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CZW: 2018 Issues by Road Warrior Animal - Sat, 10 Feb 2018 07:09:39 EST ID:qfX5xSjT No.5965362 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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What the crap happened to this company?

Things look worse now than 2007/2008. At least in 2007/2008 you still had stars like Nick Gage, Brain Damage, Danny Havoc and Drake Younger.

They just seem to have lost all identity and they don't seem to have any stars outside of Matt Tremont.

I wonder what CZW thinks knowing that much of their fanbase left them for GCW and now mock CZW. It's so weird to see guys like Nick Gage and Zandig in GCW. It's especially weird to see Gage talking shit about CZW after calling it home for so many years. Not only does GCW have more deathmatches and bigger deathmatch stars, but they have guys like Matt Riddle and Teddy Hart on their shows from time to time.

What happened to CZW? I want to support them, but they just don't seem to have any buzz. Are they aware that there's no buzz and that other companies are doing CZW better than CZW?
Dave Prazak - Sat, 10 Feb 2018 09:15:46 EST ID:BlrIoG3o No.5965412 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>What the crap happened to this company?
Sami got the book.

He might not be the actual cause (I'm sure he's got something to do with it) but he's publicly going to take the heat for the perceived downturn in CZW. Kind of feels like CZW might just turn into the New Jersey version of Pro Wrestling Revolver / Rockstar Pro. Callihan & the Crists have a gimmick and they've convinced enough indies to let them not only tour with it out but take over the promotions.

CZW has been public about moving away from the deathmatches; I understand it. Times change. And they seem to be embracing the "punk rock party" vibe that Callihan has talked about in interviews, which explains the working relationships/crossover shows with DEFY, Wrestlecircus, SMASH and Freelance Wrestling. That's a Callihan influence. Listen to his Art of Wrestling interview from last year: he thinks DIY punk partnerships and embracing GIF culture are the future of indie wrestling.

There's a certain tier of "super indy" with all the Highspots Network promotions that run the same match ups with the same talents from Lucha Underground and Callihan seems to be the common factor: AAW in Chicago, Joey Ryan's Bar Wrestling, PW Revolver. Once CZW is main evented by Callihan vs Brian Cage, then we'll know the transformation is complete.

It will be interesting to see how WrestleCon shakes out because CZW, Revolver, Impact AND the Supershow will all be using the same headliners. Hell, we're probably not that far off from a CZW vs Impact Twitch show.

Brett Lauderdale was giving CZW shit for the NWA crossover and being so corny about it. The GCW invasion after Cage of Death appears to be a one-off worked shoot that was just meant to build to a Gage - Tremont match

Giancarlo Dittamo - the guy who does all the vignettes for Joey Janela & other GCW talents (the JB to Janela's Matt Hardy) was actually FIRED by DJ Hyde. So DEEJ so no value in tapping into him for Youtube content for his talent. No idea whats going on with the Dub's partnership with Championship Wrestling From Hollywood but DEEJ keeps trying to make the promotion "more mainstream" and reach TV whether its working with Highspots, Billy Corgan or RF Video. CZW will probably try to become a Twitch channel.
Road Warrior Animal - Sat, 10 Feb 2018 09:23:07 EST ID:qfX5xSjT No.5965416 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>The GCW invasion after Cage of Death appears to be a one-off worked shoot that was just meant to build to a Gage - Tremont match

They edited this out of the show.

Idk. Seemed like a shoot to me for that reason. Hard to believe CZW would be the type to go to that detail to convince people it was real.
Attache - Sat, 10 Feb 2018 09:32:44 EST ID:IYrGGiwC No.5965424 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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considering how they've been handling it, it seems at least planned by Gage and friends
if I had to guess they ran it by deej, he said no, they did it anyway
Sabu - Sat, 10 Feb 2018 10:26:01 EST ID:gwvQN9Qs No.5965463 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>CZW has been public about moving away from the deathmatches; I understand it. Times change.
Going away from a USP is pretty much begging to go bankrupt, regardless of the times.
Chuck Palumbo - Sat, 10 Feb 2018 10:45:11 EST ID:bWZ+YR1t No.5965475 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I'm not a huge fan of deathmatch stuff so the new direction of CZW appeals more to me.

GCW come off like fucking clowns in their whole worked shoot thing. Like XPW lite with CZW playing the ECW role.

I don't know where the fuck they came from, but I remember a promotion called Game Changer Wrestling having a show in a barn at a rock festival here and when I went between bands it was the shindiest goddamn thing ever and their website had like 2 or 3 people on it that I'd heard of and the part of the show I saw had a bunch of nobodies.

Then when I heard of them again they were the new hot garbage wrestling promotion with a bunch of deathmatch wrestlers that I was well aware of and their shit was spilling over into Beyond Wrestling. CZW seems to be at least adapting to the times meanwhile GCW doesn't even have their shows on Powerbomb, where I assume they're going, or even a working website. They're like every other ultraviolence based promotion of the early 2000's and who knows how far that will take them.
Andy Douglas - Sat, 10 Feb 2018 22:02:51 EST ID:qfX5xSjT No.5965776 Ignore Report Quick Reply

If you're from the NJ area, that might've been the same company. They've been around since 1999, but I think they got new ownership in 2015 and that's when SMV started putting out more of their shows on DVD and the hype started to build.

I'm honestly not a huge fan of deathmatches either. I can watch them every once in a while, but not all the time. I just think that CZW's niche was deathmatch wrestling. CZW can't do pure wrestling as good as PWG, Beyond, EVOLVE or other companies. They need that niche and there will always be a fanbase for it.

CZW dropping deathmatches would be like CHIKARA dropping comedy in their matches and being like "okay, we're gonna be more sport-based now". The only difference is that CHIKARA can offer great stories, characters and a unique atmosphere while CZW struggles to offer anything worth watching if it's not within the confines of a deathmatch. They're not doing anything that sets them apart from every other wrestling company. They're just another company, and these days, you can't afford to be just another company with so many other great promotions readily available.
Ultimate Spider Jr. - Sat, 10 Feb 2018 23:18:30 EST ID:ISVkPzm7 No.5965797 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Wasn't there an issue with booking Onita not too long ago?
Chase Owens - Sat, 10 Feb 2018 23:54:11 EST ID:BlrIoG3o No.5965819 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>CZW can't do pure wrestling as good as PWG

PWG can't even do "pure wrestling" that well. They do spot fests

CZW puts together better matches
Ladder - Sat, 10 Feb 2018 23:59:52 EST ID:VK6af0zS No.5965821 Ignore Report Quick Reply
mjf and janela?
Andy Douglas - Sun, 11 Feb 2018 00:06:12 EST ID:qfX5xSjT No.5965824 Ignore Report Quick Reply

Pure wrestling doesn't have to be technical masterpieces. Doesn't matter how many flips you do.

I essentially just meant matches without weapons.
Rob Conway - Sun, 11 Feb 2018 01:23:49 EST ID:EnOJ0MtF No.5965851 Ignore Report Quick Reply
spot monkeys
Primo - Tue, 13 Feb 2018 14:14:47 EST ID:BlrIoG3o No.5967825 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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>Ace Delic
>Former Pro-Wrestler 10+ years. CZW/DojoWars Producer.
Machine Jerk - Tue, 13 Feb 2018 14:28:12 EST ID:8tO9PJjx No.5967839 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Onita lives to big league companies like CZW
Beastie - Tue, 13 Feb 2018 14:41:26 EST ID:y8K4pFlL No.5967849 Ignore Report Quick Reply
there was supposed to be a singles match between Tremont and Onita, it turned into a 6 man pretty quick mid match of which CZW apparently knew weeks beforehand but still advertised as a singles match.

I guess some part of this agreement was Onita taking Tremont and Hyde to do an 8 man in Japan but that's just speculation
Kurt Angle - Tue, 13 Feb 2018 14:50:23 EST ID:U28QmYT+ No.5967857 Ignore Report Quick Reply
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CZW is losing its identity, and I don't even mean because they're moving away from ultra violence. They used to have a unique roster, but they are largely booking the same guys everyone else is. I think that's an issue with a lot of indies though, but I think it's a recent issue with CZW.

It was a weird situation. I guess some people thought they were going to get a long singles Onita vs Tremont match, like it was Onita vs Funk 20 years ago, lol. I guess no one noticed it had been over a year since Onita did a singles match. I think CZW was blaming Onita for changing it up on them, but I'll bet the plan from the start was the bait Onita in a singles match and switch it to a multiman cluster fuck. This might have even all been kayfabe. I dunno.

However, who gives a shit? It was obvious to everyone who knows a little bit about Onita that he wasn't going to do a singles match in a tiny arena in the US against a guy who no one in Japan even knows. It's not 199X. Onita can't go like he used to. However, he got all his shit in. The crowd got to see flames, barbed wire, bats, and blood. Onita lit up a cig and drank some beer. The crowd went home happy. The issue was just people bitching on the Internet afterwards. People who probably didn't even watch.
Jerry Lawler - Tue, 13 Feb 2018 14:51:45 EST ID:bWZ+YR1t No.5967859 Ignore Report Quick Reply
I'm not from the NJ area, but this is the event I was talking about. Spring of 2016.

It was straight up shindy mud show trash and I hightailed it out of there to see Ghost.

And I always liked what I saw from CZW that wasn't deathmatches even if it was the high spot heavy indy stuff you see everywhere else.

I agree dropping deathmatches is a bad idea for them, but I think it has a bigger effect when it's not done as often.
Jim Cornette - Tue, 13 Feb 2018 16:05:29 EST ID:0V/yhfUT No.5967935 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>they don't seem to have any stars outside of Matt Tremont.
Are we just not counting Janela & AR Fox?
RSP's goo too. And Claxon, IMO.
Booker T - Tue, 13 Feb 2018 16:14:28 EST ID:MyUeWVBI No.5967948 Ignore Report Quick Reply
When you have had guys like Lio Rush, Shane Strickland, AR Fox, the Dub Boyz, EYFBO, Janela, Gulak, Drake (rip), Swann, Mox, Steenerico, even Sami and his shitty friends coming through CZW, you can't really say pure indy wrestling isn't their thing. Fuck, even Tremont can work without the gimmicks. They haven't been a deathmatch fed since the start of this decade. When they put the belt on a pure deathmatch dude (Gacy), the crowd Roman Reigns'd him because he sucked at everything not involving gimmicks.

It feels like the problem with CZW is they keep stop-starting angles and directions since the book/backstage seems to change every year. Deathmatches aren't as popular as they used to be, and fewer workers are willing to do them, so they lose out on the hardcore mutants too.
Kurt Angle - Tue, 13 Feb 2018 16:40:58 EST ID:U28QmYT+ No.5967979 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>Janela, AR Fox, RSP
You can see these guys anywhere though. And AR Fox hasn't wrestled for CZW since last July.

>Mr. Claxton, RSP
I guess if you have a low enough bar, anyone can be a "star"
Kane - Tue, 13 Feb 2018 17:02:25 EST ID:IYrGGiwC No.5967998 Ignore Report Quick Reply
i will fight you right fucking now if you're talking about the vignettes
Diamond Dallas Page - Tue, 13 Feb 2018 17:11:31 EST ID:9EV4cXpT No.5968009 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Eh, I like CZW and I go to their shows pretty often. Going to continue supporting them because I hope they end up doing well, but I do agree they are beginning to blend in as just another company, as they are booking Ospreay, David Starr, Joey Ryan, and a bunch of other indie stars lately. GCW appears to be just like old CZW, rn.
Barbarian - Tue, 13 Feb 2018 17:38:44 EST ID:VFxhQRCG No.5968035 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Last April through December is probably the best CZW has looked in forever. Then Sami quit after Cage of Death but still had booked Nineteen (which was an awful card) and then DJ was forced to do what he could with it. Now they're going to be forced to use a lot of the Dojo Wars guys, who are ready to be used, but I am sure they don't do a whole lot for most fans.

I'll do a TLDR on GCW and their relationship with CZW

>GCW was originally JCW and got bought by the guy who runs Game Changer World.
>After Zandig came back to CZW, GCW paid him $5000 to ditch CZW and be exclusive to GCW.
>While only drawing 200 people or so for regular shows and sometimes even less with the exception of 400 for their Tournament of Survival, Giancarlo came to DJ with the idea of GCW vs CZW.
>Keep in mind, GCW would always throw jabs whenever possible at CZW and stand outside CZWs shows to pass out flyers. Also GCW does less numbers than CZW. DJ said no numerous times and Brett/Gage showed up at Cage of Death anyways.
Bill Alfonos - Tue, 13 Feb 2018 17:44:28 EST ID:qfX5xSjT No.5968040 Ignore Report Quick Reply

>Then Sami quit after Cage of Death

Where did you hear this?
Disco Inferno - Tue, 13 Feb 2018 19:04:49 EST ID:BlrIoG3o No.5968112 Ignore Report Quick Reply
> Then Sami quit after Cage of Death but still had booked Nineteen (which was an awful card) and then DJ was forced to do what he could with it
why did Sami quit? and who is booking CZW?
how is someone like Janela able to work for both without getting heat?

Is DEEJ supposed the good guy in all of this?
Rene Dupree - Tue, 13 Feb 2018 19:06:13 EST ID:IYrGGiwC No.5968114 Ignore Report Quick Reply
i think you're thinking of Joey quitting after CoD
Crossbones - Wed, 14 Feb 2018 06:56:03 EST ID:0V/yhfUT No.5968522 Ignore Report Quick Reply
Hey now I only watch CoD & ToD and they were pretty good there.
Chii Tomiya - Wed, 14 Feb 2018 13:11:36 EST ID:s4Wd97My No.5968649 Ignore Report Quick Reply

No one brings their A game to a festival. It's just filler shit for people to watch while they get wasted and watch bands. John Thorne brought this up on his podcast. AIW ran a show for Warped Tour but he only brought students because getting them experience was the most valuable thing he could have gotten. You're not gonna get a bunch of people into your indie promotion during a festival. People like you that see it, dislike it, retain the memory, and regurgitate it in a weird vitrolic fashion are an anomaly. Not really worst busting ass at a festival for the one you in the crowd when most people there are content to not give a shit about the wresting at a music festival.
Bobby The Brain Heenan - Wed, 14 Feb 2018 13:23:41 EST ID:r7QqZ2U/ No.5968655 Ignore Report Quick Reply
joey janela quit? he just worked the anniversary show (and CZW is debuting in his hometown of Asbury next week)
Jim Ross - Wed, 14 Feb 2018 14:08:47 EST ID:VK6af0zS No.5968685 Ignore Report Quick Reply
NO i like them
>sami quit
he was literally on the last show
Rene Dupree - Wed, 14 Feb 2018 14:56:43 EST ID:IYrGGiwC No.5968707 Ignore Report Quick Reply
it was part of the father tremont feud from cod 2016
Kurt Angle - Sat, 17 Feb 2018 06:05:08 EST ID:aBWCOlex No.5970253 Ignore Report Quick Reply
>shit wrestling isn't shit wrestling because they're not even trying

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