to make these games. The only real growing cost in the industry are the fucking advertisement budgets.
>>
AC !QqL8nX9URE - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 07:33:47 EST gNBJa0Vj No.735846 Reply
>>735845
>In 2009, EA executive Rich Hilleman indicated in a speech that his company "now typically spends two or three times as much on marketing and advertising as it does on developing a game."
>>
Gabriel Belmont - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 07:47:22 EST 5m2HLjj9 No.735849 Reply
>>735814
60 is reasonable only for highest budget blockbusters, most games would make tons of profit at 30 or less, provided theyre good enough to sell a million copies.

60 dollars price tag is a relic of times where computers were new, it should have dropped over time just like hardware did.
>>
Four - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 08:26:50 EST uBciWMIL No.735852 Reply
>>735846
Why bother making a good game when you can just market a bad one aggressively till all the idiots buy it?
>>
The Vault Dweller - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 10:12:26 EST OH/OGlHP No.735857 Reply
Kind of related but I've been trying out Imperator Rome. It might be the best game Paradox has ever made? It's got all these complex and interacting mechanics lifted from vicci and CK and EU. But it's still a Paradox game in 2019, it literally feels like an early beta, it doesn't seem like they ever actually tested the game on smaller than a 1080p monitor because the UI scaling and the way they clutter visual information just does not work right on anything smaller than that, there are weird and buggy interactions moving your units around forts like they havn't had this mechanic working in EU4 for literally years, there's absolutely no content whatsoever other than bare bones mechanics unless you play as Rome.

We all know by the time it feels like its actually ready to have come out that'll be after 2 years and 300 dollars of DLC.
>>
Raziel - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 12:00:22 EST ywYhFWXS No.735861 Reply
>>735814
You know it's idiots like this that are responsible for everything being so fucking expensive.
>>
>>
Bolozof Velasgo - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 12:07:46 EST ov57xDpt No.735864 Reply
Because they're drooling retards and deserve to be treated as such. yarr.
>>
Tidus - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 15:11:05 EST Aw84ePHe No.735870 Reply
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I bought Duke Nukum for a buck.

I bought Doom for five bucks.

I got GTA 1 and 2 for free.

I bought Thief and thief 2 for twenty bucks.

I bought dark souls for five bucks. Then I spent a few hours getting the mods to work so that it actually played and rendered.

I bought GTA4 for five bucks. Rockstar did not bother porting it.
>>
Anton Slavic - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 15:15:35 EST Mz5DvYKJ No.735871 Reply
>>735817
My first game was either Diablo or Starcraft Broodwars, maybe AoE. They were $20 retail and they came with a huge manual and sometimes foldout tech trees, actual posters you could pin to your actual wall, and strategy guides or lore booklets. Now you get a bag of dicks for $60. So I'd tell you go eat a bag of dicks but you already are.
>>
Anton Slavic - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 15:18:31 EST Mz5DvYKJ No.735872 Reply
>>735818
If you accounted for inflation games would only cost $40. Is this a serious post? Was that over the top bait? Larry Probst you absolute faggot is that you?
>>
Brad Vickers - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 15:41:27 EST JaZGEw9c No.735874 Reply
>>735872
Look who you responded to. He said that strictly to get some attention.
>>
Raziel - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 16:11:28 EST ywYhFWXS No.735879 Reply
>>735871
I'm fucking pissed they don't put instruction manuals in game cases anymore.
Now its either empty with a disc or some little pamphlet advertising DLC or another game.
What completely baffles me is that these greedy fucks charge the same amount for digital downloads. You basically eliminated your entire overhead for disc production but you're going to charge the same price as a disk.
I predict gaming is going to be completely digital in the next 20 years and the faggots who run these companies are only going to charge more. This is the future of gaming: pay more for less product while anus lickers call you entitled for being pissed odd by it.
>>
JC Denton - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 17:28:51 EST IrHSPSUc No.735885 Reply
>>735879
Same model the music industry uses with CDs. At first they were more expensive so they slashed royalties. Now they're cheaper but royalties remain low.
>>
Anton Slavic - Sun, 28 Apr 2019 18:03:05 EST Mz5DvYKJ No.735886 Reply
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>>735885
I hate to say it butthe problem is once again Capitalims. Like I wouldn't even mind if the money were going to the devs themselves but it isn't. Most of the money is going to people who didn't even make the damn game but instead to people who the devs themselves may well have been fighting just to not completely fuck the game up from business suit assholes and marketing and PR or whoever else. As someone else noted already two thirds of the cost in games is going towards bullshit like marketing and advertising. Which means the basic economic model of a triple AAA studio is to just keep churning out the most safe and utterly garbage game possible and then shelling out lots of money to convince a bunch of idiots it's not complete shit. And then a bunch of idiots buy it anyway and wonder why bad games keep getting made while good ones get ignored. This is particularly noticeable in any kind of vidya journalism or game rating system where the corps just astroturf to fuck and back so you don't know the game is terrible until you've already paid for it.
>>
Raziel - Mon, 29 Apr 2019 01:36:47 EST a4UdNWiG No.735900 Reply
>>735886
You say problem is capitalism as if under communism or whatever system of state controlled market we would have such a variety of games at all. Like all we need is a strong politician to come to those evil game companies and fix them with a threat of violence.

The problem is not with freedom, its with sophistication of average consumers and employees attitude towards responsibility. All we have to do is not buy from abusive companies and not work for them, but such a shift requires time and effort on our part. Calling daddy government is a shortsighted nonsolution that brings even more injustice with it.
>>
Hammer Bro. - Mon, 29 Apr 2019 05:49:22 EST LxBRLC4z No.735907 Reply
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Stop buying games from big companies. Don't preorder anything, I don't give a fuck what it is, don't do it you fucking neanderthal. Stop being a fucking retard
>>
James Randi - Mon, 29 Apr 2019 06:35:38 EST s0c/vOV6 No.735911 Reply
1556534138141.jpg -(631609B / 616.81KB, 2112x4608) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
Micro transaction in my game is the same as commercials on cable tv.

They told us it was to keep cost down and this may have been true at one time but now the commercials are riding front seat with the actual show now some times getting less show time.

Fuck people watch the superbow/ emmys/ etc l just for the commercials.

Games are on this path, eventually you will have to buy anti malware protection for games you legally bought because they will contain more ads and microtransactions that will slowly shift into more predatory and unclear.
Loot box gambling and micro transaction and season passes are just the beginning.
>>
>>
Marcus Fenix - Mon, 29 Apr 2019 06:45:19 EST zlA+2kFy No.735913 Reply
>>735911
If AAA games are like TV than we should rejoyce over their slow decline and inevitable death while playing pc indie master race titles.
Let retards watch the commercials channel.

Mark my words, times are changing, we're on a cusp of a great new era of enlightened consumerism.
>>
Hammer Bro. - Mon, 29 Apr 2019 06:51:17 EST LxBRLC4z No.735914 Reply
>>735913
>we're on a cusp of a great new era of enlightened consumerism.

I wish

Nah son, people are fcking retards and I fear whales are enough to sustain the big companies, even if everyone else stops
>>
Marcus Fenix - Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:46:07 EST zlA+2kFy No.735921 Reply
>>735914
Whales and predators willing to exploit them might well be impossible to eradicate, but that doesnt mean times are not changing or that the future has no potential to be glorious.
I remember when I said the same thing few years ago related to Bethesda and was met with a chorus of "people are dumb, they will always eat that shit up", but look at where we're now. Things are changing fast and nobody cant stop it.
>>
CRAPCOM !SNGayGTIcE - Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:45:34 EST VeIaNXXy No.735951 Reply
1556563534392.png -(133772B / 130.64KB, 960x720) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
>>735825
Here's that same image, adjusted for inflation.
>>
Lester the Unlikely - Mon, 29 Apr 2019 23:51:49 EST 4VPVikJ9 No.735984 Reply
>>735845
I don't think that's true at all. As games grow larger and longer the content-costs to the developers (not the publishers who typically handle marketing/advertising) are rising dramatically. This is because it still takes modellers, animators, and texture-artists about the same amount of time (or possibly more, due to higher quality standards) to make assets as it used to in the past. So instead of compromising with smaller games with less content, most non-indie companies are simply hiring more people to work on games (which of course costs more money spent in the development of the games themselves).

Let's look at some concrete examples.

This set of examples is just the Windows (PC) releases of the Frictional Games main entry games (Penumbra, Amnesia, SOMA), all sourced from Mobygames for consistency:
[2007] Penumbra: Overture: This game was made by 13 developers (Frictional Games was basically an indie studio at the time). https://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/penumbra-overture-episode-1/credits
[2011] Amnesia: The Dark Descent: This game was made by 36 developers (not counting "Beta Testers" or "Special Thanks"). https://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/amnesia-the-dark-descent/credits
[2015] SOMA: This game was made by about 130 developers before I stopped counting. https://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/soma/credits

Similarly let's also do a comparison with the mainline Elder Scrolls series (also all Windows or DOS, also all Mobygames, not counting expansion packs, etc.):
[1994] Elder Scrolls 1: Arena: 26 developers. https://www.mobygames.com/game/dos/elder-scrolls-arena/credits
[1996] Elder Scrolls 2: Daggerfall: 30 developers plus 38 "beta testers and council of wisdom". https://www.mobygames.com/game/dos/elder-scrolls-chapter-ii-daggerfall/credits
[2002] Elder Scrolls 3: Morrowind: 87 developers (not counting the 38 "special thanks" people). https://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/elder-scrolls-iii-morrowind/credits
[2006] Elder Scrolls 4: Oblivion: 120 developers (not counting the 23 "additional QA" or the language test teams). https://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/elder-scrolls-iv-oblivion/credits
[2011] Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim: 253 developers. https://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/elder-scrolls-v-skyrim/credits

My point being that the development cost for creating a game *is* actually increasing. It's not just marketing and publishing budgets that are inflating (although those are certainly rising as well).
>>
AC !QqL8nX9URE - Tue, 30 Apr 2019 00:11:02 EST gNBJa0Vj No.735988 Reply
>>735984
You are forgetting about the vast amounts of liscensed software being used to make games these days. The only games with really large budgets that need them are the ones creating entire new engines or pushing their own in house engines harder than before.
Once an engine is made and perfected other games can purchase the license to use it and slap a game together in no time next to no cost. This is how we get such a large focus on yearly titles, especially sports games. Reuse an engine repeatedly to save on dev costs, update only the roster of the teams and maybe smooth out a few bugs or throw in some new form of micro transaction wankery, and then sit back every holiday season and make hand over fist.

I wont argue that Skyrim probably cost more money and man hours to make than Morrowind, but I would argue that Morrowind probably took more real "work" if you follow.
>>
Vyse - Tue, 30 Apr 2019 03:10:21 EST Mz5DvYKJ No.735992 Reply
>>735984
>grow larger and longer
Except that's largely not been happening. The exact opposite has been happening where games have been getting much smaller and much shorter. Starcraft is a perfect example. You had what, like 30-40 hours on the singleplayer campaign alone? And it had massive functionality for multiplayer and AI skirmishes. Fast forward to SC2 and they broke each races campaign into a separate $40+ game. Iirc WoL was like $60 and the others $40 right? And that's for, oh okay I as wrong supposedly it's 26-29 missions in WoL I thought I remembered it being like 12. Regardless it actually took a long time to beat games back then, much longer than it does now.

There is absolutely no excuse for all the complete fucking bullshit every aspect of society is pulling now. Remember how you also used to get a whole software suite with a PC? Now I can't even get fucking Microsoft word and an antivirus with a new spyware laden PC. Meanwhile the game publishers keep making shorter campaigns with less and less content and hoping you dont notice, and not even getting a physical copy of anything but they have the balls to charge people $80 to get the "digital soundtrack" and "digital wallpaper" I mean like ass the costs are rising because most wages have fucking stagnated too. This is nothing but disgusting cash grabs and frankly it's telling also how much of the time games have been switching to having the megacorp being the good guys and having this bizarre Ayn Randian philosophy embedded in games. This is the kind of crap you get with a society run by money worshippers and create a culture built around money worship. It isnt just games. There's no sense of decent craftsmanship anymore, no sense of honesty in business, and vidya publishers are right up there. I dont blame them for some shysty things given the amount of piracy, but you can't charge people $60 for a 12 hour game + microtransactions and tell me it's because games are getting "bigger and longer." They have almost all been getting smaller and shorter. You can even see it within a franchise. Go to howlongtobeat.com and type in the name for the first game in a series. Now go through all later games in a franchise and watch how almost every single time the average time to beat drops.
>>
Lester the Unlikely - Tue, 30 Apr 2019 07:21:15 EST 4VPVikJ9 No.735994 Reply
>>735988
Can you elaborate on the last part please? I don't follow.
>>
Adrian Ripburger - Tue, 30 Apr 2019 09:03:05 EST 1A4ti4qh No.735997 Reply
>>735994
My guess is he means Morrowind took more creativity vs raw work
>>
AC !QqL8nX9URE - Wed, 01 May 2019 06:56:52 EST gNBJa0Vj No.736111 Reply
>>735997
Pretty much yeah. While making Morrowind they were also making the tools and the engine for Morrowind, and they are still using those tools to this day.
>>
>>
Dr. Wright - Thu, 02 May 2019 02:51:50 EST uQXfywzr No.736168 Reply
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Also: None of this shit is new.

Stallman predicted this while he was still studying.

Software being supplied as a service while being charged for as a product will lead to double dipping, lack of support, lack of ownership and no freedom to edit, or even see the code you use.

Open source video games are the alternative. Anyone want to code an open source engine? Or got started already?
>>
Guy - Thu, 02 May 2019 15:43:02 EST BdnvxroW No.736185 Reply
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>>736168
>Software being supplied as a service while being charged for as a product will lead to double dipping, lack of support, lack of ownership and no freedom to edit, or even see the code you use.
Well of course, and it's even worse in the corporate world where products are intentionally made difficult or illegal to maintain in house or with third-party contractors to ensure increasing future business for the vendor.
>>
Cammy - Thu, 02 May 2019 15:54:21 EST cqXHNMKT No.736187 Reply
>>736185
And since Corporations are a massive circle jerk, the higher ups prefer this way, rather then finding better OS options.
>>
Lance Bean - Thu, 02 May 2019 17:07:02 EST 4VPVikJ9 No.736195 Reply
>>736168
Unity and Unreal are turning towards open-source but they're still both massive services *and* products in their own right, and they will both charge you a lot of money (percentage-wise) to use their engines.
>>
Kung Lao - Fri, 03 May 2019 12:50:33 EST X9vjuy2A No.736249 Reply
>Why do customers tolerate this?
???
I don't

maybe you shouldn't either?
>>
Capt. Bannon - Fri, 03 May 2019 22:04:12 EST 4VPVikJ9 No.736296 Reply
>>736253
Well Unreal Engine is already open-sourced, and Unity is currently in the process of open-sourcing all of their code.
>>
Rico Rodriguez - Sun, 05 May 2019 01:11:20 EST uQXfywzr No.736357 Reply
>>736185
Microsoft Windows taught everyone how to microtransaction, software planned obsolescence and software as service.

Games industry just took a while phasing these predatory practices in to software for children.

And yeah, answering OP question. Because children think this is how it has always been.
>>
Soma Cruz - Sun, 05 May 2019 03:35:02 EST RjMjoREJ No.736364 Reply
>>736357
Yup. This also applies to society in general. Our future depends on children learning history so we better make sure they know.
>>
Dr. Mario - Tue, 07 May 2019 06:07:46 EST jiBpCCJb No.736514 Reply
>>736513
Corporations will do whatever their customers demand.
They just want to make money, the fault is all ours.
>>
Abel - Tue, 07 May 2019 09:02:54 EST 93voU8ra No.736517 Reply
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My uncle was a lumberjack and had this on his truck.

He always had the good weed
>>
>>
Divayth Fyr - Sat, 11 May 2019 01:27:46 EST 4VPVikJ9 No.736741 Reply
>>736357
Wait, when did Windows have microtransactions? It's not like you could ever pay Microsoft $5 to get a cooler looking Start Menu insofar as I know.
>>
Hwoarang - Sun, 12 May 2019 05:08:29 EST 6mMUDwy9 No.736790 Reply
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>>736741
For all Microsoft Window's sins, I don't think it had mtx. Although pushing you to the new version which is still being beta-tested is a consumer-hostile move.
>>
Darkstalker Kaathe - Wed, 15 May 2019 18:38:51 EST fgvlMrG7 No.736992 Reply
>>735812
Worse is.. always online that makes you spend money. What if the servers get turned off?!?
>>
Gruntilda - Wed, 15 May 2019 20:09:51 EST BdnvxroW No.736999 Reply
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>>736741
MS is moving to SAAS whenever possible, there's a poisonous network of dependencies between parts of Windows, Visual Studio, Powershell, and Azure/TFS designed to decrease compatibility with alternatives to force more people to adopt the SAAS components and allow them to make more components SAAS.

After Extend, Expand, Extinguish, it's either SAAS or selling consultant services to maintain the shit you just sold.
>>
Franziska Von Karma - Wed, 22 May 2019 22:56:01 EST 4VPVikJ9 No.737396 Reply
>>736999
I'm not so sure about that. I feel like Microsoft is moving in a more platform-agnostic direction with offerings like VSCode and the Linux kernel on Windows.
>>
Bolozof Velasgo - Thu, 23 May 2019 14:37:45 EST S37RYOTi No.737418 Reply
>>737397
Marketing on the whole is less and less relevant to society as we have other sources. Word of mouth is more powerful than ever before. This is their last hurrah and attempt to stay relevant and they will drag it out decades but it's not sustainable. While it's a cliche, Bill Hicks had the right idea about it.

Game budgets are increasingly more marketing for more sales. But that shit has diminishing returns. Of course if anyone is good at selling bullshit it's marketers.
>>
April Ryan - Thu, 23 May 2019 15:53:48 EST OmaG+tjk No.737427 Reply
Sad truth is that marketing still works wonders, as does propaganda (which is basically the same thing but more covert and nuanced), and we as a species need to own up to this fact and take responsibility for becoming more resistant to it.
Wake up sheeple.
>>
>>
Soki - Thu, 23 May 2019 16:43:33 EST JAfM/azk No.737430 Reply
Pirate everything that isn't indie

Maybe pirate indie if the devs are cunts
>>
Yorda - Thu, 23 May 2019 16:55:49 EST t+p/jCic No.737431 Reply
>>737424
exactly. both indie and AAA keep trying to sell us an idea and once they get a price check on the work they have yet to start they try to get it done and fail every time. That's more accurate for most indies now but AAA does some thing similar. But it's more sinister because they will do a thing but then just throw it in the garbage because it doesn't have micro transactions, I mean, player monetization.
>>
Smiling Jack - Thu, 23 May 2019 18:49:16 EST AF6WylFH No.737440 Reply
>>737430

Indie is just as bad with microtransactions and incomplete games (some not all) . Still, pirate everything. None of them need your money more than you do.
>>
Arthur - Thu, 23 May 2019 19:02:37 EST 93voU8ra No.737442 Reply
>>737440
I used to be of this mindset. But there's now easily-injectable malware out there that can't be detected. Every time you run executables from the wild, you're fucking a loose lady without a condom. Might feel great but there may be consequences after.

I pirate only as a last resort
>>
Roger Wilco - Fri, 24 May 2019 01:07:22 EST T3q//dq4 No.737459 Reply
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>>737442
>not having a non-gaming system for secure transactions
>>
Big Boss - Fri, 24 May 2019 02:51:43 EST ixbrH7w1 No.737468 Reply
>>737467
>As long as they remain relatively autonomous it's a good thing.
No, a good thing would be Adobe created an innovative competing product instead of buying out the people that started a new wave of procedural content production. The only thing even close was Filter Forge and that shit is so awful that it doesn't even really compete.
>>
Kratos - Fri, 24 May 2019 03:12:47 EST 4VPVikJ9 No.737474 Reply
>>737468
There's going to be a new wave of procedural content production one way or another. Too many people are interested in it right now, and it's going to be too cost-effective for the games industry and film industries going forwards to ignore.
>>
Bubsy - Fri, 24 May 2019 05:23:29 EST JaZGEw9c No.737478 Reply
>>737476
>Well it's in your Creative Suite subscription now
Except it's not. If it were it would be in the list of available programs when I launch the CC app.
>>
Jarl Balgruuf - Sat, 25 May 2019 18:27:09 EST V4iwx5Q3 No.737543 Reply
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>>737481
Thanks what happens when marketing runs the company instead of programmers.
>>
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Master Chief - Sat, 25 May 2019 19:09:29 EST t+p/jCic No.737546 Reply
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>>737543
Marketing needs to be axed. it's a useless job that has been taken over by machines and ppls willingness and ability to share what they like as close to instantly as we can. And here I was thinking Truck driving was going to be the first automation victim.
>>
Soma Cruz - Sat, 25 May 2019 21:41:09 EST 4VPVikJ9 No.737556 Reply
>>737543
I'm not sure if a company has to be run entirely by programmers, but at least someone who cares more about the users than the marketing departments tend to.
>>
Sweet Tooth - Sat, 25 May 2019 22:31:02 EST t+p/jCic No.737564 Reply
>>737556
All of the best games were under the thumb of the programmers that gave a shit.
>>
Dr. Yang - Tue, 28 May 2019 06:16:00 EST SnP7Zoim No.737726 Reply
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>>737564
Amen. It's like choosing a chef-owner cafe/food truck/restaurant to a franchise.
>>
Paperboy - Tue, 28 May 2019 21:09:59 EST PZGQJQZK No.737759 Reply
>>737564
Well yeah I agree that the best games are made by the developers who cared the most. Certainly that makes sense. I'm just trying to point out that programmers are not the only people who work on games. There's always passionate artists and designers and writers and all sorts of people who, when they care so much about a game that they'll put their heart and soul into it, will end up producing a much better game experience.
>>
Richter Belmont - Tue, 04 Jun 2019 04:49:13 EST dc9M2mJn No.738149 Reply
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>>735988

AC, I've been reading your posts for years. Usually I agree mostly, sometimes not so much. Of all your layman's explanations to the readers of /vg/, I had to give you one of these for a real ass post that took the text off of my fingers
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Grendel the Green Gigas - Fri, 07 Jun 2019 21:23:55 EST O4Yia4Zd No.738363 Reply
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>>735812
Games as service (eg. WoW subscriptions)... do not bleed money from me forever, man.
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Princess Farah - Sat, 08 Jun 2019 21:50:56 EST U8Yqgh7Z No.738431 Reply
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Are mobile games the biggest part of the /v/idya game market now?
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C-Higgy !lfsExjBfzE - Wed, 12 Jun 2019 00:08:59 EST YnBBDGez No.738705 Reply
Because people would rather sit through and pay for extra shit than pay more than 60 dollars for a standard edition video game? Online subscriptions are the norm and it's not only just for video games. Microtransactions and lootboxes are what drive games as being a service and sustain a game's revenue stream. But that kind of stuff should only be optional not giving a player an advantage or at least keep it solely cosmetic.

Like fuck, how did customers deal with having to pay more than $60 for video games back before the 6th generation of consoles without all the microtransactions, DLC, patches and stuff like that?
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Sephiroth - Wed, 12 Jun 2019 02:40:10 EST LjQyY33m No.738718 Reply
this doesn't apply to me because I only play open source roguelikes and games made before 1995
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Kane - Fri, 14 Jun 2019 17:18:10 EST zGj+qNYe No.738850 Reply
>>735812 I don't like when this happens.
also a newfag to this website since the future shut down for a while.
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Dregs - Fri, 14 Jun 2019 17:42:02 EST qrPHyWe8 No.738852 Reply
>>738851
We know. It's called a cat planet, my jolly african-american. Now go back to the future.


Now you get it?
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Dregs - Fri, 14 Jun 2019 17:43:17 EST qrPHyWe8 No.738853 Reply
>>738852
holy shit cat planet isn't catplanet anymore? What's going on here.
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Koopa Troopa - Fri, 14 Jun 2019 21:18:42 EST 93voU8ra No.738863 Reply
>>738853
What are you talking about? cat planet never was catplanet.
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Luigi - Fri, 14 Jun 2019 21:40:04 EST 1PRipo9X No.738864 Reply
>>738863
???????
??
am I having a stroke? someone call my doctor i can't find my LifeAlert®
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Penelo - Sat, 15 Jun 2019 03:26:30 EST B8Sy1Aw2 No.738877 Reply
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>>738857
If that's true then apparently the future is a terrible place and some dystopian police force always tries to catch the escaped time prisoners fleeing to here. Imagine just how bad it must be if all the time prison refugees choose right now to come and hide in.
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Geno - Sat, 15 Jun 2019 07:10:53 EST ibcDXdUC No.738882 Reply
>>738877
Looking at history and its recuring patterns, we definitely live in the good old times
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AC !QqL8nX9URE - Tue, 18 Jun 2019 09:04:13 EST gNBJa0Vj No.739056 Reply
>>739055
Flashback was so fucking hard. It was like Out of this World only without as much trial and error and more skill based.
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Frogger - Sat, 12 Oct 2019 00:30:40 EST M26vrhyg No.744049 Reply
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All AAA games now are so horrible that they should only be played on the spooky tenth month of the year...
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Serah Farron - Fri, 15 Nov 2019 23:40:05 EST 2ps6pIg6 No.745943 Reply
Because for some reason people defend game companies to the DEATH. like seriously no one went out of their way to defend BP when they destroyed the environment in the gulf of mexico. but when Fallout 76 or Total War Three Kingdoms came out on old broken ass engine people where screaming at the top of their internet lungs "NEW ENGINES ARE EXPENSIVE TO MAKE!!!" as if multi-million dollar companies are impoverished and can't afford to reinvest their earnings back into the products that make them their money. makes me sick...
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Naomi Hunter - Fri, 15 Nov 2019 23:57:36 EST j75OC4Vb No.745944 Reply
>>745943
Multi billion. Not million. Fanboys are one chunk of the users ruining the industry.
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John Shepard - Sat, 16 Nov 2019 02:05:23 EST sQaWg6XX No.745951 Reply
>>745937
Dan hardly counts.

They made Dan intentionally and hilariously gimped. The character you use to handicap yourself to prove you're good at the game. One of his supers was always a taunt.

Not like Sakura, who is a pretty legit different spin on the shoto mechanics. Or Makoto for that matter but obviously that's a very different spin.
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Mr. X - Sat, 16 Nov 2019 02:22:44 EST ad/EhG4w No.745952 Reply
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>>745943
>like seriously no one went out of their way to defend BP when they destroyed the environment
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Alex Kidd - Tue, 19 Nov 2019 08:31:43 EST sbujqZ+N No.746151 Reply
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Character DLCs to pad the roster.
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Vic Viper - Tue, 19 Nov 2019 10:54:14 EST kKSHmi7l No.746157 Reply
>>735872
wtf are you talking about? $1 in 1992 is $1.83 in today's money. In what topsy turvy world do you think inflation makes things cheaper, you reet?
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Haohmaru - Tue, 19 Nov 2019 11:26:08 EST 8md5aTIY No.746159 Reply
>>746157
Responding to b8

Also, anyone remember buying NES games for $50? Holy fuck, can't believe I did that. Some really shitty ones too, like Bart vs the Space Mutants
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Cage Midwell - Tue, 19 Nov 2019 11:42:58 EST 5LYJws1L No.746160 Reply
>>746159
Yeah, I remember buying Dirty Harry for 40 bucks at wollsworth back in 92 with my brother. Man, did that game sucked.
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Marc Kai - Fri, 29 Nov 2019 12:18:29 EST LP0AjpMg No.746741 Reply
>>735818
And the size of the gaming market has increased many hundreds of times. AAA games now sell 100s of thousands more copies, some millions more. And digital distribution has slashed the costs of getting those sales.
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i hate videogames - Fri, 29 Nov 2019 13:04:18 EST 0toFiPe/ No.746750 Reply
because everyone who plays videogames is literally retarded and should be executed immediately
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Mario - Fri, 29 Nov 2019 15:21:22 EST J/SRRh3G No.746765 Reply
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>>746751
Customer..sorry, consumers defending companies? Cos poor underdog companies don't have enuff money or lawyers to protect themselves. /s
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KLEZ.fml !!cEQLOiCj - Fri, 29 Nov 2019 18:08:57 EST 5nRDyOou No.746779 Reply
>>735818
This is provably wrong. The only reason they do it now is because they CAN. The crypto, the server infrastructure, the network itself didn't make this shit technically feasible in the 90's, but even then the Konamis of the world realized they could take the same construct from their pachinko and apply it to vidya games if only the damn infrastructure supported it. If only they could have invented an addon credit card reader for the Playstation...
but hey enjoy your integrated ads in your NBA2K games if that's what you really want you tool. It must feel good knowing that ad money bought Strauss Zelnick a new Porsche whereas the actual devs probably didn't see a single cent from the ad buy.
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Frank West - Fri, 29 Nov 2019 19:21:31 EST EiEq6GOa No.746782 Reply
>>746779
No way, the industry just wasn't the same back then. They wouldn't have done quite the same thing.

Some developers would have focussed on making games for linux, amiga and maybe even BeOS and RISCOS in defiance.

They would have almost blatantly or just blatantly made better versions for other platforms.
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Frank West - Fri, 29 Nov 2019 19:50:49 EST EiEq6GOa No.746783 Reply
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>>735900
Oh yeah dude, it's just unimaginable what sort of utter horror video games would be under communism!

Okay, fine, if it was actually tried, then communist games could be imagined ... and easily, they'd be almost as horrible as open source games, except with a few times as many options, with a few times as much support for and in turn a few times as much content for each game, and a few times as many development tools for making content.

Oh yeah, and additionally, it would also be more confusing! Because in addition to Linux, there'd also be very similar support and development for GNU HURD, Syllable, Haiku, Plan 9 and and at least one Amiga FOSS OS. So you'd have many times as much sheer, torturous crap to sift through!

Unimaginable utter horror!
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Enoch - Fri, 29 Nov 2019 21:43:23 EST Mz5DvYKJ No.746786 Reply
>>735900
Why do you keep assuming we should ban things or shoot people? How about government funded videogames for example you ever thought of that? Just imagine if we could have art projects and get to play the actual flight simulators air force pilots and NASA use. Imagjne if playing a game actually taught you legitimate science and history. Hell you used to have to solve math problems as one way to bypass a sidequests in Star Wars games. Imagine if you could play a game and it teaches you how to make TATP and cook meth.

No the real problem is because it's driven by market forces and a majority of people are tasteless dumbasses. People made art not because they thought it would sell quickly but because they wanted to make a masterpiece, a symphony, a grand cathedral. So instead absolutely all we get is schlock day in and day out. It's exactly the same with the recording industry and Hollywood because all these people care about is money. This is what happens when you build a system literally around Mammon worship. All you get is cheap flimsy garbage. Literal objects. You know over a century ago the companies figured out it was a bad idea to actually craft quality goods? So they started deliberately building everything to be shitty enough to break in two years and you'd then have to buy a new one. The exorbitant totally unaffordable costs of American homes combined with their absolutely pure cardboard shittiness is the kind of thing that could only possibly exist in a system as absolutely shitty as American style Consumer Capitalism. I also don't see any reason to even have somebody involved in dictating the creative process and moving literally billions of dollars in executive decisions who buys Adam Sandler movies.
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Nathan Hale - Sat, 30 Nov 2019 03:38:07 EST WmL+PGI5 No.746797 Reply
>>746783
All government made games suck, not just communist.
All government endavours are inferior to private, except maybe wars.
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E. Honda - Sat, 30 Nov 2019 04:50:52 EST BJtLvEfC No.746801 Reply
>>746797
So what about socialism and UBI?

40 years ago you needed to chuck a load of money at music to make it not sound like this. Some time this millennium processing power because cheap enough that modeling expensive gear, audio recording and processing, and so on could be done on consumer electronics. This created a market segment which demanded affordable recording shit, and a few years later while it's not the same you can record music that sounds good using a bit of cash left over after you pay the bills.

We have things like the unreal engine and it's not quite there yet, but at some point there will be the tools where a small number of people can produce games which perhaps lack the fine polish of a AAA release but the gameplay, narrative, aesthetic/design and ideas all shine through. When that happens post scarcity gaming could be a wonderful place. A lot of people with games design degrees would simply be using their UBI and time to make games for the joy of making games and enrich our lives. Maybe our children will see such a day when they're old people, maybe we will. But that's a microcosm of how post scarcity could work. For art forms it's very much how it will work. The last jobs we can automate are care jobs and with an ageing population pretty much anyone could pick up a couple of care shifts and feed old people to fund some extra help if they can't just persuade people their idea is good enough.

That's a dream. It's a possibility and not a likely outcome but it could happen and it's better than capitalism, I mean we'd lose mega franchises like COD but on the bright side we'd loose mega franchises like COD.
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Sam Fisher - Sat, 30 Nov 2019 08:28:08 EST BdnvxroW No.746816 Reply
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>>746797
Jazz, and the modern art movement were funded by the CIA, the Witcher games were funded by the Polish government.

Non capitalist art is usually just the government funding the living expenses of artists to do their thing.
It allows the the creation of art independent of some capitalist parasite whose interests are directly opposed to the creation of great art.
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Sam Fisher - Sat, 30 Nov 2019 08:29:08 EST BdnvxroW No.746817 Reply
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>>746811
That exception is proving the rule false.

What exactly do you think "Exception that proves the rule" means?
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Nathan Hale - Sat, 30 Nov 2019 09:02:10 EST WmL+PGI5 No.746820 Reply
>>746816
Witcher was made by a private company that as you say happened to milk the government for some taxpayers money, like any polish taxpayer that gives more than half of his money to government would. Its not made by government in any sense, youre reaching very far with that one.
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Nathan Hale - Sat, 30 Nov 2019 09:03:39 EST WmL+PGI5 No.746821 Reply
>>746820
Wont even mention jazz cause what you say is too ridiculous.
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Sam Fisher - Sat, 30 Nov 2019 09:05:12 EST BdnvxroW No.746822 Reply
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>>746818 >>746819
"The exception that proves the rule" is an example you use to prove a rule true or false.

We've provided you examples where games funded by the state, including one that's blatant state propaganda rather than state-funded art are superior to most capitalist funded games.

These exceptions prove the rule "state-funded art is inferior" to be false.
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Sam Fisher - Sat, 30 Nov 2019 09:11:28 EST BdnvxroW No.746823 Reply
>>746820 >>746821
State-funded arts doesn't only refer to the state directly making art for propaganda purposes, it's usually a make-work program to keep artists doing their thing.

Even if Witcher was partly privately funded, it's still state art if it's funded by the state.
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Cinder - Sun, 01 Dec 2019 06:29:16 EST 0A/7mWP2 No.746864 Reply
Lol at people who actually want to pay taxes and fund politicians so that they can distribute the money that might have gone directly to the artist after cutting a very comfy salary from it.
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Jin Kazama - Sun, 01 Dec 2019 15:09:00 EST BdnvxroW No.746889 Reply
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>>746864
Don't pretend anyone except independent indie devs and the handful of coops actually reap the wealth they create, and even among them, they're getting fucked in the ass by the handful of marketplaces' massive cuts.
For every other dev, capitalists decide exactly how much money gets down to the artist.
Which from the conditions at EA and other AAA studios, we know is less income than is necessary to maintain your body and mind given the work load.

At least the politicians pretend to be accountable to me and don't have a direct interest in extracting as much money as possible while providing as little value as possible.
Direct ownership of the means of production, with or without state funding can't possibly produce worse results than capitalists forcing micro-transactions and shit literally no dev has ever imagined would improve their game.
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Vincent Valentine - Sun, 01 Dec 2019 17:20:47 EST qtSFEQvF No.746896 Reply
Image how much harder this would of been to normalize if gamers were more upset but game journalists never questioning monetization models than they were when they respect women.
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Nicole Brennan - Tue, 03 Dec 2019 01:42:44 EST hbTBWsD6 No.746931 Reply
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>>746896
Yeah, it was so much less of a quagmire when people were better able to understand that males too, and unattractive ones, could be incessantly galloping ditzes with bubblegum for brains. That was so much more appealing, when respect for one thing or another was something associated with a corner of society or another, instead of having whatever crumby half assed degree of "respect" for any particular kind of people universally mandated.

>>745943
It's because video games give people an illusion of doing stuff. But there's all sorts of rabid defenses of the peddlers and eager users of oil, like "death of a salesman". And not even just oil, but also fucking coal, what with how many times worse that is!

By now, they learned to be very careful about not giving the customers cheap opportunities to see faults in them, to not be casually deflating respect for their industry.

But with that, it's an industry that has much more generally developped a playbook for very proactively interacting with customers. And with that, they've taken it to the level of the art of partisanism, they know it's much more efficient if they can, even if they have to do it bit-by-bit, turn you into their agent.
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Fox McCloud - Tue, 03 Dec 2019 18:35:52 EST 0z+RVgZ0 No.746958 Reply
>>746816
>jazz funded by the CIA
>predominantly black music involved with civil rights n shit

Nope.
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Snow Villiers - Tue, 03 Dec 2019 19:07:02 EST z9B+LtCd No.746963 Reply
>>746961

32-128 bit eras were $50 standard for major releases. People got used to that and started complaining after when they went up to $60. But before those eras the games did go above $50, I don't remember if there were any standards as it seemed to vary. Would be interesting to find a price on release list.
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Professor Layton - Tue, 03 Dec 2019 19:50:15 EST pjGZdNtP No.746964 Reply
>>746963
ehhh...

Any of the games that dipped above 50 bucks generally were super high capacity cartridges for their time or contained expensive co-processors, extra RAM or other stuff that justified their price... if not their value.
Most NES/SNES era games were quite a bit cheaper for typical carts, like 40 bucks new, tops for NES with some SNES games for 50 barring shit like SuperFX games and the 32-48 megabit games like Chrono Trigger or Tales of Phantasia.

N64 games were often like 50% more expensive than Playstation games as well. Playstation games would get discounted quicker too.

People paid more for hardware, simple as that. With digital downloads and disc based games that cost a pittance to distribute and to a wider audience than ever... The prices really don't need to get jacked up.
Maybe 60 bucks is a fine incremental price hike and splitting the difference with inflation, but the rest of this shit, the season passes, the community-fracturing multiplayer map DLCs, the loot boxes. All opportunistic cash grab bullshit.

But consistently, the highest priced games, factoring in inflation, generally cost the equivalent of just under 100 bucks in today's money. With the low distribution costs of today... Some of these assholes are taking the piss. But in general even an expensive game with a season pass still comes in under 100 bucks and that's for damn good reason.
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6 days to go babyyyyyyyyy - Tue, 03 Dec 2019 20:06:00 EST JlEoQQQB No.746965 Reply
i think that microtransactions + subscription-based membership + pre order exclusive + in-game ads is great. I love microtransactions + subscription-based membership + pre order exclusive + in-game ads
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Ecco the Dolphin - Thu, 12 Dec 2019 14:48:50 EST 54vxT9Sx No.747295 Reply
If it's a good game it really doesn't matter

Some games are actually worth buying all the dumb shit for and some ads are like trailers for movies

The problem is they have monkeys on heroin making video games nowadays
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Nodunaga Oda - Thu, 12 Dec 2019 17:20:38 EST lmeASA0D No.747304 Reply
>>747283
If you're gonna shill artists here, can they at least be good ones?
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C-Higgy !lfsExjBfzE - Wed, 22 Jan 2020 02:27:20 EST YnBBDGez No.748576 Reply
>>747295
>The problem is they have monkeys on heroin making video games nowadays

Especially when you factor in all the shit coming out these days about employees at game companies having to suffer through countless hours of crunch because management is so beholden to investors that they can’t scope and plan properly to mitigate against bugs, pivots, and other stuff that makes it worse on the employees not having enough time to take breaks and getting driven into the ground. And itms absolutely going to get worse with this “games as a service” model because game development is becoming more and more expensive but the $60 price point isn’t going to change, which is why you have to sustain the costs with DOC, season passes, microtransactions, etc. Sure makes you realize how shitty of an industry video games can be.
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Slippy Toad - Wed, 22 Jan 2020 04:09:42 EST bHwXQRUd No.748579 Reply
>>748576
>Sure makes you realize how shitty of an industry video games can be.

Everything is shitty chiggister. Every market in the world is moving towards subscription services where you buy in at normal market rates but then have to keep paying in after you've bought in. I'm not an advocate for full on communism but this is late state capitalism. Everything is put through an algorithm that crunches the numbers to generate the most profit for the least labor/material with complete disregard for anything but cold surgical robotic precision. Just wait until the auto insurance companies start forcing you to ride with snapshot type shit, that will be the catalyst that breaks the camels back imo.

>I envision a future where breathing is logged and recorded to the cloudtm which fines you for doing it wrong. Be sure to share a coke!
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Gwyn Lord of Cinder - Wed, 22 Jan 2020 06:13:19 EST UbPUh90C No.748580 Reply
>>748579
>I'm not an advocate for full on communism
Well, that's too bad for you. If you were, you could just fault the programmers for this. Or simply embrace indignation towards the programmers just because.
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Gwyn Lord of Cinder - Wed, 22 Jan 2020 06:25:08 EST UbPUh90C No.748581 Reply
>>736168
>Anyone want to code an open source engine?
There are plenty of open source games, so the engines are quite widely available, though maybe not for particular genres or subgenres/genre combinations. Strikingly enough, games reconized as simple, like platformers, beat em ups and shumps probably are least ahead here.

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